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Old 10-31-2006, 01:13 PM   #1
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Default Players with MYSTIQUE [Rafa`s evolution, joins list]~> more than just winning %..!

Here`s my TOP 10 players who had/have mystique [Open Era]...

*1. Rod Laver [partial Open Era] ~ achieved the Grand Slam [all 4-Slams] in 62 & 69 = MISTIQUE
1. Bjorn Borg ~ so dominant, so mysterious, retired suddenly at his peak! Lost USO final 4-times.
2. Roger Federer ~ freakish talent, 3/4 slams twice [04, 06], speaks 4-languages, prone to crying!
3. John McEnroe ~ rude man/child who also happened to have freakish talent, can we be serious?
4. Jimmy Connors ~ not for talent but for record titles, longevity & guts etc. 3/4 slams in 1974!
5. Andre Agassi ~ from "image is everything" to "disciplined elder monk"! Completes career slam in 99!

6. Mats Wilander ~ wins 3/4 slams in 1988 & then never comes close again! Drugs! All surface fighter..
7. Boris Becker ~ wins Wimby at 17yrs, won AO way past his prime, kinky! Red-haired heart-throb?!
8. Rafael Nadal ~ wins FO 3-years in a row [21-0], pushes FED to limit in Wimby final, pirate evolution!
9. Ivan Lendl ~ initially a choker & holds several records, made 19 slam finals! Obsessed by Wimby!
10. John Newcombe ~ got to #1 at age 30yrs, nice guy kicked arse & the moustache! Charismatic/fiery!



##...As you can see this is a pseudo list for greatest ever in the Open Era
... Of course if we just go by the numbers then Sampras is out in front, however I believe the legacy of these great players also had a lot to do with their mistique ... I wonder if anybody agrees with me

Who do you consider had the greatest mistique in the Open Era ...

PS. Don`t feel obliged to narrow it down to Slam winners~ if you think somebody else had greater mistique [such as Rios, Henman ] etc.. then by all means let me know

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Old 10-31-2006, 01:17 PM   #2
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

I've always liked Ivan "the terrible". He's a great example of someone that probably only got to numbr one and made all his records by sheer will alone. And anyone that bean balls McEnroe at the net whenever he got the chance is always high on my list of coolness.
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Old 10-31-2006, 01:24 PM   #3
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

I'd go with
1. Borg (just ridiculous natural talent and didn't really seem to care)
2. Federer(same as borg essentially. heh)
3. Lendl. Self-made champion. No apologies from this guy. He was out there to win and not make friends and never pretended he was doing anything otherwise. Vintage Lendl:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xAPwx3z950
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Old 10-31-2006, 01:29 PM   #4
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernham View Post
I've always liked Ivan "the terrible". He's a great example of someone that probably only got to numbr one and made all his records by sheer will alone. And anyone that bean balls McEnroe at the net whenever he got the chance is always high on my list of coolness.

Cheers .. I liked Lendl too~>> especially when his game was dismantled by Cash [my hero at the time] in the 87 Wimby final
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Old 10-31-2006, 01:32 PM   #5
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

I'm surprised you have Agassi on your list- IMHO he is one of the least mystic and most superficial players the game has ever seen.

I have never bought into all this "elder of the game" BS as the media have tried to portray him- deep down he is the same as he always was. The only difference is with age he matured and became more experienced and knew how to hide the bratty facet of his personality better and put on his "elder spokesman" face. Every now and then there would be some external circumstance which would peel that mask off e.g. St. Poelten 2004.
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Old 10-31-2006, 01:33 PM   #6
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernham View Post
I'd go with
1. Borg (just ridiculous natural talent and didn't really seem to care)
2. Federer(same as borg essentially. heh)
3. Lendl. Self-made champion. No apologies from this guy. He was out there to win and not make friends and never pretended he was doing anything otherwise. Vintage Lendl:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xAPwx3z950

Yeah Lendl was nasty ~>> but that`s what made him cool

BTW that youtube footage- where was it? Seemed to be a big/vocal crowd for an MM tourney .. Stadium wasn`t familiar but I guess it`s somewhere in the Western states of America
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Old 10-31-2006, 01:38 PM   #7
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonE View Post
I'm surprised you have Agassi on your list- IMHO he is one of the least mystic and most superficial players the game has ever seen.

I have never bought into all this "elder of the game" BS as the media have tried to portray him- deep down he is the same as he always was. The only difference is with age he matured and became more experienced and knew how to hide the bratty facet of his personality better and put on his "elder spokesman" face. Every now and then there would be some external circumstance which would peel that mask off e.g. St. Poelten 2004.

