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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
After looking at the following table for the 2004 ATP drug testing,

http://www.atptennis.com/en/antidoping/stats.asp

it's amazing to see how they seem to focus on players from certain countries for testing. If people think that the Argentine players are being unfairly targeted, look at poor Spain.

The table shows that most players are tested by the ATP once or twice a year. A much smaller number get tested more than that. The most anyone was tested in 2004 was 5 times.

But here is where it gets interesting. What countries are the players from that get tested more than twice?

There were 11 countries that had only 1 player tested more than twice.
There were 5 countries that had only 2 players tested more than twice.

Then:
Switzerland had 3 players each tested 3 times.
Germany had 2 players tested 3 times and 2 players tested 4 times.
Italy had 4 players tested 3 times and 1 player tested 4 times.

Here it comes.......
Argentina had 7 players tested 3 times and 2 players tested 4 times.
Spain had 10 players tested 3 times, 3 players tested 4 times, and 3 players tested 5 times.

Looking at those numbers, statistics will tell you that we should expect to "catch" a lot more "cheaters" from Argentina and Spain than from anywhere else.

Is the ATP testing schedule supposed to be random or do they deliberately pick individuals for testing? Do Argentina and Spain have a valid case that they are being targetted?

There is another table that shows all testing (ATP, ITF, and Blood testing) both in and out of competition, for the top 50 players. I haven't gone through that one exhaustively but it does show other oddities such as the fact that while some (Roddick and Moya) are tested as many as 9 times, others (Dent) aren't tested at all. Here is the link for that

http://www.atptennis.com/en/common/TrackIt.asp?file=/en/antidoping/top50.pdf
 

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well of course they will keep testing the players from Argentina cuz they keeping testing positive.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
RDucky said:
well of course they will keep testing the players from Argentina cuz they keeping testing positive.
Does Spain also have a history of player violations?
 

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Without even looking at the table, I'm going to guess that perhaps ranking has something to do with how many times you are tested? That is to say, if you're highly ranked, you're more likely to progress further in tournaments and get tested. I could be mistaken. As I said, I didn't look. But it would make a lot of sense.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Chloe le Bopper said:
Without even looking at the table, I'm going to guess that perhaps ranking has something to do with how many times you are tested? That is to say, if you're highly ranked, you're more likely to progress further in tournaments and get tested. I could be mistaken. As I said, I didn't look. But it would make a lot of sense.

Well, it doesn't really appear to be that. For example of the 16 Spaniards that were heavily tested there were a half-dozen I never heard of while Nadal and Ferrero were not there. As a matter of fact, at a quick glance, the only 2004 top 10 players tested more than twice were Federer and Moya .

And only 4 total players were tested 5 times each. Three of those (Ferrer, Verdasco, and Portas) were from Spain. The only other one was Thomas Johansson from Sweden.
 

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As long as their results come back negative is there anything wrong with them being tested that many times?
 

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Sol Apollo said:
As long as their results come back negative is there anything wrong with them being tested that many times?
There is something wrong with targetting particular nations, yes. However, I don't see anything wrong with targetting particular individuals with past suspensions.
 

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When a lot of top players from one country have tested positive just within a few years, I think the ATP has every right to test their players more because it's highly suspicious for that many players to test positive one after the other. At that point it isn't a matter of just individual players, but that country's tennis federation should be scrutinized as well.
 

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Sol Apollo said:
When a lot of top players from one country have tested positive just within a few years, I think the ATP has every right to test their players more because it's highly suspicious for that many players to test positive one after the other. At that point it isn't a matter of just individual players, but that country's tennis federation should be scrutinized as well.
I don't entirely disagree. Let me rephrase that: I think there is something wrong with targetting particular nations without justifiable reason :p

That said, I'm not even sure that is the case here.

And I'm still not sure that somebody who has never tested positive should have to deal with heavier testing because some of their countrymen have been guilty.
 

