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Old 02-11-2013, 04:12 PM   #61
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Default Re: Toni: "In terms of records Nadal's better than Borg but I think Borg is better"

While Toni is a sack of shit, I do agree with him that Federer is at least right in the group fighting for 3rd behind Borg and Nadal in terms of level of play.
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Old 02-11-2013, 04:13 PM   #62
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Default Re: Toni: "In terms of records Nadal's better than Borg but I think Borg is better"

Quote:
Originally Posted by HKz View Post
However, as for his intentions, I'm not sure. Does he actually love Borg that much? Does he say this time to time in order to motivate Rafa to try to prove his uncle wrong? Does he say this in order to keep Rafa's head under the clouds?
I'm sure the OP can give you the answer for this.
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Old 02-11-2013, 04:40 PM   #63
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Default Re: Toni: "In terms of records Nadal's better than Borg but I think Borg is better"

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Originally Posted by IOFH View Post
While Toni is a sack of shit, I do agree with him that Federer is at least right in the group fighting for 3rd behind Borg and Nadal in terms of level of play.
3rd of all time overall or on clay? When did he say that?
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Old 02-11-2013, 04:54 PM   #64
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Default Re: Toni: "In terms of records Nadal's better than Borg but I think Borg is better"

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Originally Posted by castle007 View Post
3rd of all time overall or on clay? When did he say that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HKz View Post
Old news. Toni has always quipped that he felt Bjorn was more unbeatable than Rafa. In fact, the first story about this that I can remember, Toni listed Borg, Nadal, Federer as the top 3 clay court players ever in that order. His reasoning was that Bjorn never missed in his prime whereas he felt Rafa did miss time to time.

However, as for his intentions, I'm not sure. Does he actually love Borg that much? Does he say this time to time in order to motivate Rafa to try to prove his uncle wrong? Does he say this in order to keep Rafa's head under the clouds?
I vaguely remember that quote as well, can't remember when.
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Old 02-11-2013, 05:00 PM   #65
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Default Re: Toni: "In terms of records Nadal's better than Borg but I think Borg is better"

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Originally Posted by castle007 View Post
3rd of all time overall or on clay? When did he say that?
I think it was just before Roland-Garros 2010, the French sports newspaper "l'Equipe" had organized an "experts poll" (the experts were former players or coaches and journalists) to define the best claycourt players of the open era, and Toni indeed had said that in his opinion, Nadal was still behind Borg, and that Federer was in his opinion very underrated on clay because he had had to face Nadal.

He has said that "maybe" Fed should be number 3 ahead of Lendl and Wilander but I have his final vote and actually he didn't vote that : 1 B. Borg ; 2 R. Nadal ; 3 I. Lendl ; 4 M. Wilander ; 5 R. Federer ; 6 T. Muster ; 7 I. Nastase ; 8 G. Kuerten ; 9. G. Vilas ; 10 J.C. Ferrero.

The overall experts result was that :

1. Rafael Nadal, 163 pts ; 2. Björn Borg, 159 ; 3. Ivan Lendl, 111 ; 4. Mats Wilander, 96 ; 5. Gustavo Kuerten, 87 ; 6. Guillermo Vilas, 80 ; 7. Roger Federer, 61 ; 8. Rod Laver, 41 ; 9. Thomas Muster, 37 ; 10. Ken Rosewall et Sergi Bruguera, 28 ; 12. Nastase 24 ; 13 Courier 7 ; Orantes ; Agassi

Of course it was in 2010, then Djokovic was not yet considered.

I was also surprised that Laver was ahead of Rosewall as I thought that overall Rosewall was better on clay, but well maybe it's because of the period considered or the experts just were not that much "experts"

I also have the individual votes actually :

Mats WILANDER : 1 B. Borg ; 2 R. Nadal ; 3 I. Lendl ; 4 M. Wilander ; 5 G. Kuerten ; 6 R. Federer ; 7 R. Laver ; 8 J. Courier ; 9 S. Bruguera ; 10. G. Vilas.

Bob BRETT : 1 R. Nadal ; 2 B. Borg ; 3 M. Wilander ; 4 I. Lendl ; 5 G. Kuerten ; 6 G. Vilas ; 7 R. Federer ; 8 R. Laver ; 9 K. Rosewall ; 10 S. Bruguera.

