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Discussion Starter #1
David Ferrer should have his best shot at a grand slam in RG, but this just hasnt been the case in his career. Even when he has produced excellent results on clay like in 2010-2011 he just disappears from the radar in RG, no one even mentions him and his early round exits dont come as no surprise to anyone. Still we are talking about a top 5 claycourter who has been top 5 on the surface for 6-7 years!

Even fricking Monfils produce greater results than him in RG, something very strange is going on with Ferrer and what should be the highlight of his calendar year. Is it mental? Is it best of 5 format which is too much for Ferrer after a long clay season? Unlucky draws?

Anyway, here is his results in RG last years:

2011: Lost 4th round to Monfils
2010: Lost 3rd round to Melzer
2009: Lost 3rd round to Soderling
2008: Lost QF to Monfils
2007: Lost 3rd round to Verdasco
2006: Lost 3rd round to Hidalgo
2005: Lost QF to Nadal

Not a single SF in what should be his favorite Grand slam? He hasnt even faced the top 4 since 2005, he often gets into long 5 set battles against players he should beat easily like Hewitt, Stepanek and Kiefer in early rounds.

Is it a problem for Ferrer to have a game where he cant dominate opponents but needs to grind it out for long matches in early rounds and later he loses energy in 3rd/4th round? I think of greater claycourters like Muster and Coria who also had problems with RG and their achievments there did not correspond to their domination of smaller clay tournaments.
 

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Forum Umpire:, Gaston Gaudio,
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No, he feels the most pressure to succeed at RG and this inhibits him. This is something Ferrer has said himself.Whereas at the US Open and Aus Open, he is more realistic about his chances and less pressure to do well at these Slams, therefore he has had better results.

You think wrong when it comes to Muster he won RG. It was only 2 years when he was the best on clay.

So the OP gets it. Muster hated playing serve/volleyers on any surface and yes they could do well on clay then with big serving days. He lost to Sampras, Rafter and Stich at RG, that thing called match ups.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Fastest claycourt and he has faced bighitters like Monfils and Soda..
Monfils is no big hitter, that must be a joke?

Ferrer has done better in Rome where he reached a final and semifinal, that tournament is faster than RG.
 

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Forum Umpire:, Gaston Gaudio,
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Maybe not like Delpo, Soda, Tsonga but Monfils can hit through Ferrer obviously and serve pretty Big.
Monfils has a 3-0 H2H with Ferrer as well. Ferrer doesn't have the variety to get Monfils off balance or heaviness of strokes, plus Monfils love running as well.
 

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Pics is a little guy. I really like him but he simply can't fight with big guys. He tries so hard. I have always had so much respect for him. so RG or any other big tournaments he can't really make it. he is still a great player, love him.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
No, he feels the most pressure to succeed at RG and this inhibits him. This is something Ferrer has said himself.Whereas at the US Open and Aus Open, he is more realistic about his chances and less pressure to do well at these Slams, therefore he has had better results.

You think wrong when it comes to Muster he won RG. It was only 2 years when he was the best on clay.

So the OP gets it. Muster hated playing serve/volleyers on any surface and yes they could do well on clay then with big serving days. He lost to Sampras, Rafter and Stich at RG, that thing called match ups.
Well, we all know Muster didnt like playing serve and volleyers but the fact that he played a 5 setter against Agassi prior to beeing defeated by Rafter 94 or a 5 setter against Melligeni before losing to Mantilla 97 must still be taken into consideration, because a grinder like Muster did spend alot of energy to win those 5 setters against other grinders and it is difficult to have energy to grind out match after match in best of 5 format.
 

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Forum Umpire:, Gaston Gaudio,
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Player A is better than Player B. Player B is better than C, therefore it must mean Player A is better than C.

There are always different independent circumstances that come together, some can be controlled and others not.

Monfils for the most parts excels at RG.
 

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I guess it's also a gruelling stretch for him; trying to rack up points on clay. Last year he didn't play in Rome, but played the week after in Nice (right before RG) and lost to Dolgo in the QF. If he was too injured for Rome then why play the week between Rome and RG?

