Mens Tennis Forums banner

41 - 60 of 63 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
266 Posts
That match with Medvedev was actually not that great. Though he had a good moments, he wasted his opportunities, and didn't capitalize on a tired Meddy and one who was serving at a meager 47% the whole match. Not taking a set against that Medvedev is a big chance wasted.
That's the story of his carrier, blowing his chances.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
240 Posts
I started watching tennis in 2014 and the narrative among commentators was that the change of the guard by those three is just around the corner. I actually believed that at least in regards to Kei, whose game was really impressive to me. Of course, then the dreaded Madrid 2014 final came and the whole thing didn't pan out the way it should have. Turns out, 2014 was the peak for all 3 with one or two small spells after that.




He does. Unfortunately, he always just falls short of what's required. The curse of GU...
Yes I remember that time... on this forum many people were pretending that « tennis had changed » and « players peak later « even though they had absolutely nothing to back those claims - the only late bloomer at the time ben Wawrinka, who clearly was an exception as he was older than 3 of the Big 4.
As it turned out this was complete bs, they peaked around 23-26 just like every other generation. I expect nothing different from Next Gen.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,268 Posts
Discussion Starter #43
Only you cares about these useless stats (since you enjoy the word useless).
Plenty of threads out there to participate in.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,984 Posts
Nishikori, Goffin, Raonic are not ever winning slams - they have too many flaws in their games to do it (and physical issues with Kei as well). Dimitrov does have the game I think, but still likely won't do it - all the close losses against big3 did their damage.
If we are going to talk about physical issues with Kei, then we have to about Raonic as well - he has probably been sidelined to a greater extent. A shame. I really think he could have every bit as good a chance as the others. He is so hated on around here, but when uninjured and playing well - he has a game to be feared - a serve better than anyone not named Isner (Karlovic as well, but meh...), a massive forehand and solid net game. When injuries weren't sidelining him, he was moving quite well for his size and backhand was improving. We have seen glimpses of his game coming through, only to get sidelined by injury every time he is looking dangerous again.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,268 Posts
Discussion Starter #46
What exactly is arbitrary about five year spans? It's not only applied to Generation useless.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,551 Posts
Before Stan Wawrinka it was David Ferrer who peaked late in his early thirties. Later we had Kevin Anderson. I think Dominic Thiem will have his best years from 26 to 30, Kei and Milos are not good examples as both are constantly injured.
Yes I remember that time... on this forum many people were pretending that « tennis had changed » and « players peak later « even though they had absolutely nothing to back those claims - the only late bloomer at the time ben Wawrinka, who clearly was an exception as he was older than 3 of the Big 4.
As it turned out this was complete bs, they peaked around 23-26 just like every other generation. I expect nothing different from Next Gen.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,984 Posts
What exactly is arbitrary about five year spans? It's not only applied to Generation useless.
Its all very arbitrary - who decides when the five years spans start, and why. Players form one 'generation' can be closer in age to a player from another 'generation'. I just never understood the obsession with it. This isn't a criticism of the thread - good discussions about Kei, Milos and Grigor, but rather the grouping of players into these categories, eg. 'where does Theim fit?'.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
266 Posts
Its all very arbitrary - who decides when the five years spans start, and why. Players form one 'generation' can be closer in age to a player from another 'generation'. I just never understood the obsession with it. This isn't a criticism of the thread - good discussions about Kei, Milos and Grigor, but rather the grouping of players into these categories, eg. 'where does Theim fit?'.
Yeh...Let's put Domi in a group with Felix and Stefanos. Apparently he at 26 is closer to them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
266 Posts
I feel very sorry for the people who speak about these wonderful tennis players and human beeings as lost and even useless. Do you have a clue what they have made for the sport in their countries? Do you know what impact they have made for tennis? How much popular have become this sport in their countries? It's a shame what I read here.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,268 Posts
Discussion Starter #54
Its all very arbitrary - who decides when the five years spans start, and why.
It works well for most players. 5 years will have Sampras and Agassi in one generation, Wilander, Becker and Edberg in another, Lendl and McEnroe in another. Kuerten and Kafelnikov in another. Fed/Roddick/Hewitt in another.

I think it works well for Thiem in with Kei and Milos. Thiem's development curve is not far off from theirs.

There are players that don't fit well into the overall scheme. Where does Verdasco fit? I've had him with Nadal, but lately I think he fits in better with Fed et al. Where does Haas fit? I had him with Fed, but I think he fits better with Kuerten/Kafelnikov.

