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When it comes to French Open - Thiem has had his ass kicked for a good while and we all know that. But when you look at the numbers its even more worrying.

The sets against Thiem by the event winner: 6-2 6-2 6-3 6-2 6-1 6-4 6-3 6-4 6-0 6-4 6-3 6-2 6-3 5-7 6-1 6-1

Shocking numbers. That is 15 sets lost and 1 set won. Average games won per set: 2,625.
 

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Thiem is a guy that does everything right- conditioning, fitness etc.

He even has profound creative talents out there.

The sad truth though is that you have to be a monster to win a slam today- ie if he was 6'4 with Kyrgios' serve added to all of his current strengths, then he'd be favourite.

He can still win, but it will be precarious and very close.
 

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Umbrella and alot are cut from the same cloth. Dull fanboys who are so insecure that they need to constantly downgrade Dominic because they are so afraid he will kick their idol’s butt in June.
Yes, dudes, this year he’s finally coming for the topspin bot from Manacor.
He would have defeated him already last year if not gassed in last two sets due to unjust and idiotic scheduling by RG officials.
 

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i like him but i also need rafa to get to 20 slams just for the utter meltdown of the fedtards, so domi can win RG next year.
 

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In all fairness, Thiem defeated 4-time finalist, Djokovic, twice in RG. The rest of the numbers were from the matches against the undisputed clay GOAT.

No player pushed Rafa to 5 sets in an RG final. Federer played 4 finals against Rafa, Djokovic played 2 finals against Rafa, and both Federer and Djokovic could not win more than a set in 6 RG finals. Thiem won a set in his 2nd final against Rafa in the 2019 RG final.

By the time he reaches semifinal and final in RG, Rafa, who is already a monster, becomes an even bigger monster.
 

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The British statesman George Canning once famously said: "I can prove anything by statistics except the truth."

I don't quite agree with Canning. If used correctly, statistics can be a powerful tool to understand things. Still, Canning has a point, as statistics can be deceptive.

I remember a match in Rome many years ago, in one of the early rounds. Nadal started off playing well, but his opponent was unusually tough. However, after a few really long games during the first 20-30 minutes, where Nadal had to save multiple breakpoints, the opponent was worn down mentally. Eventually, Rafa cruised to victory, like so many times before on clay, winning 6-1, 6-0. Not unexpectedly, he went on to win the tournament, comfortably beating Nole 2-0 in the final.

When RG comes the same year, in the fourth round Nadal faces the opponent he defeated so convincingly in Rome just a few weeks ago, on the same surface no less. As you may have guessed, the year we are talking about is 2009, and we all know what happened.

My point is simply that the scoreline often looks quite one-sided on clay, as it is easier to break serve. This does not mean that a losing player will be defeated as easily in future encounters. A player that improves will have his chances to turn things around, particularly if his opponent is not getting any younger.
 

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By the way, can someone calculate how many games Nishikori has won against Djokovic in a set on average since the '14 U.S. Open? I can't be bothered as I'm busy, so I'd appreciate it.
 
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As the British statesman George Canning once famously said: "I can prove anything by statistics except the truth."

I don't quite agree with Canning. If used correctly, statistics can be a powerful tool to understand things. Still, Canning has a point, as statistics can be deceptive.

I remember a match in Rome many years ago, in one of the early rounds. Nadal started off playing well, but his opponent was unusually tough. However, after a few really long games during the first 20-30 minutes, where Nadal had to save multiple breakpoints, the opponent was worn down mentally. Eventually, Rafa cruised to victory, as so many times before on clay, winning 6-1, 6-0. Not unexpectedly, he went on to win the tournament, comfortably beating Nole 2-0 in the final.

When RG comes the same year, in the fourth round Nadal faces the opponent he defeated so convincingly in Rome just a few weeks ago, on the same surface no less. As you may have guessed, the year we are talking about is 2009, and we all know what happened.

My point is simply that the scoreline often looks quite one-sided on clay, as it is easier to break serve. This does not mean that a losing player will be defeated as easily in future encounters. A player that improves will have his chances to turn things around, particularly if his opponent is not getting any younger.
Thank you, Henrik. This is a fantastic post. I still have tears in my eyes when I recall that famous Soderking’s roast of the topspin bot.
 

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The British statesman George Canning once famously said: "I can prove anything by statistics except the truth."

I don't quite agree with Canning. If used correctly, statistics can be a powerful tool to understand things. Still, Canning has a point, as statistics can be deceptive.

