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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
These guys first met up in 2004 Miami Open and here we are almost 15 years later.

1. 2004 United States Miami Open Masters Hard Round of 32 Nadal 6–3, 6–3 1:10 minutes



It's pretty crazy to think how far these two have come since that first meeting... Also, 15 years later and both of them are still viable winners for almost every tournament that they enter.





How old do you feel?

Do you remember teenage Nadal and young 20's Federer?

I wasn't even a tennis fan in 2004, in fact I was more occupied with playing foursquare and kickball, than watching tennis

Look this may not even happen, but its pretty crazy that this rivalry, whether one sided or not, has gone on this long!
 

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Don't be so sentimental, this won't happen. Not on Hoorcatch watch.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Don't be so sentimental, this won't happen. Not on Hoorcatch watch.
Point still stands. This match up is eons old. 15 years come Miami!

Do you remember 15 years ago?

19 year old young buck Super Sayan? Were you even a tennis fan?
 

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Point still stands. This match up is eons old. 15 years come Miami!

Do you remember 15 years ago?

19 year old young buck Super Sayan? Were you even a tennis fan?
I've watched tennis since late 90s but not as regularly as now. I don't remember this one but surely watched all their GS matches (so the first was in 2005) and many others as well. Fed was beating all opponents but things changed when he faced a lefty tarzan with one biceps :lol:. Nadal was Fed's kryptonite from a get-go.
 

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If this match happens I can finally dust of my Federer/Nadal rivalry appriciation thread again:)
 

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I've watched tennis since late 90s but not as regularly as now. I don't remember this one but surely watched all their GS matches (so the first was in 2005) and many others as well. Fed was beating all opponents but things changed when he faced a lefty tarzan with one biceps :lol:. Nadal was Fed's kryptonite from a get-go.
Would really be a remarkable story, at least in my eyes given how this rivalry has been over the years, that Federer would be the one to win 6 matches in a row in this rivalry.
 

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Longest distance between first and last meetings.

Borotra - Cochet 26 years
Budge - Riggs 20 years
Laver - Stolle 18 years
Emerson - Laver 17 years
Crawford - Quist 17 years

Laver - Ashe 17 years
Agassi - Chang 15 years
Fed - Hewitt 15 years
Connors - McEnroe 14 years
Gonzalez - Segura 14 years
Hoad - Rosewall 14 years
Federer- Wawrinka 14 years *
Ferrer - Nadal 14 years *
Federer - Ferrer 14 years *

Federer - Nadal 13 years *
Djokovic - Nadal 13 years *

The record, entirely in the open era is 15 years for Agassi/Chang and Federer/Hewitt. Federer/Nadal would surpass Agassi/Chang by a couple of months.
 

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Longest distance between first and last meetings.

Borotra - Cochet 26 years
Budge - Riggs 20 years
Laver - Stolle 18 years
Emerson - Laver 17 years
Crawford - Quist 17 years

Laver - Ashe 17 years
Agassi - Chang 15 years
Fed - Hewitt 15 years
Connors - McEnroe 14 years
Gonzalez - Segura 14 years
Hoad - Rosewall 14 years
Federer- Wawrinka 14 years *
Ferrer - Nadal 14 years *
Federer - Ferrer 14 years *

Federer - Nadal 13 years *
Djokovic - Nadal 13 years *

The record, entirely in the open era is 15 years for Agassi/Chang and Federer/Hewitt. Federer/Nadal would surpass Agassi/Chang by a couple of months.
Borotra has such a inspiring story. Being imprisoned in WW2 and then fought himself. Some time ago I saw a whole bit on him on French television.
 

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Every time we are anticipating and expecting a match up between them this much, they never get there (looking at you USO), exception probably being AO17 (but then again at that moment nobody really dared to "dream" of the match before they were both in the semis, and even then it wasn't exactly a certainty they'd both win their semi).
 

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I think it will happen.

I hope Khach doesn't take too much out of Rafa.

I couldn't care less about the last 5 in a row for Fed, (indoors in basel, Miami and Shanghai are such obvious places for Fed to prevail; Ao was insanely close, IW Rafa just played like crap, he admitted it) Rafa had 5 in a row three separate times in their rivalry!!!
These conditions are v good for Rafa, I can see it in the bounce, and I think it's a lie that Fed solved the BH issue--I think he still has trouble with high BHs, but he just takes it earlier to not let it get high. If Rafa can hit deep to that side the dividends are still there.

The determining question for me will be whether Fed is still in Rafa's head. We'll see against KK what Rafa's level is really like, so far he has just destroyed weaker players.

Anyway, it's a shame they were both on the same side this time.
 

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These guys first met up in 2004 Miami Open and here we are almost 15 years later.

1. 2004 United States Miami Open Masters Hard Round of 32 Nadal 6–3, 6–3 1:10 minutes



It's pretty crazy to think how far these two have come since that first meeting... Also, 15 years later and both of them are still viable winners for almost every tournament that they enter.





How old do you feel?

Do you remember teenage Nadal and young 20's Federer?

