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What bothers Rafa most at indoors?

  • Serve is better, thanks to conditions

    Votes: 13 32.5%
  • lower bounce

    Votes: 24 60.0%
  • quick courts

    Votes: 13 32.5%
  • Rafa can´t benefit from indoor conditions as match as others

    Votes: 13 32.5%
  • Rafa can handle outdoor conditions pretty good, indoor this advantage is gone

    Votes: 16 40.0%
  • He is tired after long season

    Votes: 18 45.0%
  • other-specify

    Votes: 4 10.0%
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Discussion Starter #1
I´ve been thinking about this long time and what do you think it is why Rafa is not so succesfull indoor like on clay, grass and outdoor HC. I think it is because of conditions. Indoors just other players - or majority of other good players became better, Rafa can´t benefit from indoor conditions like other top players.

1. Indoor serve is better, because of no wind and sun, Rafa can´t benefit much from this, because his own serve is average. But other guys can benefit from this. Nice example is Soderling - with high toss in windy conditions it is hard for him to serve at 100%, indoors he can toss 2m the ball still no wind and can hit 220km/h.

2. Than generally indoor courts have lower bounce than outdoor courts, except of grass. So generally Rafa´s topspin is getting less effective

3. Indoor courts are generally quicker than outdoor, and Rafa like slow game. Guys like Davydenko can play fast and Rafa is in trouble, no time for his timing-positioning and right execution of groundstrokes

4. We can see that indoor HC is now getting slower just like outdoor HC, but still, because of conditions, it is not important if it is quick carpet or slow indoor HC, still you feel Rafa can´t play his game. I think those conditions are just what makes other players with weapons better, Rafa can´t benefit from indoor conditions

5. Rafa can handle outdoor conditions pretty good. I would say better than 90% of other players. He can play great in windy conditions and sun is also no problem or hot sunny day, he can play 5hours under heating sun, not anyone can do it physically.

6. Rafa is probably tired after long season during indoor season in October-November, but other top players should be tired too no?

What do you think what bothers Rafa mostly indoors? Maybe something else, but i think those reasons are all good and part of the reason Rafa is by far worst indoor- that doesn´t mean he is bad- he is good indoor player, but simply you can feel he has outdoor on any surface by far bigger chances.
 

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Rafa is a lion who should proudly parade outside in the sun showing off his greatness. You don't cage a lion.
 

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he is probably the most adaptable player on the tour and playing indoors it's the same for everybody + lower bounce = nadal fucked
 

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Low bounce reduces the damage his top spin forehand can do to right handers backhands.
 

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If we are talking Yea end indoors,, I think thats precisely why.. Because its the year end. Nadal historically hibernates after October because he expends so much energy from January to October he has nothing much left after that in the tank.. Last year was the year he actually DID have something in the tank.
 

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His opponents make fewer unforced errors indoors because the bounce of his shots is lower and more predictable. So they can take bigger risks and put Nadal on the defense more often.
 

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Federer

if it wasnt for him he would have won a couple of TMCs which would have made his indoor achievements respectable
 

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Its obviously the combination of many things. He isn't always fresh (but sometimes he is). Historically the court eats his bounce, which takes away his primary point construction method. The indoor conditions allow opposing ballbashers an easier time to find their rhythm, and his weaknesses are amplified (lack of a great return, lack of a dominant flat shot, not a huge serve etc)
 

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His underwear stuck in his ass. Same as outdoors.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Its obviously the combination of many things. He isn't always fresh (but sometimes he is). Historically the court eats his bounce, which takes away his primary point construction method. The indoor conditions allow opposing ballbashers an easier time to find their rhythm, and his weaknesses are amplified (lack of a great return, lack of a dominant flat shot, not a huge serve etc)
I find it interresting that Rafa is from top players almost alone or one of very few players that indoor can´t benefit from those ,,even,, conditions. Big hitters like Tsonga, Berdych, Soderling can benefit from indoors. Delpo not- he is too tall and low bounce is not good from him either. But besides those players with big serve, agressive game also baseliners can benefit - guys like Davydenko, Nalbandian, in the past- they play their game with no liabialities, and can benefit from indoor conditions too, also Murray, Roger almost everyone except Rafa:D
 

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Irregularities from wind and irregular surface bounce means alot to Nadal. If your opponent cant predict how Nadal's spin will bounce they cant step in and take the ball on the rise and instead they have until the ball is above shoulder level.

If you count in lower bounces and faster courts you get a full picture of what problems Nadal faces indoors.
 

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I think Nadal CAN play indoors obviously. Granted, hes no Boris Becker but Look at last year when he was healthy.. Got to the finals and was one set away from beating Rog. Again with the YEC, that more or less to do with the form, level, health, Rafa is in by the end of the year.

Outside of last year, I don't remember where Nadal was reasonably close to top level at the time. If we had a "Mid Season finals" then I think Nadal already has a few big ones to his resume. Again, Nadal pretty much calls it a season after the USO historically and if he does compete after, his level has generally been many levels below where he was during during Jan-Oct
 

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Low bounce.
 

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It's not necessarily the lower bounce (well, London, yes), but more than that, it's the fact he doesn't generate the same amount of spin on indoor courts. His balls don't have the same tork off the surface. So therefore, his shots end up being more flat, and bouncing less high, making it easier to attack him. He also definitely doesn't defend as well indoors, it's harder to play that defensive game on indoor courts such as London.
 
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