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Old 09-01-2012, 02:42 PM   #16
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

It's not like being ranked 43rd is that good.

The simple truth is there's not a lot of young talent coming through. I'll reserve judgement for another 1-2 years, but there's likely to be a big lull post 2016 or something. Maybe there's some good young talent coming through, but even then they're not breaking through that well at futures level.
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Old 09-01-2012, 02:45 PM   #17
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wing Man Frank View Post
Question is, how? He has surely got to be the most overrated youngster there has ever been. If he makes it inside the top 20 the other players should be asking serious questions of each other. His backhand is a joke, his shot selection is non-existant and for a man of his height he possesses absolutely no weapons whatsoever.

Even when you have a look at the other youngsters, how is Raonic at 16 in the world? He's barely done a thing since the clay court season began.

There's a serious lack of talent coming through. People can blame it on the slowing of the courts (believe there's 23 30+ year olds in the top 100 now), but who is there to get excited about?
Especially as we are told this is a "strong" era.

In all honesty, it adds further to the view it is neither a particularly strong or weak era.
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Old 09-01-2012, 02:56 PM   #18
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

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Originally Posted by Apophis View Post
This thread makes no sense at all. Because a well-ranked player is bad in your opinion, you conclude that all of tennis is in a poor state? Have you considered the much simpler explanation of this conundrum: that your judgement of this player's quality is off?
When you watch Raonic do you really feel as though he should be the 16th best player in the world at his age and with his ability? I watch him and at times think he is very raw with a lot to learn, yet the rankings tell me there are only 15 better players than him.

I think the quality of Djokovic, Federer and Nadal (and Murray arguably) has allowed us all to forget just how average the rest are. As good as it is to have 3/4 brilliant players it's also somewhat depressing that you can pretty much guarantee the semi-finalists in all the slams long before they actually get there.

There's just so few capable of pushing them to their limit. How is that enjoyable?
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Old 09-01-2012, 03:14 PM   #19
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

about the lack of youngsters in the top, its mostly from how physical the game has turned. right now, boys at 17, 18 cant be so strong and serve that well. its not like there are no talented players out there
we have great talents but they lack the physical strength and serve
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Old 09-01-2012, 03:57 PM   #20
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

Few observations.

1) The big guns are hoarding up an unprecented amount of points in the big tournaments. Since there is only a limited amount of points to be distributed, this means that (apart from top 4) relatively few points are available and thus required to achieve a certain ranking.

2) Not many youngsters manage to break through at the top of the game. I'm not sure why this is, but players seem to be peaking later (in their mid to late twenties) and there are a large number of thirtysomethings in the top 100.
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Old 09-01-2012, 04:43 PM   #21
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

Nishikori will dominate
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Old 09-01-2012, 04:49 PM   #22
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuzzahLovah View Post
Nishikori will dominate
I think he is too short.

Same problem afflicts David Ferrer.
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Old 09-01-2012, 04:55 PM   #23
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Purple Rainbow View Post
Few observations.

1) The big guns are hoarding up an unprecented amount of points in the big tournaments. Since there is only a limited amount of points to be distributed, this means that (apart from top 4) relatively few points are available and thus required to achieve a certain ranking.
Actually, that's more reason climbing up the rankings is easier for the "small guns". Between the 24th and the 100th are about a 1000 points only. The top 4 aren't playing the 250s and some of the 500s so a rising talented youngster has a good chance of climbing quickly if he is up to it. If the Berdyches, the Cilices and the Mayers are winning some of the big titles from the top 4, they would make a stronger "below top 4" block which will make it harder for others to crack them but a bit easier for them to assault the top rankings.


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See above the difference in difficulty for the bullet to get to the 2nd and 3rd levels of rankings in both examples.
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Old 09-01-2012, 05:05 PM   #24
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

comesbackatlast, would you say it is therefore fair that we can deduce that the difference between the top 24 and the top 100 really isn't that big at all?

