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justice for all
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This is all heartbreaking but the truth is there are no simple answers to Catalan crisis...

Blind people think that they are fighting for independence, but they are actually pursuing the particular interests of the rebels' interest group against a democratic and free state. It's a modern war and it's a shame for those manipulated people ... on the other hand, there are a lot of anarchists, communists as well as ordinary hooligans and thieves, taking advantage of the situation to fight the police a bit, paint sickles and hammers on the walls and go fishing in robbed shops ...

And demonstrations in support of the unity of Spain are present throughout the region. Yes, several hundred manipulators and tens of thousands of separatists destroy the peaceful existence of millions.

One could write for a long time about the complicated relations of national and regional and local identities in Spain, but the facts are what they are for all who have the so-called open mind.

Evidence and facts are available on the Internet, unfortunately there is also a plethora of fake news and gross propaganda for the "uninformed".

I recommend looking for sources and facts, not to swallow media slurry and support truth and law.
 

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This conflict is an consequence of bad decisions and mistakes made by Spanish politicians. At first they pretend they didn't hear the Catalans and ignored them, then when the things started to get out of their control, they used the brutal power to solve it. And now Spanish Court jailed Catalan politics, this just make it more difficult to make peace, Catalans will have it in their memory for a long time.
Catalans independence claims started long, long time ago, including wars with Spain, not like Basques. They have their culture, language, history. So I'm not surprised they're still thinking about it.
I think Spanish Parliament should have allowed the referendum, like British people were allowed to vote for Brexit. But it should be preceded by long talks, expert discusses about its consequences, because as we could see Great Britain wasn't prepared for Brexit.
You could not agree with about half of Catalans, who are pro-independence, that they're nationalist, that they're only thinking about their freedom, but they have a right to do it and have a choice.

This situation is just going nowhere, a lot of Catalans treat Spain like a oppressor, and Spain treats them like a misbehaving child. Considering how the things turned out, it will be very tough for a solution for the future. I think the good start would be to pardon those jailed Catalan politics to make extreme tensions lower.

That is exactly what it is, old plain tribal ethnic nationalism of exactly the same kind you suffered in YU and Europe has suffered so much in the not so distant past. Or what we see now in Ukraine.
:help:

Putin annexed parts of Ukraine. It's a completely different story...
Breakup of Yugoslavia was inevitable as communism was weakening in Eastern Europe. It's a shame it ended with a war, not more peacefully like in other countries in a central and eastern Europe.
 

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Catalans independence claims started long, long time ago, including wars with Spain,
There has never been a war between Catalonia and Spain. It's an ontological impossible, since Catalonia has always been part of Spain since Spain exists.

Putin annexed parts of Ukraine. It's a completely different story....
Not really that different. Putin annexed Crimea yesterday, so to say, while the Donbass etno-tribal conflict started much earlier. Former USSR disintegration gave place to many etno-tribal nationalistic wars (Nagorno-Karabaj, North Osetia, Abjasia, Adjaria, Transdnistria, Fergana, etc...) All those wars were cooked up by years of previous hatred campaigns between two communities.
 

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There has never been a war between Catalonia and Spain. It's an ontological impossible, since Catalonia has always been part of Spain since Spain exists.



Not really that different. Putin annexed Crimea yesterday, so to say, while the Donbass etno-tribal conflict started much earlier. Former USSR disintegration gave place to many etno-tribal nationalistic wars (Nagorno-Karabaj, North Osetia, Abjasia, Adjaria, Transdnistria, Fergana, etc...) All those wars were cooked up by years of previous hatred campaigns between two communities.
The basic difference is that Catalonia isn't annexed or isn't military supported by other country outside of Spain.
This makes those cases not comparable.
 

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The basic difference is that Catalonia isn't annexed or isn't military supported by other country outside of Spain.
This makes those cases not comparable.
There are many differences but the root phenomenum is the same: etno-tribal nationalism and its unlimited destructive potential.

Main difference is that Spain, and hence Catalonia, is a free advanced democracy. If it weren't all this crap would have been forcefully crushed already, and in that case any outside support would only spark a conflict with that outside power.

One really has to be very naive to believe Spain would give away what's been a substantial part of its territory since it exists (and that's many centuries) just because a couple of million people so demand in full disregard of not only Spanish but International Law.
 

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And tell me this.....

Are The Professor and his gang still causing havoc in Spain?
 
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