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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
What is everyone's thoughts? It looked slower this year but today during thiem-nishikori tennis channel using hawkeye said the main court started at cpi of 35 on day 1 ( maybe why fed said it was slower) and is hitting roughly cpi of 40 on day 5?

for 2017 the tour finals was 42.1 average main court but i guess that was average considering all the days.

Realistically, i think since the cpi went from 35 on day 1 to 40 by day 5 and we have Fri, Sat, and Sunday so 3 full days of play left it should be nearly 41-42 for the saturday-sunday weekend?


here is the court speed 2018 data starting with end of 2017 data... my god cincy 2018 this year was 31.6!!!

https://www.perfect-tennis.com/masters-1000-court-speed-in-2018/
 

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What is everyone's thoughts? It looked slower this year but today during thiem-nishikori tennis channel using hawkeye said the main court started at cpi of 35 on day 1 ( maybe why fed said it was slower) and is hitting roughly cpi of 40 on day 5?

for 2017 the tour finals was 42.1 average main court but i guess that was average considering all the days.

Realistically, i think since the cpi went from 35 on day 1 to 40 by day 5 and we have Fri, Sat, and Sunday so 3 full days of play left it should be nearly 41-42 for the saturday-sunday weekend?


here is the court speed 2018 data starting with end of 2017 data... my god cincy 2018 this year was 31.6!!!

https://www.perfect-tennis.com/masters-1000-court-speed-in-2018/
In this article, a chart of CPI at WTF since 2011
https://www.perfect-tennis.com/federer-stays-alive-in-london-with-victory-over-thiem/
 

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2018 "medium-fast" my ass... yet there's many people on here that will continue to spread that fairy tale. 2016-2017 is how it should be as most other relevant HC tournaments have a CPI of give or take 35 already.
 

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How was it suddenly faster for 2016 (W. Murray), and 2017 (Fed favorite), and again slowed down in 2018?
Weird.

Changes from 34 to 36, or 40 to 38 is understandable, but a drop from 42 to 34 or jump from 34 to 40 can't be put down to randomness.
 

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Well the ball is bouncing really high so it’s gotta be at least somewhat slow
This. I think the high bouncing threw Federer off in the first round. Nadal-like moonballing with spin can be very successfull here, as Federer clearly showed against Anderson, when he adapted his tactics.

Conditions favour Djokovic, who is the main favourite anyways. I guess under this conditions, also Nadal and Wawrinka could have done some damage.
 

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It's the same court speed as last year. Zverev even said in interview that it's "very fast". Bounce is "high" because it takes the spin well, but only from high net clearance shots. Someone even tried to say bounce is high based on Isner's serve. Hello, of course it's high when he serves from the ceiling.
Federer lost first match so everyone jumped on slow court excuse bandwagon. :shrug:
 

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It's the same court speed as last year.
CPI clearly says otherwise, but if you think one player's opinion is more credible, I guess there's no use in trying to change your mind.

Federer lost first match so everyone jumped on slow court excuse bandwagon.
I make my conclusions about measurable and/or observable things such as court pace completely unrelated to results of any one player I like or dislike. Maybe you should try the same some time.
 

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CPI clearly says otherwise, but if you think one player's opinion is more credible, I guess there's no use in trying to change your mind.



I make my conclusions about measurable and/or observable things such as court pace completely unrelated to results of any one player I like or dislike. Maybe you should try the same some time.
CPI doesn't say otherwise. Even OP posted that CPI values were "roughly 40" on day 5. On day of final it will be close to or faster than last year. It's also obvious from watching tournament and different styles how court reacts to different strokes, net clearance and that's in upper medium fast category.
 

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How is it even possible that it goes from 35 to 40 in five days? That just doesn't sound right. They are playing indoors, so no elements or anything. They have played four matches every day. No way the court gets worn out that much. There must be a error in their numbers or it's something else?

Is the ITF's court pace rating a different system and different way of measuring the speed?
 

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How is it even possible that it goes from 35 to 40 in five days? That just doesn't sound right. They are playing indoors, so no elements or anything. They have played four matches every day. No way the court gets worn out that much. There must be a error in their numbers or it's something else?

Is the ITF's court pace rating a different system and different way of measuring the speed?
from what i know they do have a unit to measure the initial CPI after building the court, after that it's calculated by hawk eye. maybe the respective calculations may vary, it's not surprising for the CPI to go up along wear and tear on the court tho. 5 points do seem reasonable enough.
 

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But the math doesn't really add up. The other courts don't speed up like that. The Arthur Ashe stadium should be something like 45-50 on the finals day and it's very obvious it's nowhere near that.
 

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Don't think the court looks fast at all. Medium-slow or medium at best.

I read they are going to store the court after this WTF to use it again next year in the name of sustainability. I wonder how the court will play next year. HCs get a bit faster with some play so I wonder if they let it play like that or if they paint it again with some sand.

Anyway, that kind of a massive change in CPI in five days is suspicious and I think there's been an error somewhere. Though I wouldn't be surprised if the O2 court actually gets faster than other HC main courts; unlike at slams and M1000s, the WTF has quite a lot of doubles on the main court so it gets more wear inside the court.
 

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iirc shanghai centre this year started around 34 and ended at roughly 40, so it might fit.
and please don't be fooled to think HC courts speeding up while being played on is a linear process and you could easily project a CPR after x amount of matches in y time passed.
 

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But it just doesn't make any sense? Shanghai and London mysteriously speed up from medium slow to medium fast in five days but the Grand Slam courts stay the same for 14 days? There should be a reason for this if those numbers even are true. I'm not all that sure anymore.
 
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