Thierry TULASNE : 1 R. Nadal ; 2. B. Borg ; 3 M. Wilander ; 4 G. Vilas ; 5 G. Kuerten ; 6 I. Lendl ; 7 R. Federer ; 8 T. Muster ; 9 S. Bruguera ; 10 J.C. Ferrero.

Patrick PROISY : 1 R. Nadal ; 2 B. Borg ; 3 G. Vilas ; 4 M. Wilander ; 5 I. Lendl ; 6 G. Kuerten ; 7 R. Laver ; 8 T. Muster ; 9 S. Bruguera ; 10 R. Federer.

Jean-Paul LOTH : 1 B. Borg ; 2 R. Nadal ; 3 G. Vilas ; 4 I. Lendl ; 5 M. Wilander ; 6 G. Kuerten ; 7 K. Rosewall ; 8 I. Nastase ; 9 T. Muster ; 10 R. Federer.

Guillaume DURAND : 1 B. Borg ; 2 R. Nadal ; 3 G. Kuerten ; 4 G. Vilas ; 5 T. Muster ; 6 I. Lendl ; 7 M. Wilander ; 8 I. Nastase ; 9 R. Federer ; 10 R. Laver.

Philippe BOUIN : 1 R. Nadal ; 2 B. Borg ; 3 G. Kuerten ; 4 R. Federer ; 5 M. Wilander ; 6 I. Lendl ; 7. G.Vilas ; 8 I. Nastase ; 9 S. Bruguera ; 10. J. Courier

Patrice DOMINGUEZ : 1 R. Nadal ; 2 B. Borg ; 3 G. Kuerten ; 4 I. Lendl ; 5 G. Vilas ; 6 R. Federer ; 7 R. Laver ; 8 M. Wilander ; 9 I. Nastase ; 10 S. Bruguera.

Alain DEFLASSIEUX : 1 R. Nadal ; 2 B. Borg ; 3 I. Lendl ; 4 R. Federer ; 5 K. Rosewall ; 6 R. Laver ; 7 G. Vilas ; 8 T. Muster ; 9 M. Wilander ; 10 G. Kuerten

Toni NADAL : 1 B. Borg ; 2 R. Nadal ; 3 I. Lendl ; 4 M. Wilander ; 5 R. Federer ; 6 T. Muster ; 7 I. Nastase ; 8 G. Kuerten ; 9. G. Vilas ; 10 J.C. Ferrero.

Fabrice SANTORO : 1 R. Nadal ; 2 B. Borg ; 3 G. Vilas ; 4 R. Federer ; 5 I. Lendl ; 6 M. Wilander ; 7 G. Kuerten ; 8 T. Muster ; 9 R. Laver ; 10. A. Agassi.

Guy FORGET : 1 R. Nadal ; 2 B. Borg ; 3 I. Lendl ; 4 G. Vilas ; 5 M. Wilander ; 6 K. Rosewall ; 7 R. Laver ; 8 G. Kuerten ; 9 R. Federer ; 10 T. Muster.

Henri LECONTE : 1 B. Borg ; 2 R. Nadal ; 3 I. Lendl ; 4 M. Wilander ; 5 G. Kuerten ; 6 S. Bruguera ; 7 R. Laver ; 8 T. Muster ; 9 G. Vilas ; 10 R. Federer.

Mansour BAHRAMI : 1 B. Borg ; 2 R Nadal ; 3 I. Lendl ; 4 M. Wilander ; 5 G. Kuerten ; 6 S. Bruguera ; 7 R. Federer ; 8 J. Courier ; 9 G. Vilas ; 10 R. Laver.

Pierre BARTHES : 1 R. Nadal ; 2 R. Laver ; 3 B. Borg ; 4 K. Rosewall ; 5 G. Kuerten ; 6 I. Lendl ; 7 M. Wilander ; 8 S. Bruguera ; 9 A. Agassi ; 10 G. Vilas.

Patrice HAGELAUER : 1 B. Borg ; 2 R. Nadal ; 3 M. Orantes ; 4 T. Muster ; 5 I. Nastase ; 6 S. Bruguera ; 7 G. Kuerten ; 8 M. Wilander ; 9 I. Lendl ; 10 G. Vilas.

Sébastien GROSJEAN : 1 R. Nadal ; 2 B. Borg ; 3 I. Lendl ; 4 G. Vilas ; 5 M. Wilander ; 6 R. Federer ; 7 K. Rosewall ; 8 I. Nastase ; 9. G. Kuerten ; 10 T. Muster.
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Last edited by duong : 02-11-2013 at 05:07 PM.
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