Thiem is a boundary player, but he's done nothing to really demonstrate why he's an awkward fit for Generation useless. If he starts winning slams and having rivalries with Tsitsipas et al, sure. But we haven't seen that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,632 Posts
It works well for most players. 5 years will have Sampras and Agassi in one generation, Wilander, Becker and Edberg in another, Lendl and McEnroe in another. Kuerten and Kafelnikov in another. Fed/Roddick/Hewitt in another.

I think it works well for Thiem in with Kei and Milos. Thiem's development curve is not far off from theirs.

There are players that don't fit well into the overall scheme. Where does Verdasco fit? I've had him with Nadal, but lately I think he fits in better with Fed et al. Where does Haas fit? I had him with Fed, but I think he fits better with Kuerten/Kafelnikov.

Thiem is a boundary player, but he's done nothing to really demonstrate why he's an awkward fit for Generation useless. If he starts winning slams and having rivalries with Tsitsipas et al, sure. But we haven't seen that.
Would be funny (and sad) if - in a true GU fashion - Thiem fell just short of RG this year again - and got eclipsed by NG the next. Does NG have any clay prodigies though?

If we are going to talk about physical issues with Kei, then we have to about Raonic as well - he has probably been sidelined to a greater extent. A shame. I really think he could have every bit as good a chance as the others. He is so hated on around here, but when uninjured and playing well - he has a game to be feared - a serve better than anyone not named Isner (Karlovic as well, but meh...), a massive forehand and solid net game. When injuries weren't sidelining him, he was moving quite well for his size and backhand was improving. We have seen glimpses of his game coming through, only to get sidelined by injury every time he is looking dangerous again.
I loved the Raonic / Nishikori rivalry at its peak, but was never impressed with Rao's game too much. The way he gets exposed by any decent returner / mover is kind of weak. All he can really do is hide behind his serve and throw a single bashy forehand if needed. This actually works against most players but whenever he meets someone who can put his serve in play, it's over (Andy, Medvedev or even Ferrer - the latter was before peaking, but still). About "hate" though...I never understood hating someone based on how his game is. Tennis requires varied styles to prosper, so servebots could actually be considered the game's saviors (haha).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,268 Posts
Discussion Starter #56
Would be funny (and sad) if - in a true GU fashion - Thiem fell just short of RG this year again - and got eclipsed by NG the next. Does NG have any clay prodigies though?
It would be very sad. It hasn't happened yet and Thiem still has a few advantages in development over Generation Next. With a good start to the year, he has many chances open for him.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,551 Posts
I feel very sorry for the people who speak about these wonderful tennis players and human beeings as lost and even useless. Do you have a clue what they have made for the sport in their countries? Do you know what impact they have made for tennis? How much popular have become this sport in their countries? It's a shame what I read here.
OP is a good definition of a glory hunter, when you know that it all makes sense.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,551 Posts
Would be funny (and sad) if - in a true GU fashion - Thiem fell just short of RG this year again - and got eclipsed by NG the next. Does NG have any clay prodigies though?



I loved the Raonic / Nishikori rivalry at its peak, but was never impressed with Rao's game too much. The way he gets exposed by any decent returner / mover is kind of weak. All he can really do is hide behind his serve and throw a single bashy forehand if needed. This actually works against most players but whenever he meets someone who can put his serve in play, it's over (Andy, Medvedev or even Ferrer - the latter was before peaking, but still). About "hate" though...I never understood hating someone based on how his game is. Tennis requires varied styles to prosper, so servebots could actually be considered the game's saviors (haha).
Kei vs Milos rivalry was interesting indeed, Kei even bageled him in Tokyo, epic stuff.
2014 US Open and the following Davis Cup match were both great matches.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
240 Posts
Before Stan Wawrinka it was David Ferrer who peaked late in his early thirties. Later we had Kevin Anderson. I think Dominic Thiem will have his best years from 26 to 30, Kei and Milos are not good examples as both are constantly injured.
Well Ferrer is even older... same age as Roddick and Nalbandian! And Anderson is not really relevant. What is true is that players have a longer career now than before. So that gives more opportunity for late bloomers (typically delayed by mental issues) to have some success in their late 20s / early 30s. But they're still late bloomers, and "missed" their potential peak level. I'm still waiting for an ATG to "show up late". As for Thiem, I think he is peaking now, he's just blocked by Nadal and horrible RG schedule (he was also unlucky this year for USO). He still has a window, but it's narrowing fast.
 
41 - 60 of 63 Posts
Top