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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Doesn't it look like we are having a generation of N(obodies), N(on-greats) these days?

Overhyped new balls do not perform as expected. The only one of them who more or less met expectation is Hewitt, but it looks like he is heading into some crisis as well. Safin can't get back on track. Ferrero looked promising at some Slams , but always finds the right time for a meltdown. Federer's mind and game is elsewhere. Sampras and Agassi play much less impressive tennis than they played 2-3 years ago, yet they won last two Slams. It starts more and more looking like this generation simply doesn't want. Previously, at any given time there were at least 3-4 active players who could be considered one of greats. But with Courier and Boris retired, we are left with two remaining dynosaurs and pretty much nobody after them. It is not their great form that keeps Agassi and Sampras from retiring. It's just that the form of whole tour is degrading quicker than the game of Andre and Pete is degrading with age. After they retire we could easily be looking into one-slam-wonder-fest for few more years.

Who could stop that? I hate to say that, but the only one from contemporary youngs that seems to be able to combine a tennis talent, physical power and mental determination to become a great player could be Roddick.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I seem to recall a certain Andre Agassi had people wondering wether or not he'd ever fulfill his promise when he was younger, and lose his first three slam finals...
Yes, but to balance it, by then we had Courier, Sampras, Becker, Edberg. And now? And to think that either of Federer, Ferrero, Safin or Haas can be even considered in the same league as Agassi in terms of talent is a bit of exxageration.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
My point was merely that you are looking at a group of guys who are young, and seem to be saying that none of them have 2 or 3 slams in them - yet Roddick has tons of them?
No. 2 or 3 Slams would put them in the league of brugueras. kafelnikovs, rafters or kuertens, who are certainly notable players. But we are talking about prospects for becoming one of all-time greats. We are talking about players with Tour-dominating potential. I can imagine Roddick dominating the Tour. Perhaps Safin could do that too, if he'd get a new head from somewhere, but as long as he is saying that he is not prepared to sacrifice his other joys of life for tennis, I wouldn't bet on it. Ferrero or Federer? Nope.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Besides, didn't you see a question mark in the title of the thread? And plenty of "could", "would", "seem"s?

I am not making any conclusion. I am stating a possibility, which, as it seems to me, becomes more and more distinct. And I am not asking you or anyone to rule out or support that conclusion. Because there is no conclusion. Do I state that what I wrote is a certainty? No. What I am asking you is your opinion about what do you think is going to happen. You don't have to say that these players are still young and could become all-time greats. Because it is obvious. But what I am asking is what do you think the chances of that are? What do you think is the likeliest scenario? How much is a possibility that there will indeed be a Generation N?
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Look at the original New Balls - most of them - Haas, Kiefer, Philippoussus, Lapentti, Gambill will probably be listed as "veterans" as soon as next year. And how many Slams do they have among them? Kuerten - no matter how many non-clay non-slams he wins, will go into history as one surface player, as long as he does not make his mark in Slams on other surfaces. And he should never have been considered a New Ball, to start with. Jolly Roger.. Maybe.. Maybe not. Most likely not. Safin.. Perhaps the most realistic chance for becoming a big player from all generation.. But, we all know what the problem is.. Hewitt.. With his intensity it's impossible to last very long. And to win, he has to play with maximum intensity. At times he already looks like a burnout. All these guys look like satsfied veterans no longer having a drive to be the best. It's no wonder that we already start looking for a big aplyer rom the next generation - Roddick, Youzhnyi, Matheiu as a potential future great.. That is, for those who still have a drive..
 

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Discussion Starter · #43 ·
If todays generation is such apparent crap, what are you watching for, when you could dip over to the WTA where you will be blessed with all time greats and potential greats?
Sometimes, your posts really disappoint me. Sometimes you sound smart beyond your age, but not this time. What's a point of asking stupid rhetoric questions, which are as well based on something that I've never said. I repeat the n-th time in this thread. I am not discussing whether generation is crap or not. I am discussing a possibility, which now looks like a clear probability for anyone capable of thinking, that this generation ( unlike any previous generations ) might end up producing no all-time greats. And I am talking about what is a differential between these guys and those who played the game, 10-20-30 years ago. But instead, you are just repeatedly picking on something I never said to be a certainty.
 

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Discussion Starter · #59 ·
So my point was perfectly clear.
No, dear, it wasn't.. I understood the "contradict" word ( yes, it was difficult, but I did ). What I failed to understand is what contradicts what. I know the way lady's logics works is sometimes a very sophisticated process, so I beg you to elaborate the sources of that contradiction...
 

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Discussion Starter · #72 ·
Are you trying to tell me that if Ferrero doesn't win Roland Garros this year that he'll never win it? lol
It's not as funny as it sounds. I am not sure about one this year. But if he doesn't win one of two next RGs, my bet will go against him ever doing that. You don't have much time to reach your goals, because the next generation of Roddick, Youzhnyi, Mathieu, Gasquet, etc will be at full swing very soon, and if one particular Slam really prefers fresh young legs, it's RG. And that next generation doesn't seem to be that much of generation of spoiled non-motivated brats..
 

