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Old 06-22-2013, 01:40 AM   #61
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

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Originally Posted by Honestly View Post
I don't think Nadal is winning this anyway. He has a monster task ahead of him. If he beats Fed then he faces Murray. And then Djokovic. It just gets harder for him.
implying mugray will put up any resistance against his master
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Old 06-22-2013, 01:42 AM   #62
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

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Originally Posted by End da Game View Post
with nadal, there are two extremes you can go to in order to beat him, either:

out push/grind him like djokovic does

or

ballbash everything
It's not that simple. Djokivic is more then just a pusher. He has a great bh which neutralizes Nadal's bh. Fed has beaten Nadal before doing neither extreme. He can beat him on a lower bouncing court where he doesn't have to hit his bh above his head. With Wimby it's difficult because the surface has changed so much. If it was still lowing bouncing he would own Nadal.
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Old 06-22-2013, 01:44 AM   #63
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

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implying mugray will put up any resistance against his master
He has beaten Nadal in slams before and he is a different player these days. No idea what you are laughing about.
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Old 06-22-2013, 01:45 AM   #64
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

if it rains and its roofed. Federer has maybe 10% chance. IF its outdoor then 0%.

He's not winning the title. His goal should be to prevent nadal from winning it by beating him or wearing him out to wear murray runs nadal down and out.
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Old 06-22-2013, 01:45 AM   #65
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

I got to say ... this whole be more "aggressive" is such a a fraudulent line being used by bum commentators. Every asshole on TV when asked about their opinion say "he needs to be more aggressive and hit the ball inside the court inside the lines or it will be out" I mean bull**** like that drives me crazy. lol.
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Old 06-22-2013, 01:48 AM   #66
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

Being aggressive is a complicated play against Nadal. He can't go for broke and play low percentage but he obviously can't be too passive because Rafa will dictate in the rallies. He has to approach off great shots and hit the forehand big when he can prepare for it.
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Old 06-22-2013, 01:49 AM   #67
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

Backhand slice down the line to Nadal's backhand every single time.

And by every single time I mean every single time Nadal directs a ball to Federer's backhand, which will be something like 75% of the time.
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Old 06-22-2013, 01:51 AM   #68
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

Hitting to Nadal's backhand in general sets him up in favourable positions in rallies. It's how he's beat him, by serving predominantly to that side and by hitting the FH there and making Rafa hit down the line on the BH to get to his own BH.
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Old 06-22-2013, 01:52 AM   #69
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

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Originally Posted by Kyle_Johansen View Post
Being aggressive is a complicated play against Nadal. He can't go for broke and play low percentage but he obviously can't be too passive because Rafa will dictate in the rallies. He has to approach off great shots and hit the forehand big when he can prepare for it.
Pretty much. There must be a balance and no room for error. He must serve well too.
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Old 06-22-2013, 01:56 AM   #70
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

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Backhand slice down the line to Nadal's backhand every single time.

And by every single time I mean every single time Nadal directs a ball to Federer's backhand, which will be something like 75% of the time.
Not the best idea imo. The slice will give Rafa plenty of time to run around the BH and whip FHs, plus his CC BH is pretty good on Grass anyway. If he can hit it topsin DTL it's much better, though I doubt he can do it consistently enough.
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Old 06-22-2013, 02:03 AM   #71
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

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Not the best idea imo. The slice will give Rafa plenty of time to run around the BH and whip FHs, plus his CC BH is pretty good on Grass anyway. If he can hit it topsin DTL it's much better, though I doubt he can do it consistently enough.
On any other surface I wouldn't suggest trying it, but on grass with Federer's biting slice I think he could keep it low enough to make it difficult for Nadal to do much with it. I think it's much more likely to result in a shot that Federer can do something with than attempting a crosscourt rally with Nadal off his backhand, and it would be higher percentage than trying to hit topspin down the line every time.
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Old 06-22-2013, 02:04 AM   #72
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

Slicing is not a good idea for the reasons mentioned above. If he can hit the BH DTL and force Rafa to hit to his FH that's a good play. And even if Rafa goes back up the line to Fed's backhand he can rip it cross court and force Rafa to scramble. Or he can run around the BH and hammer a forehand.
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Old 06-22-2013, 02:11 AM   #73
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

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Slicing is not a good idea for the reasons mentioned above. If he can hit the BH DTL and force Rafa to hit to his FH that's a good play. And even if Rafa goes back up the line to Fed's backhand he can rip it cross court and force Rafa to scramble. Or he can run around the BH and hammer a forehand.
Federer has never been able to hit topspin down the line with any consistency though. It can't be part of his strategy. I think slice would work on grass (better than trying to rally crosscourt), especially a short slice.
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Old 06-22-2013, 02:25 AM   #74
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

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If Nole loses to Rafa on grass, that really changes things. If he wins Wimbledon, he does not need 5 RGs.
novak would plough through snitchdal, this is not clay. 0 chance for the moonballer.

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Old 06-22-2013, 02:32 AM   #75
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Default Re: should federer and nadal meet (no merge please)

Since Madrid '09 there has been a very clear tactical plan for Federer to implement against Nadal. The key thing is the backhand slice/DTL. The only way Federer can consistently reset the rally once Nadal starts pummelling his BH is to go DTL and the slice is key in this. Nadal destroys his crosscourt slice but he does not hurt him off the DTL one especially since Rafa is a lot slower running around his FH than he once was.

Federer has implemented this tactic very well in several matches in the last few years and his losses and wins have been entirely down to form/mental game/surface. Tactics have not been an issue. That was until 2012 AO when after the drumming Nadal received at the WTF 2011 he realised what Federer's game plan was and found a way to counteract it. Namely, he started hitting his FH DTL to the Federer FH. With Fed camped out in the backhand corner looking to hit his BH DTL this won the point for Nadal over and over and Fed couldn't adjust. It's the reason he won that match. I was quite worried at this development but in their next two matches Nadal didn't do it as much.

Unfortunately, based on their two matches this year it seems Nadal has decided to permanently dispense with his old "hit to the BH" tactic and has realised that he can hit through Federer more easily than Federer can hit through Nadal nowadays. In both matches, Nadal was hitting his forehand to Federer's FH and overpowering him time and again. Nadal was very aggressive to both sides of the court and Federer was the one having to defend. Federer's defense could not handle this at all and seeing as he's slowed considerably in recent years I don't know how he can respond.

If the match does happen my advice to him would be to hit 95% of his BHs DTL and mainly with slice. Also, when he gets time on a forehand he needs to be as aggressive as possible to the point of recklessness. If the match plays out like the last two he will get very few forehands that he isn't defending on so he needs to make the most of them. However, if Nadal comes out and, as I expect, starts hitting hard crosscourt and DTL off the FH I don't know how Fed can respond. His only hope would be to just play a blinder in that scenario. I don't think he has anything tactically which can counteract that.
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