I wasn't even a tennis fan in 2004, in fact I was more occupied with playing foursquare and kickball, than watching tennis

Look this may not even happen, but its pretty crazy that this rivalry, whether one sided or not, has gone on this long!
I didn't watch at the time, but have watched that match more recently.

What a seminal moment in tennis history!!! And so so so sweet.
 

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Would really be a remarkable story, at least in my eyes given how this rivalry has been over the years, that Federer would be the one to win 6 matches in a row in this rivalry.
Yeah, he may have a chance this year. I decided to divide their rivalry into parts (based on my memory and stats):

Part I: First shock (Miami 2004 - RG 2006, H2H 6-1 in Nadal's favour)

Federer (dominant #1 at that time) has no problems with beating all his rivals but suddenly lefty Tarzan appears and beats him time and time again (even on HC) with a very simple game (at that time Nadal's game wasn't fully developed yet). "It's because he's lefty" Fed suggested a few times.

Part II: Federer bounces back (Wim 2006 - MC 2007, H2H 5-2 in Federer's favour)

Federer starts winning more matches against his rival (he answered "I like it again" when asked about the rivalry after Wim 2006 final). He wins all important off-clay matches (Wimby twice, MC twice) and even defeated Nadal on clay but still couldn't beat him when it mattered most (RG). Their Wim 2007 was alarmingly close though (from Fed's perspective). The rivalry is gaining big popularity fast.

Part III: Nadal's all-surface assault (Monte Carlo 2008 - AO 2009. H2H 5-0 in Nadal's favour)

Federer's post Wimby 2007 words were shocking. The dominant #1 said "I’m happy with every one I get, before he takes them all". It was a sign of things to come. Few expected Nadal to push Federer so hard on grass and Fed finally realized that Nadal is a big threat off-clay as well. His nightmares became reality in 2008 and at the beginning of 2009. After RG drubbing Nadal finally overcomes Fed at Wimby after dramatic rain-interrupted match. It was a symbolic change of the king (he lost #1 after a few weeks). Fed's nightmare came back at the AO2009, when he burst into tears after the match. At that time it looked like Nadal broke Fed's spirit and overcame him physically and mentally.

Part IV: Calming down (Madrid 2009 - IW 2012, H2H 5-4 in Nadal's favour)

After reaching enormous heights Fedal's intensity weakened. In 2009 Nadal shockingly lost at RG and injury eliminated him from Wimby while Fed had his comeback to #1. Afterwards Nadal bounced back in 2010 while Fedrer's results got worse. The rise of Djokovic made Djokodal the dominant rivalry (culminating in 4 GS finals in a row). In this period Fedal was close (5-4) but Nadal won most important matches (RG2011 and AO2012).

Part V: Nadal dominating again (IW 2013 - AO 2014, H2H 5-0 in Nadal's favour)

NID part of the rivalry. Nadal had a great period (both on clay and on HC) while Fed was not at his best (back problems influenced his form). At that time it looked like Fed would never win a match against Nadal again.

Part VI: Fed's stunning comeback (Basel 2015 - Shanghai 2017, H2H 5-0 in Fed's favour)

Even most optimistic Fed fans didn't see this coming. Federer wins AO in stunning fashion after beating Nadal in 5-set final (from 1-3 down in the 5th). This was his first GS win over arch-rival in 9.5 years! Federer was very enthusiastic about his return to the game (after a long hiatus) and his positive mental state (and long break in the rivalry) surely helped him win over his nemezis. This was the breakthrough - Federer played even more freely in their next matches winning all of them in straight sets. His backhand (an obvious weakness against lefty topspin forehand) was working very well and he never collapsed mentally (as it happened before). Federer's resurgence in this rivalry was epic and added to his legacy for sure (although no clay matches between them helped him here).

Will we have chapter VII?
 

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Yeah, he may have a chance this year. I decided to divide their rivalry into parts (based on my memory and stats):

Part I: First shock (Miami 2004 - RG 2006, H2H 6-1 in Nadal's favour)

Federer (dominant #1 at that time) has no problems with beating all his rivals but suddenly lefty Tarzan appears and beats him time and time again (even on HC) with a very simple game (at that time Nadal's game wasn't fully developed yet). "It's because he's lefty" Fed suggested a few times.

Part II: Federer bounces back (Wim 2006 - MC 2007, H2H 5-2 in Federer's favour)

Federer starts winning more matches against his rival (he answered "I like it again" when asked about the rivalry after Wim 2006 final). He wins all important off-clay matches (Wimby twice, MC twice) and even defeated Nadal on clay but still couldn't beat him when it mattered most (RG). Their Wim 2007 was alarmingly close though (from Fed's perspective). The rivalry is gaining big popularity fast.

Part III: Nadal's all-surface assault (Monte Carlo 2008 - AO 2009. H2H 5-0 in Nadal's favour)

Federer's post Wimby 2007 words were shocking. The dominant #1 said "I’m happy with every one I get, before he takes them all". It was a sign of things to come. Few expected Nadal to push Federer so hard on grass and Fed finally realized that Nadal is a big thread off-clay as well. His nightmares became true in 2008 and at the beginning of 2009. After RG drubbing Nadal finally overcomes Fed at Wimby after dramatic rain-interrupted match. It was a symbolic change of the king (he lost #1 after a few weeks). Fed's nightmare came back at the AO2009, when he burst into tears after the match. At that time it looked like Nadal broke Fed's spirit and overcame him physically and mentally.