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True, but then if they're innocent they shouldn't have a problem with the testing, should they? ;)
 

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Where's Puerta? It'd be interesting to see how many times he has been tested this year, considering his previous issues and his improved performances this year
 

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ATP has a table specifically for top 50 players and the numbers of tests I found in the one for 2004 are higher than those posted above, e.g. 9 for Moya, Robredo, and Roddick. What causes the ATP to test Roddick 9 times, but Agassi only 4 e.g.? (increase perhaps from adding urine to blood tests?)

Someone who is guilty has no grounds to complain about being tested, and someone who is innocent perhaps no need to worry, but what about players who were not tested at all, or tested so infrequently who knows if they are doping? What is the grounds for that? If the ATP wanted to choose scapegoats they could easily by selectively testing some of the players they have good reason to suspect are doping. The ones they target are guilty, but so are many others they decided not to target.

By listing these names BTW, I am not trying to target anyone, or make any insuations or accusations, or bash any of them. I am just listing some who show with few or no tests. I don't understand the reason they aren't tested as often. I have no reason to think infrequent tests are equated with guilt of any kind, I just wonder why some players aren't tested as much as others?

Dent = 0
Novak = 1
Horna = 2
Rusedski = 2
J. Johansson = 2

The ATP Table for top 50 players - tests in 2004

http://www.atptennis.com/en/common/TrackIt.asp?file=/en/antidoping/top50.pdf
 

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Noticed that Davis Cup participants seem to have 2 test taken when they are tested at a DC tie, so that might explain much of Spain's excess, and Roddick's too - additional 4 in 2004 for each of them. To analyze this well you'd need to adjust for anomalies like that, e.g. A statistician should really consider this project.
 

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It's very known ATP doping policy is a joke, very permissive. I'm sure that if ATP used the cycling doping policy ( UCI ) a lot of tennis players tests would come out positive.

Besides ATP hushes up the positives of some TOP players, some times ATP hushes up.. 1) not suspending the player ...2) or some times the player is suspended for a pair of months but this positive isn't known by the press and fans.

Some months ago, among ATP players there was a rumour very widespread about a TOP player with blonde hair had been suspended by doping 2 or 3 months but this positive was never confirmed officially by ATP and in theory the player was injured

When the positive is a TOP player ( not being argentine ) ATP hushes it up and negotiate with that player a sanction of a pair months, on the other hand when the positive is other player the sanction is harsh and besides ATP confirms officially this positive.

ATP sucks ( a mafia organization )
 

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Galaxystorm said:
Some months ago, among ATP players there was a rumour very widespread about a TOP player with blonde hair had been suspended by doping 2 or 3 months but this positive was never confirmed officially by ATP and in theory the player was injured
Is this player yelling regularly "c'moooon !!!" during matches and proposes women as a hobby ? I have my idea on this one... ;)
 

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mdhubert said:
Is this player yelling regularly "c'moooon !!!" during matches and happens to make women pregnant ? I have my idea on this one... ;)
:scratch: :scratch: :scratch: :angel:

This player changed his clothing sponsor this year ;) ( and it isn't Lacoste )
 

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This "broken rib in the stairs" was the best ever excuse not to participate in a slam. We should do a ranking of those, and this one would be number 1 for sure...
 

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mdhubert said:
This "broken rib in the stairs" was the best ever excuse not to participate in a slam. We should do a ranking of those, and this one would be number 1 for sure...
So basically what you're saying is Lleyton's a liar and a doper too...
 

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mirkaland said:
So basically what you're saying is Lleyton's a liar and a doper too...
Cool down...
Regarding the doping allegations I have no clue and never heard of the "blonde" rumor before. I just laughed at this broken rib stuff cause it was obvious Hewitt was not ready for Roland Garros but the ATP system requires medical reasons to withdraw.
If he was to be doped, I would see him as an amphetamin consumer, becasue he's very nervous, but again, I have no clue on this and honestly, I don't care. ;)
 
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