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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Supposedly, the higher ranked you are, the easier your path in the tournament (objectively speaking). Yet Djokovic has drawn higher seeds than both Federer AND Nadal:

As the No. 1 seed, the average rank of Djokovic's first 3 opponents is 75
As the No. 2 seed, the average rank of Federer's first 3 opponents is 85
As the No. 6 seed, the average rank of Nadal's first 3 opponents is....... 249 :shrug:

Entering Roland Garros as the No. 1 seed, average rank of 1st round opponent of:
Nadal: 72
Djokovic: 80
Federer: 118 :shrug:


And this definitely isn't the first slam. It really goes to show how much more difficult Djokovic's draws have been vs. the other two.
 

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Again, you are using numbers to come up with the conclusion that works for you. Why not show what was the average opponent for Federer when he was #1 and when Rafa was #1 and then there are so many combinations. How much data did you lose? How far back do we go? Nole's draw is a piece of cake in this tournament until the quarters. It's bad luck that he got Rafa here... bad luck for Rafa
 

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Luck of the draw, get over it.
 

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Yeah... Nieminen, Muller, Kokkinakis and Gasquet is a death row for Djokovic.

Also, Almagro and the other guys Nadal faced are better than their ranking... for example Almagro took a set off Djokovic at MC - which his "death row" couldn't do in total of 9 sets.

Imo Djoko has ridiculously easy draw before QF.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Yeah... Nieminen, Muller, Kokkinakis and Gasquet is a death row for Djokovic.

Also, Almagro and the other guys Nadal faced are better than their ranking... for example Almagro took a set off Djokovic at MC - which his "death row" couldn't do in total of 9 sets.

Imo Djoko has ridiculously easy draw before QF.
This thread is about SEEDS, not whatever ranking someone is supposedly capable of playing up to.

Again, you are using numbers to come up with the conclusion that works for you. Why not show what was the average opponent for Federer when he was #1 and when Rafa was #1 and then there are so many combinations. How much data did you lose? How far back do we go? Nole's draw is a piece of cake in this tournament until the quarters. It's bad luck that he got Rafa here... bad luck for Rafa
My thread asked a question; it did not make a conclusion. Anyway:

Entering Roland Garros as the No. 1 seed, average rank of 1st round opponent of:
Nadal: 72
Djokovic: 80
Federer: 118 :shrug:
 

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Supposedly, the higher ranked you are, the easier your path in the tournament (objectively speaking). Yet Djokovic has drawn higher seeds than both Federer AND Nadal:

As the No. 1 seed, the average rank of Djokovic's first 3 opponents is 75
As the No. 2 seed, the average rank of Federer's first 3 opponents is 85
As the No. 6 seed, the average rank of Nadal's first 3 opponents is....... 249 :shrug:

And over their careers at the French Open


And this definitely isn't the first slam. It really goes to show how much more difficult Djokovic's draws have been vs. the other two.
Link not working.

I'll go out on a limb here, and say no, even though I can't be bothered to do any research either.

By the way, if you analysed every player's career in terms of how tough their opponents were relative to what they could have been based on each player's seeding, you will find that some players got higher-ranked opponents than other players, on average.

As we all know, this doesn't tell the whole story though, because rankings are based on 12 months, not current form/injuries etc., and also because of match-up issues.

tl;dr Who cares?
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Link not working.

I'll go out on a limb here, and say no, even though I can't be bothered to do any research either.

By the way, if you analysed every player's career in terms of how tough their opponents were relative to what they could have been based on each player's seeding, you will find that some players got higher-ranked opponents than other players, on average.

As we all know, this doesn't tell the whole story though, because rankings are based on 12 months, not current form/injuries etc., and also because of match-up issues.

tl;dr Who cares?
This is about players while being ranked No. 1
 

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Yeah... Nieminen, Muller, Kokkinakis and Gasquet is a death row for Djokovic.

Also, Almagro and the other guys Nadal faced are better than their ranking... for example Almagro took a set off Djokovic at MC - which his "death row" couldn't do in total of 9 sets.

Imo Djoko has ridiculously easy draw before QF.
Nadal's draw is hideous, when was the last time he got a "dangerous floater" early on? (apart from Kyrgios at Wimbledon last year, who was then an unknown).
Look at Berdych getting Tsonga, or Murray getting Chardy, Ferrer gets Cilic.
It is not just ranking as SheepleBuster has alluded to.
 

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Yes he does. It's a joke really. Nadal always has the easiest draws by far, the stats show this. But some of his fans are so deluded they said his last Wimbledon draw was hard when he played the mighty Rosol, Klizan, Kukushkin and Kyrgios! So don't expect some of them to admit his draws are easy. If he played ball boys all tournament and Djoker played Roger, Rafito and Murray on a loop some of his deranged fangirls would find a way to say that was easier for Novak, inadvertently praising him.