I had a look through the rankings from 44-100 and there were a lot of players I'd consider to be much better than Tomic - Malisse and Fognini immediately spring to mind.
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Old 09-01-2012, 05:15 PM   #25
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wing Man Frank View Post
comesbackatlast, would you say it is therefore fair that we can deduce that the difference between the top 24 and the top 100 really isn't that big at all?

I had a look through the rankings from 44-100 and there were a lot of players I'd consider to be much better than Tomic - Malisse and Fognini immediately spring to mind.
I don't know. I was just commenting on a point he raised that the top 4 winning too much would make climbing up the rankings harder. That's true regarding the top 4 but it makes it actually easier to get right behind them; kind of like in football group stages when a team getting 9/9 would make it easier for a team with 3 points to be ranked second; the other three teams are not left a lot, so the differences are smaller. Of course it's way more complicated in tennis with waaaay more possible variations.
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Old 09-01-2012, 06:00 PM   #26
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wing Man Frank View Post
Question is, how? He has surely got to be the most overrated youngster there has ever been. If he makes it inside the top 20 the other players should be asking serious questions of each other. His backhand is a joke, his shot selection is non-existant and for a man of his height he possesses absolutely no weapons whatsoever.

Even when you have a look at the other youngsters, how is Raonic at 16 in the world? He's barely done a thing since the clay court season began.

There's a serious lack of talent coming through. People can blame it on the slowing of the courts (believe there's 23 30+ year olds in the top 100 now), but who is there to get excited about?
I mean it's a weak era for sure, at least beyond the top5/10
BUT let's be realistic here, Tomic and Raonic are both very talented in their own right. Tomic is only 19 years old so I do not grasp why you are being so hard on him. Federer did not have more success by 19 than Tomic has, he was a late bloomer. plenty of time for him to improve and he does have a very crafty game. Raonic's hit with incredible pace and has the best serve on tour. you can't act like these things are irrelevant
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Old 09-01-2012, 11:10 PM   #27
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wing Man Frank View Post
comesbackatlast, would you say it is therefore fair that we can deduce that the difference between the top 24 and the top 100 really isn't that big at all?

I had a look through the rankings from 44-100 and there were a lot of players I'd consider to be much better than Tomic - Malisse and Fognini immediately spring to mind.
malisse and fognini much better than tomic? must be a joke
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Old 09-01-2012, 11:30 PM   #28
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

Very weak rising generation, Raonic is nothing too special but will get slams if he plays Dimitrov, Berankis, Goffin, Tomic, Harrison, and Janowicz for them.

Tomic's ranking will bottom out next January
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Old 09-01-2012, 11:48 PM   #29
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

well i tink theres a lot to get excited about,yes its taking longer than expected but it will be a lot bigger next year

this is what we have had last 2 years
top 100
Kei - qf aus 2012
Raonic - consistant atp results
Tomic - QF wimbledon 2011 3rd round australia
Goffin - 2 4th rounds of slams
Dimtrov - ?
Berankis - ?
Klizan - 4th round us open 2012
Harrison - ?
Janowicz - 3rd round wimbledon 2012

outside top 100
Pospisil
Rufin - put up a fight against tips
DelBonis - 1 x atp sf in 2011
Stebe - beaten the likes of ferrero/davydenko on 250 clay tourneys
Sock - 3rd round us open 2012

there are lots of others i might not have put but most of them havent done to badly,none of them look like stars right now and we are heading back to the 98-03 era where it will be a very fun and even
of course a lot of people will hate that cause they love it when a guy wont stop winning so they can cheer him on and act like they were a fan since the begginning
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Old 09-01-2012, 11:49 PM   #30
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Default Re: How is Tomic ranked 43rd? Where is the upcoming talent?

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Originally Posted by Sombrerero loco View Post
about the lack of youngsters in the top, its mostly from how physical the game has turned. right now, boys at 17, 18 cant be so strong and serve that well. its not like there are no talented players out there
we have great talents but they lack the physical strength and serve
I'm not sure that's the reason. It's not like Nadal, Djokovic, or even Murray had elite serves at the beginning of their career, and that was what, 7-8 years (more for Nadal) ago? I don't think the game changed that much since. I think there just isn't any kid out there who can put it together at the moment.
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