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Old 03-31-2005, 10:00 AM   #31
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
lsy, considering I don't have a problem with talking about any players game and that includes the ones I loathe intensely, but the Federer threads on GM are a bit too much. I know I started one of them which was to joke about the backlash if he failed to repeat 2004, then the other was done by a friend of mine talking about different aspects of the game.
Considering I had read enough from you talking about tennis, you should know I wasn't talking about you.

What I can't stand are those who think they are better and yet I don't read anything from them that's remotely close to so called "intelligent" discussion and most of them are as bias when comes to their favourites.

The thing is with Federer's performance for the past year, he's going to attract the most bandwagon jumpers no doubt, and maybe some of the new fans who truly just spotted his tennis and are eager to talk about it. What are we going to do about it? As I said, don't like it, don't read it, or even better create other meaningful threads, than just do nth but whine the shit out of it.

Even funnier are the ones who won't stop complaining about his domination yet at the same time talking about come clay, there'll be at least a dozen or maybe 2 dozen who can beat Rogi. If so, then why not just sit down, shut the fxxk up and wait for the clay season to come? Why the need to keep whining about how boring it is him kept winning, or how boring federer's dicussion threads are?

I hope you get my point here
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:06 AM   #32
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by lsy
What I can't stand are those who think they are better and yet I don't read anything from them that's remotely close to so called "intelligent" discussion and most of them are as bias when comes to their favourites.
There are those that are around and I actually challenged some people from those fanbases from players I don't like to talk about that respective players game and nothing has come of it.

Quote:
The thing is with Federer's performance for the past year, he's going to attract the most bandwagon jumpers no doubt, and maybe some of the new fans who truly just spotted his tennis and are eager to talk about it. What are we going to do about it? As I said, don't like it, don't read it, or even better create other meaningful threads, than just do nth but whine the shit out of it.
Yes, it's a huge bandwagon isn't it? As you know the patterns change and come the clay season the Coria trolls will be out in force. Yes, I have been guilty of the wow! Roger won a match and why is it here on GM. It's not that easy to create some intelligent threads here.

Quote:
Even funnier are the ones who won't stop complaining about his domination yet at the same time talking about come clay, there'll be at least a dozen or maybe 2 dozen who can beat Rogi. If so, then why not just sit down, shut the fxxk up and wait for the clay season to come? Why the need to keep whining about how boring it is him kept winning, or how boring federer's dicussion threads are?
I got the point and people are strange.
__________________
On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:14 AM   #33
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
Ok, I don't deal that well with fans that can't take defeat and the Safin match showed your colours, so that is why I will always be sceptical.

That specific RG question has been dealt with and I gave my reasons as to why I haven't said anything of yet. If he doesn't win it and during the clay season, if he is defeated will you not make excuses for him if he loses?
I have said it before, I like Marat Safin, and his victory was deserved, nevertheless it was as close as it could get. BTW: this is also true for the Federere/Ferrero match in Dubai. A little bit of luck is sometimes also involved, although I would rate its contribution lower than a coach's

As for the excuses during the clay court season: We'll talk about them at due course. But this brings me to another question? What is an excuse for you? For me, admitting to have played badly, is no excuse, but an explanation. Maybe a different view on these terms is behind our arguments
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:24 AM   #34
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Puschkin
I have said it before, I like Marat Safin, and his victory was deserved, nevertheless it was as close as it could get. BTW: this is also true for the Federere/Ferrero match in Dubai. A little bit of luck is sometimes also involved, although I would rate its contribution lower than a coach's
It's not a question of whether you like Safin or not. You struggled to accept the fact that Federer wasn't good enough when it counted on that day. You learn more about players and people in defeat than in victory.

Why do you need to know what my definition of what an excuse is? You were making them in the match that Federer lost, that is explanation enough.

If someone chokes a match away that is their fault, when they were dominating and couldn't close a match out it's all their own fault, then you get people say he only won because they choked, but what led to it is overlooked and the fact that the other player was better when it counted and good enough to take advantage of it.
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On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:31 AM   #35
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
Yes, it's a huge bandwagon isn't it? As you know the patterns change and come the clay season the Coria trolls will be out in force. Yes, I have been guilty of the wow! Roger won a match and why is it here on GM. It's not that easy to create some intelligent threads here.
Yes it's not, but if you do, I still believe that there're quite a few posters around who can make it a worth reading thread, including contribution from yourself of course. I wish I can, but I just haven't watched enough tennis. You'll do much better in such threads than the "oh wow Roger won a match" kind of threads

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
I got the point and people are strange.
no, not strange, just bias...and it's normal as I always say, I'm admittedly bias too. Just as long as they don't come out and start critisizing others like they are better, that's so bullshit.