I see you don`t like Agassi

MISTIQUE encapsulates a lot of things .. Remember Agassi was making the SFs at FO & USO in 1988 & then in 2005 he was still coming close [USO final]... 17-years of being near the top~ that`s the stuff of mystic!

Also the fact that he won Wimby 1st on his worst surface, FO last at the Slam he`d choked at most.. AO the most at the Slam he came to latest!! It`s all legendary

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Old 10-31-2006, 01:39 PM   #8
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonE View Post
I'm surprised you have Agassi on your list- IMHO he is one of the least mystic and most superficial players the game has ever seen.

I have never bought into all this "elder of the game" BS as the media have tried to portray him- deep down he is the same as he always was. The only difference is with age he matured and became more experienced and knew how to hide the bratty facet of his personality better and put on his "elder spokesman" face. Every now and then there would be some external circumstance which would peel that mask off e.g. St. Poelten 2004.
What happened in St. Pölten?
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Old 10-31-2006, 01:43 PM   #9
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

Quote:
Originally Posted by CmonAussie View Post

I see you don`t like Agassi

MYSTIC encapsulates a lot of things .. Remember Agassi was making the SFs at FO & USO in 1988 & then in 2005 he was still coming close [USO final]... 17-years of being near the top~ that`s the stuff of mystic!

Also the fact that he won Wimby 1st on his worst surface, FO last at the Slam he`d choked at most.. AO the most at the Slam he came to latest!! It`s all legendary
I thought you meant mystic in terms of his personality.

In terms of his tennis results, yes there is some truth to that and the fact that his career spanned as long as it did. But a lot of it has to do with the fact that he didn't take the game too seriously in the beginning and wasted many of his prime years and only decided to really buckle down and work hard late in his career is what enabled him to keep playing for as long as he did.
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Old 10-31-2006, 01:54 PM   #10
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

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Originally Posted by KaxMisha View Post
What happened in St. Pölten?
http://www.menstennisforums.com/show...ghlight=Agassi
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Old 10-31-2006, 01:56 PM   #11
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

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Originally Posted by RonE View Post
I'm surprised you have Agassi on your list- IMHO he is one of the least mystic and most superficial players the game has ever seen.

I have never bought into all this "elder of the game" BS as the media have tried to portray him- deep down he is the same as he always was. The only difference is with age he matured and became more experienced and knew how to hide the bratty facet of his personality better and put on his "elder spokesman" face. Every now and then there would be some external circumstance which would peel that mask off e.g. St. Poelten 2004.
Isn't learning to hide the bratty facet of one's personality called growing up? We were all brats to one extent or another as children and youths and learning to hide it, or overcome it most of the time is what we do when we grow up. Sometimes we get petulant as adults, but mostly when we start feeling that way, we try not to show it. Unfortunately, sometimes we fail.

Not apoligizing for Agassi though. I've never been a big fan of his, but it does seem to me that he has shown growth over the years. And as far as showing "mystic" (mistique?) I think he was the most charismatic player of his generation.
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Old 10-31-2006, 02:01 PM   #12
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
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Old 10-31-2006, 02:09 PM   #13
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MYSTIC ~> more than just winning %..!

Quote:
Originally Posted by star View Post
Isn't learning to hide the bratty facet of one's personality called growing up? We were all brats to one extent or another as children and youths and learning to hide it, or overcome it most of the time is what we do when we grow up. Sometimes we get petulant as adults, but mostly when we start feeling that way, we try not to show it. Unfortunately, sometimes we fail.

Not apoligizing for Agassi though. I've never been a big fan of his, but it does seem to me that he has shown growth over the years. And as far as showing "mystic" (mistique?) I think he was the most charismatic player of his generation.
Good post, star. Having a temper and being a brat aren't the same thing. When he was young, he was a brat, no doubt about it. Whether you want to admit it, the guy has some serious talent - he just didn't give a crap when he was young. And now that we know what his life was like his behavior, while not acceptable, is at least understandable. Still, he was a complete jerk sometimes.

Saying "Fuck me" because he missed a shot isn't bratty behavior - it's just temper. The time he spit on that umpire was bratty behavior.
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Old 10-31-2006, 02:42 PM   #14
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MISTIQUE ~> more than just winning %..!

Reason i would put Borg ahead of Federer is that i think Borg was not just ridiculously gifted tennis player, but he dominated on the surfaces on the extremes from each other, clay and grass. It was almost like he was cursed in the US open hardcourts, and he pretty much never even bothered to play in the australian open. Like i said, it's almost as if he didn't really care much about his talent.
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Old 10-31-2006, 02:47 PM   #15
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Default Re: #``#..Players with MISTIQUE ~> more than just winning %..!

Mac, Connors and Nastase for upsetting the stuffed shirts/ old farts at the All England club. Woke them up. Coolness personified. Original bad boys.


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