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Old 11-03-2012, 02:21 PM   #1036
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

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Originally Posted by Jimnik View Post
Careful Echoes, the atheist brigade will find you, wherever you post.
Yes, apparently. I can't say I did not expect this but they show their true face every time. I mean I've always known atheists were true obscurantists and that they openly admit it is not surprising either because I know that they're not short on audacity. Already their obsession with some themes is striking. I've passed the test and made all my responses public and they of course picked one of them, guess which one? If they were French, they would've picked the immigration issue. They're incapable of any general thought, that is why they would just pick one topic and discuss it. Pathetic.

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Originally Posted by Jimnik View Post
I don't see why scientific fact is the only thing that should be taught in schools but everyone is entitled to their opinion. Unless we want our children to grow up as robots we should show them there's more to life than rational thought.
Entitled to their opinion, unless they get in power, or are teachers, right? Because here I'm no longer joking. Our children's teaching is at stake. It's very serious now. In my country, teaching is a disaster because of them. Children have the right to be taught every general theories of any kind. It's a matter of general cultural knowledge and open-mindedness. These obscurantists should be combatted fiercly.

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Originally Posted by Jimnik View Post
Amazing how even the hard core liberals can mostly agree with Gary Johnson. I didn't even think it was mathematically possible.


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Originally Posted by buddyholly View Post
I am sure my mother and father did a much better parenting job than yours.
Let my parents out of this, will you?

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Originally Posted by Tommy_Vercetti View Post
Seeing that religion was responsible for drastically halting the advancement of society in Europe and the Middle East. I would strongly disagree. At least in antiquity, their religion didn't stop them from scientific research and cultural advancement.
Antique world, Roman and Greek, was based on slavery. Perhaps it's your ideal.
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Old 11-03-2012, 02:23 PM   #1037
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

The Muslims ran the slave trade as well as owning them and many Christians owned them and were involved in the trade up until just 150+ years ago.

That argument doesn't hold water. All societies at the time had slavery. I remind you that American Indians owned slaves here even after they were freed in the South. They were "spiritual people" in their own minds.

Religion goes like this: The most primitive people worship nature and spirits. Dirt worshipers like Aboriginals or American Indians or the tribal people of Africa. Much like all people use to be. Everyone originally worshiped the Earth.

Then there is polytheism and monotheism and then people realize that religion is bunk. That's how it goes. Unfortunately the Muslim world is 1,000 years behind the evolution of human thought. The Jewish zealots of the Roman period were pretty much seen like the Islamic fanatics are today. But Islam has always been fanatical. I might remind you that the Crusades were launched well after the Islamic invasion of Christendom and largely as self-defense against another one. Followers of Islam, unlike every other religion, have never progressed beyond that stage.
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Old 11-03-2012, 02:35 PM   #1038
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

Some of these arguments remind me of this golden clip:

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/we...at-s-it-up-to-

Seriously, Echoes, of course children should be taught about other religions and what are their mythologies etc. But in science class, evolution of course should be taught, there is really no plausible alternative scientific theory
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Old 11-03-2012, 05:01 PM   #1039
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

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Originally Posted by Echoes View Post






Let my parents out of this, will you?

You insulted mine, so what's your problem? Just be careful what you say in future, if you throw the first stone.
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Old 11-03-2012, 05:03 PM   #1040
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

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Originally Posted by Echoes View Post

Entitled to their opinion, unless they get in power, or are teachers, right? Because here I'm no longer joking. Our children's teaching is at stake. It's very serious now. In my country, teaching is a disaster because of them. Children have the right to be taught every general theories of any kind. It's a matter of general cultural knowledge and open-mindedness. These obscurantists should be combatted fiercly.


There are churches for teaching faith based, non-scientific theories. If they are not doing their job to your satisfaction, it is because there is little interest.

When you say that children have the right to be taught every general theory of any kind, you are just trying to justify ridiculous Creation theory as something that should be taught in schools. By your standards, religious fanatics could make up any crazy theories they wished in an effort to justify the words in the bible - and then demand it be taught to children. Fortunately, common sense beats idiocy.
Children do have the right to be taught every general theory of any kind. But teachers in educational institutions should not be obliged to teach nonsense.

But we have gone over this countless times. Basically the religious argument comes down to - evolution completely undermines all fundamental religious belief and therefore should be stomped out at all costs, to save the faith.
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Old 11-04-2012, 05:01 PM   #1041
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

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Originally Posted by abraxas21 View Post
the idea of religion must be one of the greatest inventions of humankind.
So it's an invention? Consider yourself an atheist, son.

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Originally Posted by Tommy_Vercetti
many Christians owned them and were involved in the trade up until just 150+ years ago.
Christians abolished slavery in the Roman Empire. Mostly the Jews organized the slave trade. A Christian/Rousseauist abolished it (Robespierre) and ... a hardcore atheist reinstated it (Buonaparte).

So I guess it does hold oceans. Is it your ideal?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy_Vercetti
I might remind you that the Crusades were launched well after the Islamic invasion of Christendom and largely as self-defense against another one.
I morally support the Crusades. So thanks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lopez
Seriously, Echoes, of course children should be taught about other religions and what are their mythologies etc. But in science class, evolution of course should be taught, there is really no plausible alternative scientific theory
Let me repeat my response to that question that you seem so obsessed with...


