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· Gugaholic
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Great post, Diss!

Thank God you are a gentleman with very simple and basic logics, not like the ladies, so people here can understand what you're saying.

Oh! I forget English is my second language (and yours and about half of the posters here), so, probably none of us will understand what you're saying.

Now, my very ladylike sophisticated thinking process concluded that, Diss, you're wasting your time here!
 

· psychotic banana
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I don't think any of the posts are negative...but definitely premature. But it does make discussion interesting if we all speculate the next few years of tennis. As to who will dominate..I don't see any one as of right now that would fit the bill. There may be no dominance whatsoever, co-dominance, or pure dominace by a single player. That's the fun in it. :cool:
 

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:rolleyes: at you guys :p

Who wants to see a slam final between

Safin vs Hewitt/Federer/Ferrero etc
Moya/Ferrero vs Guga/Ferrero/ at RG ???

not just once but repeatedly in slams for next 2-3 yrs or so.

or would you wanna see another one like this yr ??


I can remember the 80's/early 90's when Lendl, Becker, Edberg, Wilander used to make finals regularly.

Players Under 26 with slams
Hewitt 2
Safin 1
rest = 0 :rolleyes: ????????
 

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go back to 1991

active players under 26 with slams

Edberg had 5
Becker 5
Sampras 1
Chang 1
Stich 1
Courier won 1st of 4

plus there still was Lendl, Wilander, McEnroe (even Connors :eek:) still around.
still you had the idiots like Gilbert/Cash (even he won 1)
and the clown like Leconte.
 

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TheBoiledEgg said:
:rolleyes: at you guys :p

Who wants to see a slam final between

Safin vs Hewitt/Federer/Ferrero etc
Moya/Ferrero vs Guga/Ferrero/ at RG ???

not just once but repeatedly in slams for next 2-3 yrs or so.
Me! But I guess I can see the other point of view as well, wanting to see other players.

I just thought having an Aussie Open 2002 and French Open 2002 with Marat vs. Potato, Mosquito vs. Guga would have been exciting--more entertaining than what we got.

So, I have a question TBE, since I was a bit to young to follow in the 80s, you didn't enjoy the matches between the players that you mentioned?
 

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I did enjoy them, but my tennis knowledge was considerably less than it is now.

my all time fav was Edberg.
You got to see him playing at his best, just poetry in motion.


its not only finals, but how many slam matches have we actually had between the new balls players ????????
 

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Are we literally counting new balls, or will any young player do?

Ferrero has played Guga (X2), Safin (X2), Mark P, and Hewitt in slams.

He's also faced young players like Robredo, Ancic, etc etc.

I'm not about to compile a list of ALL players mind you ;)
 

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I think that the flaw is not in what the guys are doing, but in your expectations.

You are looking at a group of guys who are 22 and assuming that they are doomed failures or something, because it apears unlikely that they are about to challenge Pete's total slam count :rolleyes:

You are acting all dissapointed because there don't appear even be that many Becker's, or Edbergs on the horizon.

God forbid that tennis not be exactly the same as it was for the past 30 years......



For the mentally challenged: there is no need to take this literally, it was merely an elaboration
 

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Its not just that, no one will come close to Pete's tally ever, unless he cloned himself :eek: (god forbid)

its just that there isn't any young players with any slams at all, just Hewitt and Safin (and 23 is middle-aged in tennis terms)

tennis history shows that you don't win your 1st slam after 26 (only RG has proved the exception),

Its time the stars got themselves together by the balls and pull out the stops.

Ferrero is 23 this yr too, and he or Marat have to win RG this yr.
You don't stay at the top too long, and you got to make the most of it, one injury could just put all your potential to waste.
 

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Rafter didn't win his first slam untill he was 24, and he seems to have done okay for himself.

Are you trying to tell me that if Ferrero doesn't win Roland Garros this year that he'll never win it? lol
 

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And you know, it's easy to pick on Ferrero and his "failure" to win Roland Garros - an event that he's only played THREE times.

There is also an easy answer to why he hasn't won it - Guga.

Yes, Guga was injured last year and Ferrero didn't have to play him. However, Guga's absense cast Ferrero into the role as "favourite", despite his poor performance in *most* of the warmup tournaments.

Furthermore, on the way to two of his three titles, guga beat Ferrero in the semifinals.

Anyhow - I just don't think it's fair to shit on him for not winning something, when in order to do so he had to get past the best clay court player since... well Muster I guess.
 

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Discussion Starter · #72 ·
Are you trying to tell me that if Ferrero doesn't win Roland Garros this year that he'll never win it? lol
It's not as funny as it sounds. I am not sure about one this year. But if he doesn't win one of two next RGs, my bet will go against him ever doing that. You don't have much time to reach your goals, because the next generation of Roddick, Youzhnyi, Mathieu, Gasquet, etc will be at full swing very soon, and if one particular Slam really prefers fresh young legs, it's RG. And that next generation doesn't seem to be that much of generation of spoiled non-motivated brats..
 

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I really hate the suggestion that Johansson and Costa should be called journeymen just because they're not Top 10 and don't have a flurry of media attention around them - they've been established Top 30 players for years, Johansson was the former winner of a Super 9 event in Montreal and Costa is one of the leading players in clay-court titles won. Both of them had reached Grand Slam quarter-finals before.

