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View Poll Results: Who will win the 2012 year-end H2H?

Djokovic will take the lead 31 50.82%
Federer will claim his trophy 25 40.98%
They will end in a draw, for the first time 1 1.64%
I don't know. But this should be an official ATP award, it's amazing. 4 6.56%
Voters: 61. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-22-2012, 02:08 AM   #826
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by finishingmove View Post
Listen guy, once and for all, if Fed has an easy draw - he has an easy draw. And it has nothing to do with other players' draws and how they use or fail to use them.

Fed got a cakewalk VULTURE 2009 RG. Be happy with it and know he got lucky. Just like he knows it.
In 2009 Federer was drawn to play Nadal in the final of RG. That's not an easy draw.
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:19 AM   #827
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by Han Solo View Post
In 2009 Federer was drawn to play Nadal in the final of RG. That's not an easy draw.
Noserer had clown RG draws his entire career. Only Nadal stopped Luckerer from winning 4+ RG titles.
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:22 AM   #828
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by Han Solo View Post
In 2009 Federer was drawn to play Nadal in the final of RG. That's not an easy draw.
Exactly. Can't have it touger than drawing the clay GOAT in the final.
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:02 AM   #829
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by Han Solo View Post
In 2009 Federer was drawn to play Nadal in the final of RG. That's not an easy draw.
Soon, when Federer is out of the top 4, he'll start drawing him in QFs
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:06 AM   #830
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by finishingmove View Post
Soon, when Federer is out of the top 4, he'll start drawing him in QFs
You mean when Dull is out of the top 4.
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Old 10-22-2012, 07:46 AM   #831
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Soon, when Federer is out of the top 4, he'll start drawing him in QFs
Might just as easily by a Djokovic - Nadal QF next year. Nadal is unlikely to maintain top-4 until RG with basically no points post-RG this year. We can only hope - in fairness - that Nadal will get the "empty quarter".
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Old 10-22-2012, 01:26 PM   #832
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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You mean when Dull is out of the top 4.
Indeed, its easier Nadal be out of the top 4 than Federer in RG.
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Old 10-22-2012, 01:30 PM   #833
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by Topspindoctor View Post
Noserer had clown RG draws his entire career. Only Nadal stopped Luckerer from winning 4+ RG titles.
just shows fed is the 2nd best claycourter after dull
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:13 PM   #834
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by Looner View Post
Good to know that Fed did not get an easy draw in 2009 then. Cya, guy.
The persistence of this myth amongst Fed-haters would make a worthwhile psychological study.

Martin-Acasuso-Mathieu-Haas-Monfils-DelPotro-Soderling is not by any stretch of the imagination an "easy" route to an R.G. title. Martin & Acasuso were clay specialists, Mathieu had given Nadal his toughest ever match at R.G. before that year, Haas, Monfils, Del Po have all been Top-10 players (with R.G. Monfils's best slam), & Del Po a slam champion, & Soderling is a 2-time R.G. finalist, former Top 5 player, who just happens to be the only guy to beat Nadull at R.G. How exactly is that easy? Contrast it with Nadal's route to the title the following year: Mina, Zeballos, Hewitt, Bellucci, Almagro, Melzer, Soderling. Call me biased, but that looks considerably easier.
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:20 PM   #835
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by Sophocles View Post
The persistence of this myth amongst Fed-haters would make a worthwhile psychological study.