Do you believe the theory of Evolution? Regardless, all theories should be taught in school (I add that they should be taught in the framework of strict neutrality, even those that seems the most extreme and it's also valid for political, theological or philosophical doctrines.)


It's clear, clean and unequivocal.

Laugh if you want but I had some astrology class at school myself. And find it perfectly normal !

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Originally Posted by buddyholly
You insulted mine, so what's your problem? Just be careful what you say in future, if you throw the first stone.
It seems I should, indeed, be careful, when I use film quotes, that anybody should know them. Anyway, it remains that what you said was plain stupid and I can prove it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by buddyholly
There are churches for teaching faith based, non-scientific theories.
Churches are NOT a place to teach anything. It's a place where people pray and ritualize.

Teaching may happen everywhere but should be compulsory until the age of 17 and it should be compulsory to teach every political, theological and philosophical doctrine, to teach literature too. History classes should not be reduced to a list of dates, a list of wars and treaties, etc etc.

You don't want anything of this but fortunately you are a minority. I've seen myself the decline of teaching in my country because of irresponsible people like you. There's nothing funny about this topic now. This is very serious. You want our chilldren to become good consumers and good technicians, period. I'd like them to become knowledgeable, independant citizens and for that they need cultural knowledge, as simple as that.
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Old 11-04-2012, 05:04 PM   #1042
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

I will be glad when the election is over!
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Old 11-04-2012, 05:27 PM   #1043
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
S


It seems I should, indeed, be careful, when I use film quotes, that anybody should know them. Anyway, it remains that what you said was plain stupid and I can prove it.



Churches are NOT a place to teach anything. It's a place where people pray and ritualize.
We probably don't go to the same movies. I have no idea who you are quoting. What did I say that was stupid?

I think all churches have times when they teach children about their parent's religion. You are in favour of stopping that?
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Old 11-04-2012, 05:31 PM   #1044
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
Laugh if you want but I had some astrology class at school myself. And find it perfectly normal !




What kind of school was that? A rhesus monkey could figure out in a week that the constellations are man-made groupings of stars and their relation to past, present and future happenings are ZERO. Was that a normal type of school you went to? What an embarrassment to your country. The most a real school should say about astrology is that it is nonsese, like palm reading, card reading and bump reading and tell the pupils not to waste their time with it.
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Old 11-04-2012, 05:35 PM   #1045
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
Let me repeat my response to that question that you seem so obsessed with...


Do you believe the theory of Evolution? Regardless, all theories should be taught in school (I add that they should be taught in the framework of strict neutrality, even those that seems the most extreme and it's also valid for political, theological or philosophical doctrines.)


It's clear, clean and unequivocal.
How about the theory that the earth is flat? Should that be taught? Maybe after the astrology class, I guess.
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Old 11-04-2012, 06:16 PM   #1046
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

I never label myself an atheist, because I detest about 90% of atheists I've ever met.

I don't know what created the universe. I don't think what happens when we die is any different than stepping on an ant or swatting a fly. You just cease to exist.
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Old 11-04-2012, 09:06 PM   #1047
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

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I never label myself an atheist, because I detest about 90% of atheists I've ever met.

.
I'm sure it's mutual.
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Old 11-04-2012, 09:08 PM   #1048
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
Let me repeat my response to that question that you seem so obsessed with...


Do you believe the theory of Evolution? Regardless, all theories should be taught in school (I add that they should be taught in the framework of strict neutrality, even those that seems the most extreme and it's also valid for political, theological or philosophical doctrines.)


It's clear, clean and unequivocal.

Laugh if you want but I had some astrology class at school myself. And find it perfectly normal !
So any BS theory should be taught? Earth is flat and the sun revolves around it?

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Originally Posted by buddyholly View Post
How about the theory that the earth is flat? Should that be taught? Maybe after the astrology class, I guess.
So much pwn in this post.
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Old 11-04-2012, 11:21 PM   #1049
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

Are you thick as a brick or what?


For the third and, I hope, last time:

EVERY GENERAL THEORY SHOULD BE TAUGHT!


If you don't agree with this, that makes you a damn brainwasher. And I hope you'll one day realize how disgusting your ideas are, and harmful for mankind.
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Old 11-04-2012, 11:47 PM   #1050
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Default Re: US presidential election 2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
Are you thick as a brick or what?


For the third and, I hope, last time:

EVERY GENERAL THEORY SHOULD BE TAUGHT!


If you don't agree with this, that makes you a damn brainwasher. And I hope you'll one day realize how disgusting your ideas are, and harmful for mankind.
But you don't say why the crazy ones should be taught. Such as Creationism.

Theories are tested on whether they stand up to scientific observation. But since there has not been a scrap of evidence offered for Creationism it can't be tested. But this is where the fundamentalists shine. They challenge you to prove it wrong. And if you can't prove it wrong, they claim it must be true.

I think you are the proponent of brainwashing, proposing the teaching of illogical theories based on imagination and nothing else. Why put that nonsense in a kid's head?
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