New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill - MensTennisForums.com

MensTennisForums.com

MenstennisForums.com is the premier Men's Tennis forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.Please Register - It's Free!

Reply

Old 05-26-2009, 08:00 PM   #1
country flag prima donna
Banned!
 
prima donna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 7,319
prima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond repute
Default New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

SAN FRANCISCO (AP) - The California Supreme Court upheld a voter-approved ban on same-sex marriage Tuesday, but it also decided that the estimated 18,000 gay couples who tied the knot before the law took effect will stay wed.

Demonstrators outside the court yelled "shame on you!" The 6-1 decision written by Chief Justice Ron George rejected an argument by gay rights activists that the ban revised the California Constitution's equal protection clause to such a dramatic degree that it first needed the Legislature's approval.

The court said the Californians have a right, through the ballot box, to change their constitution.
"In a sense, petitioners' and the attorney general's complaint is that it is just too easy to amend the California Constitution through the initiative process. But it is not a proper function of this court to curtail that process; we are constitutionally bound to uphold it," the ruling said.
The justices said the 136-page majority ruling does not speak to whether they agree with Proposition 8 or "believe it should be a part of the California Constitution."
They said they were "limited to interpreting and applying the principles and rules embodied in the California Constitution, setting aside our own personal beliefs and values."
The announcement of the decision set off an outcry among a sea of demonstrators who had gathered in front of the San Francisco courthouse awaiting the ruling. Holding signs and many waving rainbow flags, they yelled "shame on you." Many people also held hands in a chain around an intersection in an act of protest.
Gay rights activists immediately promised to resume their fight, saying they would go back to voters as early as next year in a bid to repeal Proposition 8.
The split decision provided some relief for the 18,000 gay couples who married in the brief time same-sex marriage was legal last year but that wasn't enough to dull the anger over the ruling that banned gay marriage.
"It's not about whether we get to stay married. Our fight is far from over," said Jeannie Rizzo, 62, who was one of the lead plaintiffs along with her wife, Polly Cooper. "I have about 20 years left on this earth, and I'm going to continue to fight for equality every day."
Also in the crowd gathered at City Hall, near the courthouse, were Sharon Papo, 30, and Amber Weiss, 32, who were married on the first day gay marriage was legal last year, June 17.
"We're relieved our marriage was not invalidated, but this is a hollow victory because there are so many that are not allowed to marry those they love," Weiss said.
"I feel very uncomfortable being in a special class of citizens," Papo said.
The state Supreme Court had ruled last May that it was unconstitutional to deny gay couples the right to wed. Many same-sex couples had rushed to get married before the November vote on Proposition 8, fearing it could be passed. When it was, gay rights activists went back to the court arguing that the ban was improperly put to voters and amounted to a revision—which required legislative approval—not an amendment.
That was the issue justices decided Tuesday.
"After comparing this initiative measure to the many other constitutional changes that have been reviewed and evaluated in numerous prior decisions of this court, we conclude Proposition 8 constitutes a constitutional amendment rather than a constitutional revision," the ruling said.
Justice Carlos Moreno wrote the dissenting opinion disagreeing that the proposition did not change the constitution's equal protection clause. He said the law denying same-sex couples the right to wed "strikes at the core of the promise of equality that underlies our California Constitution." He said it represents a "drastic and far-reaching change." "Promising equal treatment to some is fundamentally different from promising equal treatment for all," said Moreno, who had been mentioned as a possible contender for the U.S. Supreme Court. "Promising treatment that is almost equal is fundamentally different from ensuring truly equal treatment."

Last edited by prima donna : 12-02-2009 at 11:02 PM.
prima donna is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 

Old 05-26-2009, 08:10 PM   #2
country flag Garson007
Registered User
 
Garson007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Stellenbosch
Age: 27
Posts: 3,887
Garson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Oh dear. If it's the majority's job to write a constitution one could just as well turn the clock back 200 years. How the USA, the media capital of the world, can still call itself at the forefront of freedom and human rights are beyond me.
Garson007 is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 08:21 PM   #3
country flag q.j.
Registered User
 
q.j.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: City Wok
Posts: 1,903
q.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond reputeq.j. has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8








Vamos!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clydey View Post
Huh? Murray reached his first slam final at the 12th attempt. Federer took 18 attempts. So what if Murray only has 1 slam final? He got there quicker than Roger. He didn't have the good fortune to play a Mark Phillipousis in his first GS final, though.
q.j. is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 08:47 PM   #4
country flag scoobs
Anastasia Komananov, KGB
 
scoobs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Age: 36
Posts: 53,496
scoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond reputescoobs has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Ahh. Yes, a democracy where it's possible for a majority to deny legal rights to a minority by winning a majority of the votes in a public ballot.

Nothing like seeking that ever more perfect union is there.
scoobs is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 09:02 PM   #5
country flag GlennMirnyi
Banned!
 
