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Old 08-24-2010, 01:34 PM   #166
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

I heard Saudi Arabia wants to buy new weapons and warplanes from the US for a few billion dollars but Israel has something against it. Why do they have to stick their nose in everything?
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Old 08-24-2010, 01:42 PM   #167
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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Originally Posted by Bilbo View Post
I heard Saudi Arabia wants to buy new weapons and warplanes from the US for a few billion dollars but Israel has something against it. Why do they have to stick their nose in everything?
I don't know where you read this things - If it's written in one source it doesn't mean that it's true, and as far as I know that aren't much problems in Israel with Saudi Arabia.
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Old 08-24-2010, 01:47 PM   #168
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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I don't know where you read this things - If it's written in one source it doesn't mean that it's true, and as far as I know that aren't much problems in Israel with Saudi Arabia.
Maariv: Lieberman launching diplomatic offensive against Saudis

Israel is threatening to launch a global campaign against Saudi Arabia, in keeping with a decision that was made by Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman and which has been kept secret until now. The campaign, if launched, will include the use of various means of leverage and lobbies in the United States, Europe and other places around the world, raising the issue of human rights, the status of women and financing terrorism in the US Congress, the European Parliament and other venues, a public relations campaign and even lodging complaints with international courts.

Lieberman’s decision was made in the wake of a conclusion that was drawn by foreign minister officials that Saudi Arabia was the principal force behind the global campaign to delegitimize Israel. Senior political officials said this week in closed conversations that the Saudis have financed a large part of the lawsuits that were filed to international courts, the public debates, the conferences, the slander and hounding of Israel in the United States, Europe and elsewhere. “They’re playing a double game,” said one political official. “The Saudis act as if they are part of the moderate camp and are trying to exploit the West for their own needs, when at the same time they have been financing an orchestrated campaign against Israel’s legitimacy, against Israel’s economy and more. That needs to be ended.”

Lieberman’s plan calls for Israel to convey a strenuous message in the next number of days to the United States that will include information about Saudi Arabia’s involvement in the above-cited activities. Israel will demand that the Americans intervene and use their influence and the leverage that they have over the Saudis to pressure Saudi Arabia. In tandem, all Israeli representatives overseas will be briefed, as will all the Jewish organizations, the Jewish lobby and Israeli allies in the US Congress and elsewhere so as to begin to “pester” Saudi Arabia, to place on the public agenda its involvement in financing terrorism, the state of human rights in the kingdom, the status of women and numerous other issues. The possibility of filing lawsuits to either international or foreign courts will also be looked into, among other options.

Not everyone is pleased with this direction. Quite a number of political officials both in the Foreign Ministry and in other capacities, believe that such a course of action by Israel would be gratuitous and would not yield Israel any benefit. The Saudis have their faults, they aren’t Zionists, say the opponents, but they are clearly situated in the moderate camp, they support political negotiations, they stand behind the Arab peace initiative and they are threatened by Iran and radical Islam just like Israel.

Another troubling arena in that context is the Iranian nuclear program. According to foreign reports, Saudi Arabia has already agreed to let Israel use an aerial corridor through Saudi airspace on its way to a possible attack of Iran’s nuclear facilities. According to those reports, that means that Saudi Arabia has agreed to permit Israel combat jets pass through its airspace without responding so as to provide the IAF with the fastest and shortest route possible to distant Iran. If Lieberman’s program sparks a public crisis with the Saudis, that could have an adverse effect on the above-cited aerial corridor. At the current juncture in time, when Israel’s relations with Turkey are at a low, peace with Jordan and Egypt is frozen, Europe is turning a cold shoulder and the crisis with the United States is worsening, Israel ought not to look for yet another front to fight on. This is neither an existential war nor are the Saudis’ actions something that Israel simply can’t ignore. Israel has far more pressing troubles than the Saudis’ hypocrisy. We need to work at finding the common ground between us and our shared interests, and not the things that divide us, say the political officials opposed to Lieberman’s initiative.