Part IV: Calming down (Madrid 2009 - IW 2012, H2H 5-4 in Nadal's favour)

After reaching enormous heights Fedal's intensity weakened. In 2009 Nadal shockingly lost at RG and injury eliminated him from Wimby while Fed had his comeback to #1. Afterwards Nadal bounced back in 2010 while Fedrer's results got worse. The rise of Djokovic made Djokodal the dominant rivalry (culminating in 4 GS finals in a row). In this period Fedal was close (5-4) but Nadal won most important matches (RG2011 and AO2012).

Part V: Nadal dominating again (IW 2013 - AO 2014, H2H 5-0 in Nadal's favour)

NID part of the rivalry. Nadal had a great period (both on clay and on HC) while Fed was not at his best (back problems influenced his form). At that time it looked like Fed would never win a match against Nadal again.

Part VI: Fed's stunning comeback (Basel 2015 - Shanghai 2017, H2H 5-0 in Fed's favour)

Even most optimistic Fed fans didn't see this coming. Federer wins AO in stunning fashion after beating Nadal in 5-set final (from 1-3 down in the 5th). This was his first GS win over arch-rival in 9.5 years! Federer was very enthusiastic about his return to the game (after a long hiatus) and his positive mental state (and long break in the rivalry) surely helped him win over his nemezis. This was the breakthrough - Federer played even more freely in their next matches winning all of them in straight sets. His backhand (an obvious weakness against lefty topspin forehand) was working very well and he never collapsed mentally (as it happened before). Federer's resurgence in this rivalry was epic and added to his legacy for sure (although no clay matches between them helped him here).

Will we have chapter VII?
Yeah this is a pretty good summary. Really quite nostalgic reading all of this. Has really been an epic rivalry, at least in my eyes.
 

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Yeah this is a pretty good summary. Really quite nostalgic reading all of this. Has really been an epic rivalry, at least in my eyes.
It was epic especially in 2006-2009. I told @Kowchi not to be sentimental but I got sentimental too :D
 

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I think it will happen.

I hope Khach doesn't take too much out of Rafa.

I couldn't care less about the last 5 in a row for Fed, (indoors in basel, Miami and Shanghai are such obvious places for Fed to prevail; Ao was insanely close, IW Rafa just played like crap, he admitted it) Rafa had 5 in a row three separate times in their rivalry!!!
These conditions are v good for Rafa, I can see it in the bounce, and I think it's a lie that Fed solved the BH issue--I think he still has trouble with high BHs, but he just takes it earlier to not let it get high. If Rafa can hit deep to that side the dividends are still there.
I hope the matchup happens even though the slow/high bounce conditions aren't ideal for Fed. Can also relate to your sentiments on the H2H. Couldn't care less pre-2015:
* Federer using prehistoric racquet against lefty
* AO 2014- only one month with up-to-date racquet
* Clay such obvious surface for Nadal to prevail
* 0-8 vs Nadal in 2008/2013- happen to be Fed's two worst seasons due to illness/injury during their rivalry
 

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First complete match between them that I watched was RG 2005 SF. Since then, I don't think I missed more than 1-2 matches between them.
It was so much fun watching young RAFA destroy Nose. Hopefully this week he remembers who he is and what he does best. Though watching yonh Rafa vs current Rafa, I don't think I've seen any other player lose so much of his speed, it's shocking. Nose hasn't lost nearly as much.
 

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Longest distance between first and last meetings.

Borotra - Cochet 26 years
Budge - Riggs 20 years
Laver - Stolle 18 years
Emerson - Laver 17 years
Crawford - Quist 17 years

Laver - Ashe 17 years
Agassi - Chang 15 years
Fed - Hewitt 15 years
Connors - McEnroe 14 years
Gonzalez - Segura 14 years
Hoad - Rosewall 14 years
Federer- Wawrinka 14 years *
Ferrer - Nadal 14 years *
Federer - Ferrer 14 years *

Federer - Nadal 13 years *
Djokovic - Nadal 13 years *

The record, entirely in the open era is 15 years for Agassi/Chang and Federer/Hewitt. Federer/Nadal would surpass Agassi/Chang by a couple of months.
that's interesting. Almost no one talked about the longevity of their rivalry, which is perhaps eclipsed by the match-up itself.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
First complete match between them that I watched was RG 2005 SF. Since then, I don't think I missed more than 1-2 matches between them.
It was so much fun watching young RAFA destroy Nose. Hopefully this week he remembers who he is and what he does best. Though watching yonh Rafa vs current Rafa, I don't think I've seen any other player lose so much of his speed, it's shocking. Nose hasn't lost nearly as much.
Young Rafa was also a freak of nature. I dont think anyone in the history of tennis is/was as quick as him.

Maybe Monflis.
 
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