Just one question to you GWH, since you and pushkin are on this "excuse" discussion. What about the fans who won't stop talking about Rogi beating Safin in AO last year was coz he was exhausted? Even Safin himself said that this year AO match was supposed to the "true" match, he also said that on the ceremony last year that he ran out of gas. Is that also excuse?
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:36 AM   #36
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by lsy
Yes it's not, but if you do, I still believe that there're quite a few posters around who can make it a worth reading thread, including contribution from yourself of course. I wish I can, but I just haven't watched enough tennis. You'll do much better in such threads than the "oh wow Roger won a match" kind of threads
I'll bring some good ones during the clay season I do my best work there.

Bias happens everywhere, it's just how it's handled which is the most important thing.

Safin fans are another league and I have given them crap for making excuses and I have said it's a small dream of mine, if they could one day admit Marat wasn't good enough on that day and was outplayed for whatever reason, but yes the excuse disease definitely exists there.
__________________
On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:37 AM   #37
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
You struggled to accept the fact that Federer wasn't good enough when it counted on that day.
That is not true and you know it. What I said was that Roger lost this match in the forth set and Marat won it in the fifth. I also said, that Roger lost it on matchpoint, because he went for being flashy, and by this I mean not only the shot through the legs, but the whole setup of the matchpoint. If you want to call that choking, I'd accept that, although I think it was something different, my feeling was that he wanted to end this tough battle with a clear proof for everybody to see that he is the better player, yes, this was hubris and he was punished for it.

As for the explanation/excuse definition: why do you shy away from it?
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:41 AM   #38
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

I have already given examples of excuses. Nalbandian makes too many of them when he loses and I am a fan of his and that pisses me off.

By saying Roger lost the match, automatically you are devaluing Marat's achievement saying that he only won the match because Roger lost it.
__________________
On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:48 AM   #39
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
I have already given examples of excuses. Nalbandian makes too many of them when he loses and I am a fan of his and that pisses me off.
I also like his game

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
By saying Roger lost the match, automatically you are devaluing Marat's achievement saying that he only won the match because Roger lost it.
But that is something else than making excuses for Roger. What you "accuse" me now is not giving Marat sufficient credit. Yeah, in this particular match under the circumstances described I am guilty of this sin.
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:50 AM   #40
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

It's an excuse as to why Marat won the match, because Roger lost it and he didn't win it.
__________________
On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:56 AM   #41
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
It's an excuse as to why Marat won the match, because Roger lost it and he didn't win it.
I have already stated before, that Marat won the match by his great performance in the fifth and by taking the match to a fifth set, and as the fifth set is the final one, the winner of the fifth is the winner of the match, it is as simple as that.
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Old 03-31-2005, 10:57 AM   #42
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Puschkin
I have already stated before, that Marat won the match by his great performance in the fifth and by taking the match to a fifth set, and as the fifth set is the final one, the winner of the fifth is the winner of the match, it is as simple as that.
If that was the case why make the excuses that Federer lost the match then? I am anticipating the clay season and I hope you have your book of excuses ready.
__________________
On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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Old 03-31-2005, 11:02 AM   #43
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
If that was the case why make the excuses that Federer lost the match then? I am anticipating the clay season and I hope you have your book of excuses ready.
I have the feeling that you want to provoke me into being rude, but I am not doing you this favour I remain with my interpretation of that match and you with yours.

As for the claycourt season, we'll see. I won't see too many matches I am afraid, I depend on Eurosport and German channels, so Hamburg will be one of the tourneys we can discuss and of course RG. I am looking forward to it, seriously
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Old 03-31-2005, 11:14 AM   #44
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Puschkin
I have the feeling that you want to provoke me into being rude, but I am not doing you this favour I remain with my interpretation of that match and you with yours.

As for the claycourt season, we'll see. I won't see too many matches I am afraid, I depend on Eurosport and German channels, so Hamburg will be one of the tourneys we can discuss and of course RG. I am looking forward to it, seriously
Provoking you that is not true, just stating the facts you make excuses for Roger's defeat at AO and will do so again when he loses his next match.
__________________
On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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Old 03-31-2005, 11:18 AM   #45
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Default Re: Why are non Federer fans....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeWHitler
Provoking you that is not true, just stating the facts you make excuses for Roger's defeat at AO and will do so again when he loses his next match.
The sickness rumours are already out, even before today's match, but keep in mind, it was not me who spread them
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