That criticism, however, is unlikely to change Lieberman’s decision.


http://coteret.com/2010/05/13/maariv...gainst-saudis/
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Old 08-24-2010, 01:52 PM   #169
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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do I have to remind you that Israel is occupying Palestinian lands and denying them the right to return back home, which is the reason the Islamic world has a problem with Israel?

the whole Islamic world care, you can twist facts as you like, it's your country's forte afterall.


Let me remind you that the whole Islamic world treats Palestinians like untouchables and is only using them as propaganda tools.
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Old 08-24-2010, 01:54 PM   #170
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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why would they nuke Israel in the first place if they didn't give a damn about Palestinians, do I have to remind you that Israel is occupying Palestinian lands and denying them the right to return back home, which is the reason the Islamic world has a problem with Israel?
Who decides which period of time is deciding about people and their own lands? I mean, those who "lost" their homes, lost them in a war that Israel was attacked first, and defended herself.
Israelis on the other hand can claim to own lands on other cities, as there were expulsions through the history, and there are jewish sites in Palestinian cities - And Israel does not claim to return this sites to their own.
You can't come and take thousands of people from their homes at Haifa or Yaffo because people claim it was their home. I have no problem that a Palestinian state would be established, and Palestinian people could return to it's territory. It's not possible to let them return to Israeli cities, and Yaffo and Haifa for example will sure remain in Israel's hold.
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Old 08-24-2010, 01:58 PM   #171
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

First of all, if a country take leading a campign against Israel, Israel has the right to do the oppossite deal. Anyway, I don't believe it's relevant as I didn't heard about it, and this kind of pressure won't change Obama's way of act, because he need good relations with Saudi Arabia
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Old 08-24-2010, 02:00 PM   #172
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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Originally Posted by habibko View Post
Maariv: Lieberman launching diplomatic offensive against Saudis

According to foreign reports, Saudi Arabia has already agreed to let Israel use an aerial corridor through Saudi airspace on its way to a possible attack of Iran’s nuclear facilities. According to those reports, that means that Saudi Arabia has agreed to permit Israel combat jets pass through its airspace without responding so as to provide the IAF with the fastest and shortest route possible to distant Iran. If Lieberman’s program sparks a public crisis with the Saudis, that could have an adverse effect on the above-cited aerial corridor.
Not long ago you said that such an air corridor was not a possibility. Now you are quoting articles that include it. Shouldn't you reject the entire article as not possible?
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Old 08-24-2010, 03:25 PM   #173
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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Originally Posted by habibko View Post
why would they nuke Israel in the first place if they didn't give a damn about Palestinians, do I have to remind you that Israel is occupying Palestinian lands and denying them the right to return back home, which is the reason the Islamic world has a problem with Israel?

the whole Islamic world care, you can twist facts as you like, it's your country's forte afterall.



of course I don't support it, I don't think it will happen either, our country has changed alot since 20 years ago or so.
This is a recent verdict. If it won't be carried out it would have nothing to do with the Saudis or the Saudi goverment, and all to do with international pressure.
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Old 08-24-2010, 09:25 PM   #174
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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Originally Posted by Nimrodg View Post
Who decides which period of time is deciding about people and their own lands? I mean, those who "lost" their homes, lost them in a war that Israel was attacked first, and defended herself.
Israelis on the other hand can claim to own lands on other cities, as there were expulsions through the history, and there are jewish sites in Palestinian cities - And Israel does not claim to return this sites to their own.
You can't come and take thousands of people from their homes at Haifa or Yaffo because people claim it was their home. I have no problem that a Palestinian state would be established, and Palestinian people could return to it's territory. It's not possible to let them return to Israeli cities, and Yaffo and Haifa for example will sure remain in Israel's hold.
who decides? certainly not Israel.

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Not long ago you said that such an air corridor was not a possibility. Now you are quoting articles that include it. Shouldn't you reject the entire article as not possible?
I was only quoting the article to show Nimrod that Israel indeed has a problem with Saudi Arabia, I don't have much use to its content otherwise, I've already responded to the air corridor issue before.