Other years too, just a lot of tournaments, usually losing in finals or semis to Nadal. Maybe he's just used up by the time RG rolls around. :shrug: He should plan better (like the other top guys do) to peak for the GS, but he seems to like to push himself to the limit.
 

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I guess it's also a gruelling stretch for him; trying to rack up points on clay. Last year he didn't play in Rome, but played the week after in Nice (right before RG) and lost to Dolgo in the QF. If he was too injured for Rome then why play the week between Rome and RG?

Other years too, just a lot of tournaments, usually losing in finals or semis to Nadal. Maybe he's just used up by the time RG rolls around. :shrug: He should plan better (like the other top guys do) to peak for the GS, but he seems to like to push himself to the limit.
this.....
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Player A is better than Player B. Player B is better than C, therefore it must mean Player A is better than C.

There are always different independent circumstances that come together, some can be controlled and others not.

Monfils for the most parts excels at RG.
Yes, bu this thread is all about detecting all those "independent circumstances that come together" to understand why Ferrer just cant get things together in this tournament. If we look at each loss:

Monfils df Ferrer 4-6, 6-2, 5-7, 6-1, 6-8

This match was all on Ferrer's hand, he was outplaying Monfils completely in 2 sets and the 3 other sets were close with alot of breaks, why did he lose all the close sets to a mental midget like Monfils? Ofcourse Monfils is mentally stronger in RG with the crowd and free room for acting out and taking center stage of a circus, Ferrer is a quiet guy who likes to just do his thing but crowd maybe got to him, Monfils maybe got to him in this match.

Melzer df Ferrer 4-6, 0-6, 6-7(1)

This match Ferrer was just blown away against a player who is down 2-5 against him h2h. Very strange how Ferrer can dominate Melzer completely on clay and has played him on 4 other occasions without losing a set and here he cant win a set? Clearly mental issues again by Ferrer. Ferrer was in great, great form this year and was destroying opponents in early rounds.

Soderling df Ferrer 7-6(5), 5-7, 2-6, 6-7(5)

Not much to say here because Soderling was in great form and is a bad matchup for Ferrer, but note that Ferrer choked in the 4th set and also he had for some reason stuck in 5 sets against bloody Kiefer in the 3rd round that might have affected his energy level.

Monfils df Ferrer 3-6, 6-3, 3-6, 1-6

Once again losing to Monfils, I didnt see this match so I dont know how it played out. Anyway Ferrer had just played 2 straight 5 setters against Hewitt and Stepanek prior to this match and must have ran out of steam to beat the forever running, grinding and sliding Monfils on clay. Question is why he went to 5 sets against Hewitt on clay, or even Stepanek?

Verdasco df Ferrer 6-4, 6-7(2), 3-6, 3-6

Ferrer should grind out against a mentally weak player like Verdasco in best of 5 on clay, I dont know why he had problems against Verdasco. His tactics might not have been spot on to beat Verdasco before, I belive he has figured him out by now.

Hidalgo df Ferrer 6-7(4), 5-7, 4-6


Simply incredible, Ferrer should defeat these lesser claycourters 2, 2 and 3! Hidalgo is not better at anything against Ferrer, he should not be able to straight set Ferrer.

Rafael Nadal 5-7, 2-6, 0-6

This one I remember, Ferrer was really dominating young Nadal in 1st set and had prior played one hell of a match in Rome where he lost 5-7 in 3rd set. Clearly last match before Ferrer got Nadal in his head because what happened after mega choking by Ferrer in 1st set losing 2 set points serving for the set, he mentally collapsed. Nadal saved something like 12 out of 14 break points and was just breaking Ferrer down completely in the mental department.

Ferrer had won against Gaudio the round before in 5 sets so some physical fatigue might have followed the mental collapse, but I dont blame Ferrer for going 5 sets against a good claycourter like Gaudio or breaking down mentally against Nadal. He was not the first or last great player to have mentally been abused by Nadal on clay. Ferrer's loss against Nadal and Soderling are both understandable but other years he has wasted oppurtunities at the slam which is his best shot for greatness.
 