Frankly, in the kind of competitive and changing environment on the men's tour, it's arrogant to expect that the new crop of young Slam favourites should instantly snap into action and start asserting their dominance, because they're in a very competitive field. I can only hope that my favourites win a Slam in the future, not expect them to start dominating everyone in sight.

And please lay off criticising them for their performances at this year's AO. Hewitt lost to a man who would have beaten anyone in the world with a serving day like he had, Federer lost in five sets to a man who's he never beaten who has beaten him in his home tournament, Safin was hampered with a wrist injury from the start that forced his withdrawal, and Roddick... well, how on earth can you complain about him losing his semi after a five-hour match won 21-19 in the fifth? Almost anyone out there would be tired, and as he pointed out afterwards Schuettler's the last guy you'd want to face when you're not 100%. The only one who could be criticised for his performance is Ferrero, and even he lost to a 'journeyman' who is a tour veteran and an established threat at the Aussie Open.

And as for Tennis fool's admittance of being a Williams fan - please! :rolleyes: You richly deserve your own username. The only thing interesting about their endless Grand Slam contests is who can shriek the louder, a battle that Serena's now winning. And don't try and point out that their latest squabble lasted over an hour longer than the men's final, because for my money the result was just as predictable in both matches.
 

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I dont think that long match is an excuse alone for Roddicks failure. As I said, long matches happened before, and the level of confidence he should have got from that match would NEED to be at least 100 times bigger than his fatigue.
As I said, Guga did beat Russell in a big match that lasted (what?) 4 hours and something, and yet managed to win THREE more matches against top level opponents at 24 years-old or so.
It seems totally illogical to me why Roddick as a young guy full of energy as he is can run out of steam ALL THE TIME once he has a big match.

That said, I now see the point of some of the people here.
Players are taking longer to develop, and they are really in trouble if the next bunch of players coming in can develop faster.
Thats a POSSIBILITY though, and it would make it all even more thrilling, in my opinion.
I really hope the Youzhnys, Gasquets and Mathieus can get to their best faster. It would be nice.
But as of now, the mental part of young players is fragile. Thats what they dont win.
Rebecca even used an example that should paint this picture quite well: Nalbandian beats Federer because he is mentally stronger. Well, in my opinion, David is the most fragile of the argies after, say, Coria. :eek: Yet Federer manages to be worse.
 

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I also need to point out that the Williams sisters dominance is shit because they are like a "duo package". Buy one get two.
If we had a dominance of say 10 players, the later rounds would be more exciting.
But having two players exchanging places for number one is shit.
Unless you can be a fan of them, and find anything of thrilling on their games.... Which I for one cant.
 

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Yes, Nalbandian is extremely prone to bouts of racket-throwing and petulance and go walkabout for long periods as he did towards the end of last year, which makes his repeated beating of Federer and Henman all the more irritating... I just think that their attacking games match up well to his in the way that, in the next round, Schuettler's didn't, hence the one-sided score.

As for Kuerten, well, I still think experience at the top level and having won Roland Garros twice, and drawing on the support of the French crowd, gave him an advantage over Roddick in terms of mental and physical recovery. In some cases, being older actually means being fitter, as some young bodies have yet to fully develop, and I think this is still the case with Roddick - he's somewhat physically immature and he does put a lot of intensity and passion into his matches, too much for my liking.

I've forgotten, who was it Guga played in the RG quarters after Russell?
 

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Discussion Starter · #77 ·
But as of now, the mental part of young players is fragile. Thats what they dont win.
I don't think it's just mental part. It's priorities. Safin has said it many times that tennis is just his business. And his life is much more than tennis. Would Sampras ever say so? Or McEnroy? This generation seems to be just satisfied with money and endorsements they earn, with their position as stars. And that results in Agassi and Sampras overachieving at the moment. With the least talented but the most determined of them - Hewitt- being currently the best of them. Don't you remember Safin playing tournament after tournament injured because of money, and losing almost whole season because of that.. Have you ever heard of those old stars playing injured because of money? Different priorities.. As simple as that..
 

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Well, what applies to Safin doesn't I think apply to the other young players. It's true that Safin has said he has other interests outside tennis, enjoys the partying lifestyle he gets to lead and wants a wider life with friends outside the sport; he's never going to have the same single-minded focus as Sampras, for instance. I can't say whether that's a good or bad thing, since it's something about his character that you really can't change, but it means he is never going to be the all-conquering multiple Grand Slam winner he was once heralded as.

As far as the others are concerned, I don't think you can say that they're only interested in money, sponsors and publicity one bit. It's true that they're more image-conscious than their forebears, but that hasn't dulled their passion for the game. In particular, Ferrero always strikes me as the most straight-ahead, determined player on court; with him what you see is what you get, and I feel that the times he didn't live up to expectations last year he was almost trying too hard. Equally someone like Federer, although he has been criticised for being too casual and showy and not having enough steel, is growing into the role.

Unlike talent, mental toughness isn't something you're necessarily born with, it's something you can pick up through experience. Hewitt is of course a special case, and that toughness is what enhances his relatively simple retrieving game, but in their own way the other leading contenders are equally committed. It's not that they don't want to succeed, it's that they're finding it hard in a deeply competitive men's field.
 

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Oh of course, the Y-Man again; him and Ferrero are Guga's two lucky charms at Roland Garros, but considering that the year before in 2000 they both had him down two sets to one and a break they really should be kicking themselves...
 
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