[Ada Monroe]

I saw both the semi-finals and I thought it was poor quality.

For one, the fact that two 30+ year old men (who's NOT playing the best tennis of their life) is in the latest GS final is an indictment on the rest of the tour that there's not enough talent.

Pete and Andre played great but I've seen them play 10 times better. If they're still contesting slam finals, there's something wrong with the rest of the tour.

N.B: The womens' equivalent would be like if Graf-Sabatini were in the womens' final imagine that!

But then this would explain a lot about the fact that Hewitt is #1.

There will be better days ahead though, when the next generation of players with true talent actually takes over.

 

[Nimi]

I already started a thread that there is no point comparing the WTA to the ATP. Really.

 

[Experimentee]

Agassi reached four Slam finals in 1999, winning 3 of them. This was when he was 30. Was men's tennis weak then?
Just because someone is over 30 doesnt mean that they cant play tennis anymore. Most of the greats were still winning when they were over 30, a good example being Connors. That doesnt mean tennis was weak then.

 

[Layla]

We've covered this topic in another thread so I'll just copy and paste my thoughts on this issue:

ATP does NOT have a problem. I love this transitional period when new stars are coming through. Everything goes through cycles and the world of tennis is no exception. You can't expect these young players to have 10 slams to their name when they have barely turned 20. Why are people so impatient?

I really do love the ATP as it is now - its diversity and unpredictabilty. There are so many exciting players around, young and old. I don't like domination of any kind. I have no desire to see the situation in the WTA repeated in men's tennis. Besides, Andre and Pete are hardly dominating the tour, are they.

And that's what makes this period so exciting. We don't know which players will turn out to be the future great champions of a new era. But we can follow their progress and witness the birth of greatness as it happens. And there will be breakthroughs, of that I have no doubt. Like I said, it's just a phase in the cycle.

So to sum it up, no, the ATP is not going through a weak period, on the contrary. I've never enjoyed tennis more. You can't judge the state of the ATP based on one tournament. As for the remark that there's not enought talent around at the moment, I beg to differ. The new balls are very talents, they just need more consistency and that comes with age and experience, as it did for the old guns.

Just what do you mean by the next generation? The players who have not started playing professionally? I wouldn't write off the current generation of players so easily. They have already achieved some pretty remarkable results, with plenty more to come.

 

[Chloe le Bopper]

Pete and Andre are among the best ever. They don't have to play their best to win, its part of being a champ.

They are special cases! You don't see Jeff Tarango and Wayne Ferreira in the finals of the US Open do you?

If you find mens tennis such poor quality, then why watch? Go back and watch the T&A - oh my bad, thats WTA - there are tons of good quality bagels there.

 

[Chloe le Bopper]

By the way, talking about 30 year olds as old and using them as an example for why the ATP is so apparently weak, then bringing up Graf is pretty amusing.

Graf won a grand slam at 29. Was the WTA weak?

 

[Chloe le Bopper]

And could you remind me how old Martina Navratilova and Chris Evert were when they stopped contending at slams?

 

[ILR]

The ATP DOES NOT HAVE A PROBLEM!This year all 4 Grand Slams have been won(or will be) by a different player,young and old(I say old but.......) compared to the WTA which Serena has won 3 of and wasnt in the Australian Open due to injury.I think its great that there are so many men who can win Grand Slams and it is certainly not boring because we have no idea who is going to win,whereas the WTA grandslams are becoming a bit predictable.

 

[Chloe le Bopper]

i love how every points out how old this final is and uses it as a staple of the ATP, and totally ignored Wimbledon when one of the youngest finals ever occured

 

[Tennis Fool]

Agassi reached four Slam finals in 1999, winning 3 of them. This was when he was 30. Was men's tennis weak then?
==========================================
YES! Although you still had a strong Pete (at Wimby anyway) and of course Rafter (please unretire. Please!) The New Ballz did nothing then, and are still doing nothng.

I agree with you mostly, Marat & Venus_Fan, although I think Pete (Mr. Roboto) is playing great. He seems to pick it up only at slams (although still not sure what happened at Wimby). I don't really care to slam the older guys, I'm really slamming the younger generation

 

[luvbadboys]

THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH MEN'S TENNIS IF IT BOTHERS ANYONE DON'T WATCH!

I have questions about the state of the new balls too (except hewitt) but I would never dismiss them. New balls got to the finals of OZ (Marat), the finals of French(JCF) the finals of Wimby(Hewitt) not to mention that new bals have quite a few masters titles/ finals between them so if old balls got to 1, I repeat ONE slam final it is not the end of the world.

A true men's tennis fan knowing this would not be so flippant about the acomplishments of the new balls.

We do have to worry about Roddick though.

