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Old 04-03-2013, 10:42 AM   #16
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

Berdych and Del Potro better than Ferrer on clay?

Is that a joke?
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:44 AM   #17
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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Originally Posted by Surcouf View Post
Berdych and Del Potro better than Ferrer on clay?

Is that a joke?
They're more dangerous but not necessarily better. In other words the same sort of comparison on hard court.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:45 AM   #18
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

I'd say Pics is more of a slow court specialist in general with his demanding grinding style. And yes, theoretically he should fare better on slow hardcourts than on clay due to his inability to generate a lot of pace. Same as Murray really
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:46 AM   #19
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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I don't think he would. There is a good reason he plays the events on clay. And is seeded due to that, which allow him to progress in some of the HC tournament he plays.

According to the ATP website stats, he has a losing record on all surfaces, excepted clay. The definition of a clay specialist. He was also unlucky to see his 3 1/4 run in Roland Garros being stopped by Nadal. If he was on the other side of the draw, he could have done better.
The fact remains he can still compete with almost anyone on a HC when not in mental midget mode
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:46 AM   #20
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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I'd say Pics is more of a slow court specialist in general with his demanding grinding style. And yes, theoretically he should fare better on slow hardcourts than on clay due to his inability to generate a lot of pace. Same as Murray really
Murray isn't a slow court player. Ferrer is better than Murray on clay despite having less weapons.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:49 AM   #21
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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Originally Posted by Surcouf View Post
Berdych and Del Potro better than Ferrer on clay?

Is that a joke?
Nope, it's undeniable fact.

Ferrer reaching his first RG SF at 30yo with one of the weakest draws conceivable and suddenly being hyped as some sort of great player on clay is the only joke here.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:49 AM   #22
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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Originally Posted by leng jai View Post
They're more dangerous but not necessarily better. In other words the same sort of comparison on hard court.
It depends for who. If it against Federer, yes, if it is against anyone else, no.

Ferrer has better clay seasons than both of them, more titles, and would beat them more times than the contrary in H2H matchs.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:50 AM   #23
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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Ferrer is better than Murray on clay despite having less weapons.
And why do you think that is? Do you think that will still be the case this season now Murray's FH is improved?
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:52 AM   #24
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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Nope, it's undeniable fact.

Ferrer reaching his first RG SF at 30yo with one of the weakest draws conceivable and suddenly being hyped as some sort of great player on clay is the only joke here.
Ferrer would have reached the SF in 2005 if he did not run into Nadal. Remmeber how far did Del Potro go when he run into Nadal at RG?

I admit that Ferrer has had a RG problem, where all the good play he had done during the clay season did not materialize in RG. But for the surface in general, he is much better than Berdych and Del Potro. And I am sure you did not forget that decisive Davis Cup match on clay.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:54 AM   #25
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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And why do you think that is? Do you think that will still be the case this season now Murray's FH is improved?
I think it is still the case, yes. Murray doesn't dictate and construct points, Ferrer does. Murray either attack or either defend. He doesnt build the point like claycourters do. Murray's forehand attack are good, his rally forehands aren't.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:56 AM   #26
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

Why the hell is everyone comparing different players? The idea of a court specialist is to compare his results on one surface with his results on all other surfaces - it's just 1 player.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:56 AM   #27
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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Originally Posted by Surcouf View Post
Ferrer would have reached the SF in 2005 if he did not run into Nadal. Remmeber how far did Del Potro go when he run into Nadal at RG?

I admit that Ferrer has had a RG problem, where all the good play he had done during the clay season did not materialize in RG. But for the surface in general, he is much better than Berdych and Del Potro. And I am sure you did not forget that decisive Davis Cup match on clay.
What? If he was in Federer's quarter instead of Nadal, he'd have lost. Hardly likely he'd beat Puerta or Davydenko either. Del Potro only played Nadal at RG once when he was 18yo, still put up a much better fight than Ferrer, not that that is saying much.

You have to be kidding, Del Potro was a few points away from being a Roland Garros champion; well not really, but he'd have been the clear favorite for the final against Soderling had he managed to put away Federer. He's far more threatening to all of Federer, Nadal and Djokovic than Ferrer. Berdych, I concede, is almost as non-threatening to Djokovic and Nadal as Ferrer on clay, but infinitely more threatening to Federer.
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Old 04-03-2013, 11:00 AM   #28
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
What? If he was in Federer's quarter instead of Nadal, he'd have lost. Hardly likely he'd beat Puerta or Davydenko either. Del Potro only played Nadal at RG once when he was 18yo, still put up a much better fight than Ferrer.

You have to be kidding, Del Potro was a few points away from being a Roland Garros champion; well not really, but he'd have the clear favorite for the final against Soderling had he managed to put away Federer. He's far more threatening to all of Federer, Nadal and Djokovic than Ferrer. Berdych, I concede, is as non-threatening to Djokovic and Nadal as Ferrer on clay, but infinitely more threatening to Federer.
Del Potro and Berdych are definitely more threatening to Federer than Ferrer is, but that's all. On clay Ferrer remains a bigger threat than both of them to Djokovic. None of the three are a credible threat to Nadal on clay.

Bottom line is that Ferrer is doing much better clay seasons and is beating Berdych and Del Potro on clay more often than not. And that's how you judge who is better than who, analysing the wholes results and looking at the H2H.

Who is better on clay doesn't equal to who is more a threat to Federer on clay.
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Old 04-03-2013, 11:01 AM   #29
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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Originally Posted by Surcouf View Post
Ferrer would have reached the SF in 2005 if he did not run into Nadal. Remmeber how far did Del Potro go when he run into Nadal at RG?

I admit that Ferrer has had a RG problem, where all the good play he had done during the clay season did not materialize in RG. But for the surface in general, he is much better than Berdych and Del Potro. And I am sure you did not forget that decisive Davis Cup match on clay.
Berdych and Del Potro pushing Nadal, Federer, Djokovic to the limits on clay. Nadal agaisnt Berdych had played his best clay match for many years last year at Rome. On other hand Ferrer took 5 games at RG s\f. Feel the difference.
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Old 04-03-2013, 11:03 AM   #30
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Default Re: Who are the Clay court specialists?

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Del Potro and Berdych are definitely more threatening to Federer than Ferrer is, but that's all. On clay Ferrer remains a bigger threat than both of them to Djokovic. None of the three being a credible threat to Nadal on clay.

Bottom line is that Ferrer is doing much better clay seasons and is beating Berdych and Del Potro on clay more often than not. And that's how you judge who is better than who, analysing the wholes results and looking at the H2H.

Who is better on clay doesn't equal to who is more a threat to Federer on clay.
Wait, you think Ferrer is a bigger threat to Djokovic on any surface than Del Potro ? I'm sure Djokovic and his fans are praying he draws Delpo instead of Ferrer

As for Nadal, just youtube 'Davis Cup Final 2011 Nadal vs Del Potro' and then compare what you see to Ferrer's constant bendovers.
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