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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I think Roger already figured Nadal's game out in Miami, but still it will be a question of executing what he wants to do and readjusting if Nadal changes anything.

In Montreal I think Agassi did a good job of running Nadal around but he came up lacking with 3 or 4 important volleys that he should have made. To me this shows a formula that many players could use. Run him around then come in at the right time and MAKE the volley. I also noticed that Agassi didn't go for the lines when he could have at times to close out a rally. I think Roger can do all of that when he's feeling good.

Someone posted that Nadal's power is an issue for Roger..... I don't think so. Nadal isn't as powerful as Safin or Roddick. I think it's more the way Nadal runs and gets to so many shots that bugs Roger....plus the high bouncing shots.
 

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The moonball junk to the bh side of roger is what gives him trouble. I would suggest that roger slice that bh much more against nadal, and serve-volley frequently.
 

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World Beater said:
The moonball junk to the bh side of roger is what gives him trouble. I would suggest that roger slice that bh much more against nadal, and serve-volley frequently.
Exactly, I dont think that most people havent figured out Rafas game its dealing with his heavy top spin. In Rogers case its worse because of his BH is more effective with low bounces.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
ExpectedWinner said:
I agree about slice part, not sure about s&v . Nadal is a good passer.
He's a good passer but volleying at the right time and not missing the way Agassi did is what counter acts his passing. Agassi got Nadal way out of position and then came to the net in an excellent position to hit an unreturnable volley...but he netted it. Roger would have to be volleying well of course....but we know he can.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
oneandonlyhsn said:
Exactly, I dont think that most people havent figured out Rafas game its dealing with his heavy top spin. In Rogers case its worse because of his BH is more effective with low bounces.
I will have to rewatch my Miami tape, but I remember that Roger said at one point he realized how to get to the high bounces. Isn't it just a question of standing a little further back?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
oneandonlyhsn said:
Exactly, I dont think that most people havent figured out Rafas game its dealing with his heavy top spin. In Rogers case its worse because of his BH is more effective with low bounces.
Also how many TALL guys has Nadal faced? (not many) If he were facing Safin or any of the taller guys the high bounce would be fine with them. All in all Nadal has been lucky that Safin, Hewitt, and Roddick have fallen off their games this year. If he had to face Safin (in form) , Roddick(in form) then Federer....how fresh would he be? Well the TMC should be a hoot.
 

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PamV said:
Also how many TALL guys has Nadal faced? (not many) If he were facing Safin or any of the taller guys the high bounce would be fine with them. All in all Nadal has been lucky that Safin, Hewitt, and Roddick have fallen off their games this year. If he had to face Safin (in form) , Roddick(in form) then Federer....how fresh would he be? Well the TMC should be a hoot.
With the high bounces, it takes Roger time to adjust and ofcourse depending on the surface, on clay its harder for Roger because not only is he forced to deal with the high bounces but also hitting the extra shot. Most players who play against Rafa can stay with him for a while and then lose the last set by 6-1 or 6-2 because the spins take a toll on their shoulders/arms :scratch:
Roger was constantly trying to losen his arm in the last set at RG, anyway Roger is a smart player and hopefully he will be ready for Rafa when they meet again. I think Rogers chances are better in best of 5 then 3 sets.

As for Safin, I think he would be the best match up for Rafa because he deals quite well with the spins and he strikes the ball very cleanly. I think he gets frustrated with players who volley a lot, but he deals quite well with baseline players, also he punishes slow serves better than most.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Good points Oneandonlyhsn. What you bring up is just why I've thought all along that there has been a somewhat false impression of how dominate Nadal is because he has not had to face the top 5 players repeatedly in tournaments. I am just guessing here.....but if he had to play Safin, then Hewitt, then Federer in one tournament he might not look as great as if he is playing let's say.....Robredo, Gaudio then Federer. There is a fatigue factor that occurs when being pushed by the top players in back to back matches. Roger's has been facing several top 5 opponents for the last two years in many of his tournaments.
 

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PamV said:
Good points Oneandonlyhsn. What you bring up is just why I've thought all along that there has been a somewhat false impression of how dominate Nadal is because he has not had to face the top 5 players repeatedly in tournaments. I am just guessing here.....but if he had to play Safin, then Hewitt, then Federer in one tournament he might not look as great as if he is playing let's say.....Robredo, Gaudio then Federer. There is a fatigue factor that occurs when being pushed by the top players in back to back matches. Roger's has been facing several top 5 opponents for the last two years in many of his tournaments.
I hope Roger shuts everyone up for the remainder of the season
 
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PamV said:
He's a good passer but volleying at the right time and not missing the way Agassi did is what counter acts his passing. Agassi got Nadal way out of position and then came to the net in an excellent position to hit an unreturnable volley...but he netted it. Roger would have to be volleying well of course....but we know he can.
I mean he can't solely rely on s&v, unless he strarts serving like Sampras.
 