But great players don't need easy draws to dominate. See 2011. Djoker thrives against the best, whereas Nadal picks up scraps.
 

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This is about players while being ranked No. 1
The subject line is:

Does Djokovic always get the higher-seeded opponents (vs. Federer & Nadal)?

The same issues would apply in relation to this new question, except there would be greater variation in outcomes because of the smaller number of "trials" (draws) being studied.

 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
The subject line is:

Does Djokovic always get the higher-seeded opponents (vs. Federer & Nadal)?
Is it too much to ask to read the OP that goes along with the subject line?

The same issues would apply in relation to this new question, except there would be greater variation in outcomes because of the smaller number of "trials" (draws) being studied.

Going into RG, Federer was the No. 1-seeded player 6 times. Not 500 times.

We're talking about ACTUAL draws, not the probability of being seeded first in 500+ draws.
 

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Supposedly, the higher ranked you are, the easier your path in the tournament (objectively speaking). Yet Djokovic has drawn higher seeds than both Federer AND Nadal:

As the No. 1 seed, the average rank of Djokovic's first 3 opponents is 75
As the No. 2 seed, the average rank of Federer's first 3 opponents is 85
As the No. 6 seed, the average rank of Nadal's first 3 opponents is....... 249 :shrug:

Entering Roland Garros as the No. 1 seed, average rank of 1st round opponent of:
Nadal: 72
Djokovic: 80
Federer: 118 :shrug:


And this definitely isn't the first slam. It really goes to show how much more difficult Djokovic's draws have been vs. the other two.
It's not just about the rankings it's much more about the surface specialists i.e. the best and in form players on the surface, HC, grass, clay.

That's why he always landed in Federer' half at HC slams 2008-2011 while Federer was Peakerer and usually at RG in Nadal's.

Since Peakerer became Olderer he is no longer (since 2012) in Djokovic half anymore but always Nadal's at HC slams and Wimb. whereas Djokovic always gets Stanimal at HC slams instead.

But lately they also put almost every contender in Djokovic half so that Fedal or Federer has the easiest and Djokovic hardest possible draw.

e.g. Djokovic would always play Wawrinka and Nishikori at AO+USO where they are Stanimal and Samurai while Federer or Fedal gets Wawrinka and Nishi at Wimb. and RG only where they were not that strong in bo5 as at HC slams.

So at next Wimb. and USO Fedal shall again be on the other side from Djokovic whereas the best grass players + dark horses in Djokovic half.

For Wimb.'15 it means Djokovic, Murray, Cilic, Dimitrov, Tsonga ... (in early stages Stepanek + servers) in one half, Fedal in the other.

For USO'15 it means Djokovic, Wawrinka, Nishikori, Cilic and probably Murray in the same half as the last USO (+ Cilic).

Nadal was never in Djokovic half at HC slam since USO 2007 Fed-Djok final, so the next Fed-Djok final was Wimb.'14 only, with countless Fed-Djok SFs in between.
 

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Who cares about it? about opponents in first 3 matches if top-players never have problems with them. Opponents in the second week much more important.
 

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This thread is about SEEDS
So about gardening then? Ok...

"Only gardening is important and even that is not very important" - Chinese proverb

But you're wrong, OP listed rankings...

Nadal's draw is hideous, when was the last time he got a "dangerous floater" early on? (apart from Kyrgios at Wimbledon last year, who was then an unknown).
As I already said Almagro was a dangerous floater, took a set off Djoko at MC.

How about Isner on first round RG...

Look at Berdych getting Tsonga, or Murray getting Chardy, Ferrer gets Cilic.
Chardy? Cilic? :rolleyes:

Boy I'm happy Rafa didn't face them! :p
 

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Supposedly, the higher ranked you are, the easier your path in the tournament (objectively speaking).
The rules are simple.

1st seed gets either 3rd or 4th seed in his half.
2nd seed gets either 3rd or 4th seed in his half.
Each of the 1st to 4th seed gets one of the 5th to 8th seed in their quarter.
...


Objectively speaking one cannot say "Supposedly, the higher ranked you are, the easier your path in the tournament" because the 2nd seed can easily get an easier path. These are the present rules.
 

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Is it too much to ask to read the OP that goes along with the subject line?



Going into RG, Federer was the No. 1-seeded player 6 times. Not 500 times.

We're talking about ACTUAL draws, not the probability of being seeded first in 500+ draws.
:facepalm:

As I said, the fewer trials you undertake (Fed being seeded 1st six times is quite a small number), the more likely you are to observe dispersion in the average rank of players in his draw compared with other players seeded first, who were so seeded even fewer times than him even.

You keep editing your OP, so it is a bit of a moving target.
 

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Djokovic always gets the more difficult draws than Federer and Nadal. That is the fact. Not necessary translates to highest seed.
 
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