Martin-Acasuso-Mathieu-Haas-Monfils-DelPotro-Soderling is not by any stretch of the imagination an "easy" route to an R.G. title. Martin & Acasuso were clay specialists, Mathieu had given Nadal his toughest ever match at R.G. before that year, Haas, Monfils, Del Po have all been Top-10 players (with R.G. Monfils's best slam), & Del Po a slam champion, & Soderling is a 2-time R.G. finalist, former Top 5 player, who just happens to be the only guy to beat Nadull at R.G. How exactly is that easy? Contrast it with Nadal's route to the title the following year: Mina, Zeballos, Hewitt, Bellucci, Almagro, Melzer, Soderling. Call me biased, but that looks considerably easier.
Considerably biased in that case.
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Spending time with your children and not being a wage slave at some soulless corporation or government bureaucracy sounds like hell. Haven't we progressed beyond the idea that it is in loving relationships with other people that we find fulfillment and meaning? Climbing the corporate ladder is essential in the pursuit of happiness.
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Match Point Novak needs to be immortalized in sculpture, like Michelangelo's David. I'm sure that once he's gone to tennis Valhalla, his statue will have his stones as the focal point of attention, and tennis fans will make a meccan-like pilgrimage at least once in their lifetime, in order to rub those lucky stones, like the budda's belly.
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:21 PM   #836
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by Sophocles View Post
The persistence of this myth amongst Fed-haters would make a worthwhile psychological study.

Martin-Acasuso-Mathieu-Haas-Monfils-DelPotro-Soderling is not by any stretch of the imagination an "easy" route to an R.G. title. Martin & Acasuso were clay specialists, Mathieu had given Nadal his toughest ever match at R.G. before that year, Haas, Monfils, Del Po have all been Top-10 players (with R.G. Monfils's best slam), & Del Po a slam champion, & Soderling is a 2-time R.G. finalist, former Top 5 player, who just happens to be the only guy to beat Nadull at R.G. How exactly is that easy? Contrast it with Nadal's route to the final the following year: Mina, Zeballos, Hewitt, Bellucci, Almagro, Melzer, Soderling. Call me biased, but that looks considerably easier.
Some good points. Though Martin was really easy opponent, but Acasuso was great player and that very tournament was on top of his play. Them with Mathieu gave Fed some tough days, in some moments it looked like 5-setters at least.
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:43 PM   #837
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Considerably biased in that case.
Who is Mina? Martin, however shit, is better than him. Who is Zeballos? Acasuso is better. Hewitt was a great player, but we're talking hip-replacement Hewitt here, long out of the Top 10, on by far his worst surface; 2009 Mathieu is probably a tougher opponent at R.G. Haas is surely better than Bellucci, on any surface. Monfils is better than Almagro, & has a better record at R.G. Del Potro is more dangerous than Melzer. And Soderling played better in 2009 than in 2010.

Where's the bias?
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:15 PM   #838
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by Sophocles View Post
Who is Mina? Martin, however shit, is better than him. Who is Zeballos? Acasuso is better. Hewitt was a great player, but we're talking hip-replacement Hewitt here, long out of the Top 10, on by far his worst surface; 2009 Mathieu is probably a tougher opponent at R.G. Haas is surely better than Bellucci, on any surface. Monfils is better than Almagro, & has a better record at R.G. Del Potro is more dangerous than Melzer. And Soderling played better in 2009 than in 2010.

Where's the bias?
agree qith you.

nadal`s draw in 2010 was much more easy , and this year too.
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:20 PM   #839
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Where's the bias?
here, it is.

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Considerably biased in that case.
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:22 PM   #840
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Default Re: Endless Djokovic/Federer Debates (Who will end up with the better clay career)

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Originally Posted by Sophocles View Post
Who is Mina? Martin, however shit, is better than him. Who is Zeballos? Acasuso is better. Hewitt was a great player, but we're talking hip-replacement Hewitt here, long out of the Top 10, on by far his worst surface; 2009 Mathieu is probably a tougher opponent at R.G. Haas is surely better than Bellucci, on any surface. Monfils is better than Almagro, & has a better record at R.G. Del Potro is more dangerous than Melzer. And Soderling played better in 2009 than in 2010.

Where's the bias?

It's true that on paper Fed had a harder draw, but Del Potro and Haas both should have beaten Fed but they choked their matches away. Haas for example missed the easiest volleys possible on crucial points
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