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Ferrer has no extra gear. He always plays good, but never has one of those really special performances. It's his biggest strength and greatest weakness. At slams he usually runs into someone who catches fire and takes him out.
 
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It's probably not the type of clay court that suits his game :shrug:.
 

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The Monfils loss at RG QF 2008 was the worst. Federer was playing shit, and had he got past Gael he could have threatened Roger. Also a wasten chance was his R3 defeat to Melzer in 2010, considering his great form prior to the event. Last years loss wasn't so surprising, he lost to Dolgo the week before, and wouldn't had any chsnce against Federer on QF.
 

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RG tends to play a bit differently than other clay tournaments. A bit faster meaning Ferrer get less time for his very good returns. A bit higher bouncing meaning top spin gets more bite.

When playing guys much taller and more powerful han himself like he's often done in RG then he will find himself pushed back and having to play many shots at shoulder height which even from Ferrer leads to more errors.

His serve also can't take advantage in RG unlike guys like Monfils, Soderling,Verdasco who got more power. Also Melzer who is a very skilled doubles player and knows how to use his serve for max efficiency had a clear advantage.

To put it simple: Ferrer does not have anything in his own hands. If a skilled powerful offensive player knows their stuff and keeps the nerves in check they win. If they slip up Ferrer can win. But Ferrer will rarely face chokers, injured players etc more than maybe once late in RG and he needs a stretch of R4-QF-SF where players fail vs him. He doesn't have much weapons but barely any weakness either. Still not enough when facing in-form players that aren't intimitated by his very consistent and grinding style.
 

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The Monfils loss at RG QF 2008 was the worst. Federer was playing shit, and had he got past Gael he could have threatened Roger. Also a wasten chance was his R3 defeat to Melzer in 2010, considering his great form prior to the event. Last years loss wasn't so surprising, he lost to Dolgo the week before, and wouldn't had any chsnce against Federer on QF.
H2H

Federer - Ferrer 12-0

Federer can't play shit enough for Ferrer to beat him. I've seen Roger play terrible tennis and Ferrer brilliant tennis many times leading up to their matches, but when they meet it's always a routine job.
 

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David Ferrer should have his best shot at a grand slam in RG, but this just hasnt been the case in his career. Even when he has produced excellent results on clay like in 2010-2011 he just disappears from the radar in RG, no one even mentions him and his early round exits dont come as no surprise to anyone. Still we are talking about a top 5 claycourter who has been top 5 on the surface for 6-7 years!



Anyway, here is his results in RG last years:

2011: Lost 4th round to Monfils
2010: Lost 3rd round to Melzer
2009: Lost 3rd round to Soderling
2008: Lost QF to Monfils
2007: Lost 3rd round to Verdasco
2006: Lost 3rd round to Hidalgo
2005: Lost QF to Nadal
Why should he have done better? You went as far back as 2005, but if you look at Ferrer's results in clay masters prior to 2010 he's got only 1 SF in Rome 2005 and a dozen QFs in Hamburg and Monte Carlo.
And those are the good stuff. Look at his results in Rome from 2006 to 2009. 4 years in a row he lost in his first match. Why someone that couldn't win a match in Rome for half decade be a favourite for a RG SF?
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Why should he have done better? You went as far back as 2005, but if you look at Ferrer's results in clay masters prior to 2010 he's got only 1 SF in Rome 2005 and a dozen QFs in Hamburg and Monte Carlo.
Well that is halftruth, look at his performance in Monte Carlo 2005-2011:

2005:Q
2006:Q
2007:Q
2008:Q
2009:R16
2010:SF
2011:F

Now look at whom he lost to:

2005:Coria
2006:Federer
2007:Federer
2008:Nadal
2009:Verdasco
2010:Nadal
2011:Nadal

Not much you can do getting these kind of draws, Ferrer got to QF or further on clay master series 14 times and lost there on to:

4 times to Federer
5 times to Nadal
2 times to Coria
1 time to Djokovic
1 time to Robredo
1 time to Davydenko

Nothing shameful about his results on claycourt master series if you ask me, he just got an inability to beat Federer and Nadal on clay, he has beaten Djokovic and Murray plenty of times on clay.
 
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