I remember a match in Rome many years ago, in one of the early rounds. Nadal started off playing well, but his opponent was unusually tough. However, after a few really long games during the first 20-30 minutes, where Nadal had to save multiple breakpoints, the opponent was worn down mentally. Eventually, Rafa cruised to victory, like so many times before on clay, winning 6-1, 6-0. Not unexpectedly, he went on to win the tournament, comfortably beating Nole 2-0 in the final.

When RG comes the same year, in the fourth round Nadal faces the opponent he defeated so convincingly in Rome just a few weeks ago, on the same surface no less. As you may have guessed, the year we are talking about is 2009, and we all know what happened.

My point is simply that the scoreline often looks quite one-sided on clay, as it is easier to break serve. This does not mean that a losing player will be defeated as easily in future encounters. A player that improves will have his chances to turn things around, particularly if his opponent is not getting any younger.
The key point is that 6-1 6-0 wasn't nearly as one-sided as the scoreline makes it look, particularly the first set was one of the closest breadstick you'll ever see, Nadal just saved all BPs. Thiem though really surrendered without much fight every time.
 

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The key point is that 6-1 6-0 wasn't nearly as one-sided as the scoreline makes it look, particularly the first set was one of the closest breadstick you'll ever see, Nadal just saved all BPs. Thiem though really surrendered without much fight every time.
It’s not true that Dominic surrendered without the fight last time in 2019 final. First two sets they went toe to toe and and split them. The last two sets were lopsided by the scoreline because Dominic was gassed but even in these sets Dominic had many BP-s on Nadal’s serve.
 

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By the way, can someone calculate how many games Nishikori has won against Djokovic in a set on average since the '14 U.S. Open? I can't be bothered as I'm busy, so I'd appreciate it.
Fun stats indeed.
0-15 in matches, 33-5 in sets, 25 of 33 sets won losing 3 games max.

Breaking down by surface highlights further difference, because on clay+grass it was at least somewhat competitive but HC has been abject dominance by Djoe since that amazing loss. To wit:

Clay+grass: Djokovic 6-0 matches, 13-4 sets, 91-67 games. Almost 4 games on average for Kei (~3,94).
Hardcourt: Djokovic 9-0 matches, 20-1 in sets, 122-50 in games. Not even 2,5 games on average (~2,38). Disgusting!
 

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Thiem was obviously way too young in 2014 and 2016 for those to have any meaning, in 2016 he was pushed into the semi because the tournament was godawful. Goffin was next best in line. Then a severely declined Tsonga.

2017-2019 he lost big, but so did everyone else against Nadal, and hey, he took a set in 2019 before tiring out.
 
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Thiem was obviously way too young in 2014 and 2016 for those to have any meaning, in 2016 he was pushed into the semi because the tournament was godawful. Goffin was next best in line. Then a severely declined Tsonga.

2017-2019 he lost big, but so did everyone else against Nadal, and hey, he took a set in 2019 before tiring out.
He took set/ OK! But Nadal play in 1st set very nervous...
 

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When it comes to French Open - Thiem has had his ass kicked for a good while and we all know that. But when you look at the numbers its even more worrying.

The sets against Thiem by the event winner: 6-2 6-2 6-3 6-2 6-1 6-4 6-3 6-4 6-0 6-4 6-3 6-2 6-3 5-7 6-1 6-1

Shocking numbers. That is 15 sets lost and 1 set won. Average games won per set: 2,625.
5-7 , so you are telling me there is a chance.
 

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Umbrella and alot are cut from the same cloth. Dull fanboys who are so insecure that they need to constantly downgrade Dominic because they are so afraid he will kick their idol’s butt in June.
Yes, dudes, this year he’s finally coming for the topspin bot from Manacor.
He would have defeated him already last year if not gassed in last two sets due to unjust and idiotic scheduling by RG officials.
I've been on the record for a while saying Thiem is going to win RG. Perhaps this year but surely next year at the latest. For me he has come closer every year and he has a win over Rafa every year since 16 on clay, of course, all of them away from RG.

Nadal is a beast as it is but once he steps on that PC court, he becomes even more of a monster.

But RG is very far away. I am not looking past Acapulco/Dubai. Plenty to be gained every week going forward all season because the #1 is up for grabs basically every tournament
 

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Discussion Starter #20
If Schwartzman wins it all this stat will look much better for Thiem - who has been contenders punching bag for so long.


But he wont.
 
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