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Discussion Starter · #77 ·
But as of now, the mental part of young players is fragile. Thats what they dont win.
I don't think it's just mental part. It's priorities. Safin has said it many times that tennis is just his business. And his life is much more than tennis. Would Sampras ever say so? Or McEnroy? This generation seems to be just satisfied with money and endorsements they earn, with their position as stars. And that results in Agassi and Sampras overachieving at the moment. With the least talented but the most determined of them - Hewitt- being currently the best of them. Don't you remember Safin playing tournament after tournament injured because of money, and losing almost whole season because of that.. Have you ever heard of those old stars playing injured because of money? Different priorities.. As simple as that..
 

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Discussion Starter · #85 ·
You sincerely believe Ferrero, et al will eventually win a Slam, no matter what their age?
Of course she believes, otherwise what kind of fan would she be.. But, keep in mind, better and more talented, than Ferrero, clay players used to end up without RG crown just because of not doing it at the right time..
 

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Discussion Starter · #127 ·
Gee, enough!!! Is there a boxing match here?
Becca is such a fighter:). Sometimes it seems to me that even when someone agrees with her, she would change the sides to continue fighting..


Serena and Venus may well be different off-court, but on court they have very similar games - big serves, crunching backhands, interminable yelling (which admittedly we have to thank Seles for, it's not their fault) and frequent sloppy errors. When they match up together it's as dull as ditchwater, especially when you know that Serena's eventually going to gain the upper hand.
That doesn't matter for us , though. Watching AO final I realised that the two were playing on the level ( in terms of speed and power ) unthinkable for any other player. For as long as they want it - they will be winning everything they play - we'll have to live with that..
 

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Discussion Starter · #142 ·
but it's been known for decades that black people are naturally better athletes than white people.
It's quite disputable. They are naturally better athlets in terms of raw power, but when it is a combination of raw power and something else, it is not that obvious. They are better runner. They are better jumpers. Basketball? Yes. But make it a bit more technical, make some tool other than arms and legs involved - like pole vault instead of high jump, and voila, no people of African descent in business. Ice chockey? Very little. Cycling? Skiing? Tennis? Except for a couple of exceptions, very few of African-xxxxxans. But make it a bit more strategic - like football ( in its original meaning ), and while blacks are a significant part of the game, it is still dominated by people of European descent.

Or, BTW, those who think this conversation is racist rather than scientific, please don't bother answering.
 

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Discussion Starter · #147 ·
Yes, but I think that Steffi at her prime was every bit as good as them. Amanda or ASV at their best could probably get even more balls back than Williamses - they however could not get them back with enough power..
 

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Discussion Starter · #149 ·
Tennis, golf, ice skating are elite sports that cost in terms of court time, equipment, etc. Those who have traditionally dominated were those who have the finances to afford these sports.
We are not talking golf, right? I hate golf..:)

But, where I live ( and I guess in most of USA ), tennis costs next to nothing. Courts are free, rackets are rather expensive, but you can always find a budget solution. And as to finances. Do you think the average population of , say, Russia is more prosperous than average African-American family? I doubt it. I am rather, it's the opposite. Yet, they produce tennis players and hockey players and cyclists and skiers in numbers. Most of Russian, Chinese, Indian immigrants come to USA with few bucks in pocket ( I , personally, had $3k, when I came here, and most of it I would pay in the first very day as a downpayment for apartment ). What financial advantage do they have comparing to African-Americans? Yet, they found a way to play those sports and make their kids play those sports.
 

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Discussion Starter · #152 ·
I wonder how Graf in her heyday would fare against them at their best now?
I doubt that Steffi would have been really dominated by ANY player big time. And at her best she had as much speed as Williamses. In fact, it is a known fact that she was so fast, that she could have been a part of German track and field team.

You know - coincidental or not - Williamses could not make any real breakthrough - for as long as Graf was active. I do not know how to even explain it. I mean, 1997 US Open, Venus makes final, Venus first Slam breakthrough. No Graf. 1998, Lipton, first big tournament breakthrough by Venus. No Graf. 1999 US Open, first Grand Slam title by Williams. Graf has already retired. And after that it was all Williams. Right after Graf retired. Could be coincidence. Cound be not.
 

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Discussion Starter · #161 ·
Russians and Chinese athletes grew up under a communist system where many of these sports were financed by the government. Even the young Russians now first grew up under a communist system.
Bullshit. How old were the oldest of them - Kournikova, Dementieva - when USSR stopped to exist? 10 years old. Other girls are younger. It's a well known fact, true story, which now became a part of Kournikova mythology, that Anna's parents had to sell their colour TV to buy Anna her first tennis racket. So much for communist financing.. And where were all those successful Russian before? Believe it or not, the last player, for whom Communist system of sports training did play a significant role in Russia was Kafelnikov.
 

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Discussion Starter · #162 ·
As if this thread actually managed to get uglier than it was before I went to bed last night
What is ugly about it now, Becca? We don't call each other names, don't talk shit. Even if we are talking about such delicate subject as race, we keep it civilised. It's nto WTAWorld, after all..;)
 
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