 

[dbc]

Can't think how anyone thinks men's tennis is going through aeeak period with so many playes causing upsets etc. The fact that Sampras/Agassi have got through to the final just proves they know how to up their games that little bit on the important points.
How can anyone compare it to the WTA when the early rounds are in the majority extremely 1-sided and the main finals are contested by the Williams sisters with the knowledge that Serena is a step above & it is a foregone conclusion that she's going to win. In the other t'ments, if either of them are playing 99% of the time they will be a finalist & win.

 

[Chloe le Bopper]

Could someone explain to me why it is so appalling for Pete and Andre to be doing this into their 30's, but nothing was wrong when Steffi won at 29, and Martina and Chris were good into their 30's.

Not to mention the fact that Monica Seles is 28 and still in the top 5.

 

[Ace Tracker]

it's very annoying when these WTAWorld posters who love to bash men's tennis over there decide to come down here and do some more bashing..

if men's tennis is weak, I don't know if we could find words to describe the quality of women's tennis out of the top 15 players... but we are not here (in ATPWorld, I mean) to bash any tour, are we? Hopefully this will remain a better board...

 

[Ada Monroe]

And could you remind me how old Martina Navratilova and Chris Evert were when they stopped contending at slams?

Exactly, that WAS a weak period in womens' tennis during the mid-80's when Navratilova and Evert both 30+ were winning slams regularly. That's why Graf in her teens was able to fill that niche perfectly.

Of course, the ATP is NOT as bad as it was then. But there is lack of talent right now. As a result quality of matches have declined. If mens' tennis was at its peak right now, Pete and Andre would've lost in the semis at best.

Layla, I like your post and I share your view on this same situtation. The point I'm trying to put across is also that ATP is in a "transitional period when new stars are coming through".

I'm not "bashing" the ATP, but the young guys on ATP have a lot of work to do to catch up, and they better do it soon.

Lleyton Hewitt is a puppet #1. Wait til Safin and others actually fill their potential. But they must do it quick.

And to those who thinks so, I don't have a problem with mens' tennis (otherwise I wouldn't post here) and I don't think the ATP is going through a problem (read my posts again).

 

[claudine140]

I don't agree with the fact that ATP tennis is weak.
The matches I saw at the beginning of the us open were great, just because there are a lot of good males players who are possible slamwinners. If you compair this with the ladies, it was borring the first rounds, look to the scores/
The final against the sisters was beautifull to watch, good tennis.

What i saw this night in the men final was also beautifull tennis. Sampras shows back his great gift to play tennis like nobody else, I am not a big sampras fan, but i must be honest, that man can play so good, so briljant, agassi couldn't do nothing against him.
Ages doesn't meen a player don't count any more on the tour. It shows that if a player has a good condition, is motivated, he can play as + 30 in big tournements and be a threat to anyone.

So that gives me hope for MOYKE. He is now 26 years old and I surely hope he will play such a good tennis when he is +30 as sampras and agassi.

 

[Vera]

Of course, the ATP is NOT as bad as it was then. But there is lack of talent right now. As a result quality of matches have declined. If mens' tennis was at its peak right now, Pete and Andre would've lost in the semis at best.

It really is a matter of whether the glass is half full or half empty. I think that the men tour is actually in a very high standard that there's too many good players in the field to compete for every tournament. The fact that now that first round and second round is already a real battle is making it more difficult for anyone to win the title. I mean, there's no more easy round anymore, unlike 10 years ago when the elite group is so much smaller.

There's exactly 2 older players that are still competing well among the top group, Agassi and Sampras. And we all agree that they are among the best EVER, if not THE. So why is everybody so concern that these 2 are in the final and not the young guns. Is it bcos ppl think that they are in the final because the young players are not good enouge, but not because these 2 are truly exceptional?

 

[Chloe le Bopper]

Wonderful post Vera I find it frusterating that people are using Pete and Andre as examples of "old men" in the finals. You can't take two all time greats and ask why some 20 year old who was named a "new ball" isn't as succesful as they are.

Furthermore, neither Andre or Pete were near all time great status when they were 20-22 years old.

 

[Ada Monroe]

Good post Vera, I agree that there's depth in mens' tennis and that every round is tough, but that was like that in the early 90's too. Upsets were very common then too.

Look, I just feel mens' tennis is going through a transitional weak period right now, which it will SURELY get out of.

Right now is probably the equivalent of 97-99 on the WTA. In the next year or after, I expect a "Williams Sisters"-esque dominance to emerge by one or two of the younger players.

 

[dbc]

Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems that the Pete/Andre bashing club are under 20's who feel that once you're 25+ you're over the hill and it pains them to have these 2 still great players making the young guns look foolish occasionally.