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Discussion Starter #1
Very similar declining years:

Federer 2008:

age:27
rank: nr2
4 titles
1 slam (without facing Nadal)
2 slam finals (both lost to Nadal)
1 slam SF
0 master series
0-4 against Nadal

Nadal 2011:

age:25
rank:nr2
3 titles
1 slam (without facing Djokovic)
2 slam finals (both lost to Djokovic)
1 slam QF
1 master series
0-6 against Djokovic

Obvious similarities, the year when Federer clearly lost his crown to Nadal and 2011 is the year Nadal definetly lost to Djokovic. I think those years the decline became very clear both for Nadal and Federer. They looked a bit slower, started to have problems against lesser players early on in slams they usually didnt have (Federer vs Andreev and Tipsarevic and Nadal vs Isner) and simply couldnt handle their main rivals anywhere.
 

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But Fed has his greatest victories- the career slam at the French, and all time most majors at Wimbledon, in 2009. Nadal got the career slam last year- and it would take him years to equal Fed's record. I just don't see How Nadal's 2012 could equal Fed's 2009.
 

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Your visions will happen
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If this is the case, then Nadal 2010 was Federer 2007.

Both won 3 slams and were #1, but they didn't show the same level of play as they did in their earlier peak years.
 

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sexybeast is desperately trying to imply that Nadal will be on the permanent decline? BUt he actually didn't play that bad at all in 2011, the years are not comparable. also recall, if we compare 2008 and 2011, Federer was losing to Nadal but the rest of the tour was not really being crushed by him. looking at 2011, the whole tour is being crushed by Djokovic and so is Nadal, but Nadal is right up there, far beyond the rest. what i'm saying is that Djokovic is playing at an incredible level and Nadal at a pretty good one and then there is the rest of the tour. Djokovic > > > Nadal > > > (Federer?) > > > Rest of Tour

so they are not really comparable at all, this year reflects Djokovic playing very well not anything about Nadal having a similar decline to Federer
 

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Discussion Starter #13
sexybeast is desperately trying to imply that Nadal will be on the permanent decline? BUt he actually didn't play that bad at all in 2011, the years are not comparable. also recall, if we compare 2008 and 2011, Federer was losing to Nadal but the rest of the tour was not really being crushed by him. looking at 2011, the whole tour is being crushed by Djokovic and so is Nadal, but Nadal is right up there, far beyond the rest. what i'm saying is that Djokovic is playing at an incredible level and Nadal at a pretty good one and then there is the rest of the tour. Djokovic > > > Nadal > > > (Federer?) > > > Rest of Tour

so they are not really comparable at all, this year reflects Djokovic playing very well not anything about Nadal having a similar decline to Federer
So Nadal is not declining? 2011 Djokovic would straight set 2008 Nadal on clay and destroy him on every surface?
 

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I think Nadal 2011 is better than 2008 Fed
Just Djokovic 2011 is too good :shrug:
 

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So Nadal is not declining? 2011 Djokovic would straight set 2008 Nadal on clay and destroy him on every surface?
There are no indications that Nadal is definitely declining. I mean for Gods sake he made it SO many finals this year. you would be RIGHT if Nadal was losing to any guy and was struggling 24/7 but he's lost so many finals this season against a player who's on one of the hottest streaks ever! If Nadal were losing to Murray again and again this year I would agree with you but he's been losing to a guy with the best season on tour EVER.

next thing you know you will say Murray is on the decline because he's been losing to Nadal who's been losing to Djokovic! it's just ill logic, there are no true indicators that Nadal is on the decline besides losing to a player having the best season of all time, which is not an indicator at all
 

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Different situations
Federer 2008 was on his decline, Nadal 2011 is still on his peak

Better comparision is Federer 2008 / Sampras 1998
Since the debilitating "decline":

4 slams
5 slam finals
3 slam semi-finals

Lovely "decline".

AKA I'm not buying it. Results > subjectivity

Federer losing to Nadal doesn't mean he's on the decline. It means it's business as usual.
 

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these kind of threads are not fun or interesting anymore :( maybe we have had too much of this BS. Federer is done, no matter how much that hurts for us, his fans; The new era is starting between Nadal and Djokovic, though I really think Nadal has only 2 years top on that fight.. Now ppl will start calling Djokovic the Goat, until someone else comes and stop him with 10-13 GS titles, and then story starts over again.

Tennis is dead due to homogenized surfaces..
 

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Still difficult/impossible to tell where Nadal's career is. I don't think it is on the decline, but I don't think he is at his peak. I mean after all he has been making all these finals but he was never a truly consistent player to begin with. I mean every time he gets on a run, it is normally for just a few months, generally after the clay court season, which allows him to carry his form into Wimbledon/US Open much more easily. I mean this is also evidenced by the fact that Nadal has struggled at the end and beginning of most every season. So even if Nadal fails to do much for the rest of the year or until next clay court season, it wouldn't be surprising at all and would still make it very difficult to gauge where he is at.

Since the debilitating "decline":

4 slams
5 slam finals
3 slam semi-finals

Lovely "decline".

AKA I'm not buying it. Results > subjectivity

Federer losing to Nadal doesn't mean he's on the decline. It means it's business as usual.
Those stats are really silly to bring up though. Just as it is noticeable how much more pop Djokovic puts on his serve/groundstrokes compared to the past, it is noticeable that Federer is not physically the same he was in 2004-2007. Even if you go with those stats, result wise it is still a decline regardless of whether one would still consider his success post-2007 as a success. Are you going to tell me that the 4 slams from 2008-2011 is not less than 12 slams from 2003-2007?
 
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