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Originally Posted by Or Levy View Post
This is a recent verdict. If it won't be carried out it would have nothing to do with the Saudis or the Saudi goverment, and all to do with international pressure.
I've read reports where the officials deny such a verdict has been issued, and that the judge has asked the hospitals if such a verdict can be carried out just to convince the claimant that it isn't possible to carry such a verdict out, it's hard to know whom to believe here, all we know is that such a verdict hasn't been carried out.

it has been sometime since certain sharia laws have been suspended in practice, no stoning or cutting hands take place here anymore, even if officially still within the rulings, from time to time an ignorant judge from a distant city (in this case, Tabuk) comes up with an outrageous out-of-our-time verdict and the higher officials or the King himself usually intervenes to stop the nonsense.
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Old 08-24-2010, 10:39 PM   #175
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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who decides? certainly not Israel.
Agreed. So does the Palestinians. They should stop making terms and negotiate already.
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Old 08-25-2010, 08:23 AM   #176
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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Originally Posted by habibko View Post
who decides? certainly not Israel.



I was only quoting the article to show Nimrod that Israel indeed has a problem with Saudi Arabia, I don't have much use to its content otherwise, I've already responded to the air corridor issue before.



I've read reports where the officials deny such a verdict has been issued, and that the judge has asked the hospitals if such a verdict can be carried out just to convince the claimant that it isn't possible to carry such a verdict out, it's hard to know whom to believe here, all we know is that such a verdict hasn't been carried out.

it has been sometime since certain sharia laws have been suspended in practice, no stoning or cutting hands take place here anymore, even if officially still within the rulings, from time to time an ignorant judge from a distant city (in this case, Tabuk) comes up with an outrageous out-of-our-time verdict and the higher officials or the King himself usually intervenes to stop the nonsense.
You know, in some countries, you can't deny a verdict has been given, it's a matter of public record. And as apperantly one Hospital said it was possible - it would be kind of hard to convince the claiment of that now.
BTW, didn't the guy have a lawyer? Why is the judge 'supposedly' working as a defender?

In the past year I've heard about a few 'out-of-our-times' verdicts in your country. So maybe it's not so 'out of the time'.

Ohh, and how can I forget the new rules regarding SMS in blackberries and Iphones. Is that 'out of the times' ruling as well.

It is very easy to critisize a country like Israel, who has free press, the government is critised from within, has academic freedom - most if not all the countries in the middle east do not have such things.

How many cases in Saudi Arabia do we NOT hear about? As I've said before, the Arab/Muslim world only care about human rights when Israel supposedly violate the rights of the Palestinians.

The Turks don't care about the Curds, Lebanon doesn't let Palestinians work in anything but the lowest and most pitiful jobs, Egypt treat refugees from Sudan so badly they escape to Israel by the masses to apply for Asylum here, people traffiking is very common in Dubai and Saudi Arabia come out with an outrageous verdict every other week.

Last edited by Or Levy : 08-25-2010 at 09:37 AM.
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Old 08-25-2010, 08:29 AM   #177
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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I heard Saudi Arabia wants to buy new weapons and warplanes from the US for a few billion dollars but Israel has something against it. Why do they have to stick their nose in everything?
LOL. All of the Arab world has to voice their opinions regarding the Palestinians, even though Israel hasn't done them anything. What has Israel ever done to Iran, Iraq or Saudi Arabia.

If they meddle, why shouldn't we?
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Old 08-25-2010, 10:22 AM   #178
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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It is very easy to critisize a country like Israel, who has free press, the government is critised from within, has academic freedom - most if not all the countries in the middle east do not have such things.
Lebanon was a democratic country before Israel even existed and still is.
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Old 08-25-2010, 10:28 AM   #179
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Lebanon was a democratic country before Israel even existed and still is.
A Democratic country where a militant group who calls to destroy another country in its government, and this militant group doing whatever she likes in the southern of Lebanon.
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Old 08-25-2010, 10:32 AM   #180
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Default Re: And Israel is the aggressor...right.

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A Democratic country where a militant group who calls to destroy another country in its government, and this militant group doing whatever she likes in the southern of Lebanon.
Expected answer.

Guess which country created this group? Lebanon would be a flourish and one of the richest countries in the world given its size without Israel as its neighbour.
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