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well im in 2 about this. the last 2 sets of the miami final didnt convince me that much.(he was still playing like shit) but a strectch in the second set(even though he lost it). i think nadal broke roger in first game, but then for about 4 games roger just totaly outplayed nadal, there was nothing nadal could do. that convinced me he can beat nadal anyday and in style. the second set in RG wasnt that great either even though he won it, i wasnt confident after it. its whether he can keep the level of play up. so i dont think he was actualy figured him out, but its quite simple, he jsut plays his own game to 100% and he will win nicely. so i dont think he needs to figure a way of playing him, just concentrate on his own game. if he cant play his best for a longer enough peroid, then its time to get a game plan, a way of playing him, but i dont think he was that yet. no doubt the obvious problem is the topsin to his backhand.
 

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oneandonlyhsn said:
As for Safin, I think he would be the best match up for Rafa because he deals quite well with the spins and he strikes the ball very cleanly. I think he gets frustrated with players who volley a lot, but he deals quite well with baseline players, also he punishes slow serves better than most.
Is Safin strongly missed here :lol:

No. Safin will always be the biggest threat to Roger on most surfaces. But ya would love to see how Safin rivals against Nadal, and also Nalbandian.
 

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yanchr said:
Is Safin strongly missed here :lol:

No. Safin will always be the biggest threat to Roger on most surfaces. But ya would love to see how Safin rivals against Nadal, and also Nalbandian.
:lol: You got me on that one, I have always thought that Federer and Safin are the 2 most naturally talented players on the tour and I still do.
As for Safin, because of his game and power he wont be affected much by the heavy topspin like most of the other players.
 

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PamV said:
Good points Oneandonlyhsn. What you bring up is just why I've thought all along that there has been a somewhat false impression of how dominate Nadal is because he has not had to face the top 5 players repeatedly in tournaments. I am just guessing here.....but if he had to play Safin, then Hewitt, then Federer in one tournament he might not look as great as if he is playing let's say.....Robredo, Gaudio then Federer. There is a fatigue factor that occurs when being pushed by the top players in back to back matches. Roger's has been facing several top 5 opponents for the last two years in many of his tournaments.
Hey, you can't say Nadal is dominant because Roger is still playing ;)

Guess does not count and also it's not Nadal's fault that he didn't have to play those names before claiming his title. Isn't it Roger's fault also :( ? But I'm thinking of how Roger was throned world No.1 back in AO 2004. He went through the opponents like Hewitt, Nalbandian, JC and Safin back to back. This was so convincing a way to finally get to the top of the world. BTW, Nadal has yet to get to that very top.
 

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ExpectedWinner said:
I agree about slice part, not sure about s&v . Nadal is a good passer.
But he doesnt return serve very well. I dont care how fast nadal, is asking him to hit pass after pass on a fast HC is demanding. Dont forget that fed can volley pretty decently
 

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It's not a matter of power fr Rafa it's more a mind over matter matter for Rogi and no, I am not convinced that he has figured out Rafa's game... yet. I have yet to see it and hope he does it soon before Rafa truly dominates him as he has other players. Gaudio is not slouch on clay btw... and he has beaten Rafa more than once, incl. BsAs. Gaudio is one of THE best clay players out there w a solid strategy, lots of talent and a very smart game that I admire. ;)
 
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I sure wish Rafa and Roger would meet in the final of Cincinnati. Then all these questions would be settled.

Wouldn't it be cool if all the TMS events this year are won by either Rafa or Roger? I could definitely see it happening. But of course, I'd like Roger to have all the rest from here on...
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
RogiFan88 said:
It's not a matter of power fr Rafa it's more a mind over matter matter for Rogi and no, I am not convinced that he has figured out Rafa's game... yet. I have yet to see it and hope he does it soon before Rafa truly dominates him as he has other players. Gaudio is not slouch on clay btw... and he has beaten Rafa more than once, incl. BsAs. Gaudio is one of THE best clay players out there w a solid strategy, lots of talent and a very smart game that I admire. ;)
It's hard to say about figuring out his game or not, until they actually do play more times. He changed up something during the Miami final showing that he figured it out midstream. However, in FO Roger was saying he had Nadal's game figured out but then Roger couldn't actually execute what he wanted to do. So thinking about it, and doing it are two different things. I really wonder if Roger can find a player to emmulate Nadal's style for practice?

Personally...I dont' think Guadio is so great. He has moments of greatnetss but he's only about 5' 8" /155 lbs. and he is mentally fragile or you could say that he pouts at times. I saw him lose to Rochus in Hamburg.....and it was ridiculous. I think Guadio couldn't get over what he perceived as a bad call. Gaudio only beat Nadal once early in the year before Nadal got on a roll. During the year Nadal beat up Guadio in MC and other times I think Guadio didn't even make past some other player in order to get to play Nadal.
 
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