GlennMirnyi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: I'm in Porto Alegre, bitch!
Posts: 42,099
GlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Gotta say it's a joke to deny rights to a group of people based on their sexual orientation.
GlennMirnyi is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 09:10 PM   #6
country flag prima donna
Banned!
 
prima donna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 7,319
prima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Domestic partnerships (similar to civil unions) are still available to same-sex couples. In addition, the 18,000 same-sex marriages that took place prior to Proposition 8 remain valid.
prima donna is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 09:15 PM   #7
country flag tangerine_dream
Last dance, Andy
 
tangerine_dream's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New York New Englander
Posts: 25,414
tangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobs View Post
Ahh. Yes, a democracy where it's possible for a majority to deny legal rights to a minority by winning a majority of the votes in a public ballot.
Yes, because a truly free democracy would be where the minority can overrule the majority.
__________________
"What kind of shape am I in now? Well round is a shape." said Roddick with a laugh. "I had a very detailed retirement plan, and I feel like I've met every aspect of it: a lot of golf, a lot of carbs, a lot of fried food, and some booze, occasionally — I've been completely committed ... The results have shown."


Mugs Tennis Forums
tangerine_dream is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 09:20 PM   #8
country flag partygirl
Registered User
 
partygirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Hollywood, CA
Age: 32
Posts: 13,952
partygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond reputepartygirl has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

partygirl is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 10:00 PM   #9
country flag Garson007
Registered User
 
Garson007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Stellenbosch
Age: 27
Posts: 3,887
Garson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Quote:
Originally Posted by tangerine_dream View Post
Yes, because a truly free democracy would be where the minority can overrule the majority.
Is this sarcasm? If it is then you're over simplifying the matter of what makes a good constitution. The constitution is exactly there to protect and represent the rights of individuals. It is up to the lawmakers to make sure that the constitution is fair and just and not a referendum done by the populace.

Let us not forget that the law is secular, therefore so should legal terms like marriage.
Garson007 is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 10:07 PM   #10
country flag tangerine_dream
Last dance, Andy
 
tangerine_dream's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New York New Englander
Posts: 25,414
tangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond reputetangerine_dream has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garson007 View Post
Is this sarcasm? If it is then you're over simplifying the matter of what makes a good constitution. The constitution is exactly there to protect and represent the rights of individuals. It is up to the lawmakers to make sure that the constitution is fair and just and not a referendum done by the majority.

Let us not forget that the law is secular, therefore so should legal terms like marriage.
You and everybody else in this thread completely missed the point. The Supreme Court was not voting on whether gays have the right to be married or not, they were voting to uphold the voter's decision, which was a legal and fair state vote. If they overrule a legal majority vote then what's the point of voting? That would have been worse for our constitutional rights. As a non-American you wouldn't understand that.

I'm not saying I agree with the gay marriage ban, but I agree that the original vote must be upheld. I think gay marriage will eventually be allowed in California and many other states, it will just take a few years before that happens.

"The California Supreme Court today upheld Proposition 8, the voter-approved law restoring a ban on same-sex marriages in the state, but at the same time left intact the more than 18,000 marriages for gay and lesbian couples who wed last year before the ballot measure went into effect.

The Supreme Court's decision puts California in unusual territory for the time being, establishing a two-tiered system of marriage across the state for same-sex couples. Under the ruling, Proposition 8 will continue to outlaw same-sex marriage in the future, but those gay and lesbian couples who got their marriage licenses before last November's election will remain on equal legal footing with heterosexual couples.

Chief Justice Ronald George, who authored last year's ruling striking down the state's prior ban on gay marriage, wrote today's majority opinion upholding Prop 8, cautioning that the decision is not based on whether the measure "is wise or sound as a matter of policy,'' but instead "concerns the scope of the right of the people ... to change or alter the state Constitution itself.

In a statement, Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger repeated his past stance that he believes gay marriage willl eventually be permitted in California. "While I believe that one day either the people or courts will recognize gay marriage, as governor of California I will uphold the decision,'' he said, adding the justices "made the right decision" to keep the existing marriages intact."
__________________
"What kind of shape am I in now? Well round is a shape." said Roddick with a laugh. "I had a very detailed retirement plan, and I feel like I've met every aspect of it: a lot of golf, a lot of carbs, a lot of fried food, and some booze, occasionally — I've been completely committed ... The results have shown."


Mugs Tennis Forums

Last edited by tangerine_dream : 05-26-2009 at 10:20 PM.
tangerine_dream is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 10:23 PM   #11
country flag Garson007
Registered User
 
Garson007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Stellenbosch
Age: 27
Posts: 3,887
Garson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond reputeGarson007 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Quote:
Originally Posted by tangerine_dream View Post
LOL, you and everybody else in this thread completely missed the point. The Supreme Court was not voting on whether gays have the right to be married or not, they were voting to uphold the voter's decision, which was a legal and fair state vote. If they overrule a legal majority vote then what's the point of voting? That would have been worse for our constitutional rights. As a non-American you wouldn't understand that.

I'm not saying I agree with the gay marriage ban, but I agree that the original vote must be upheld. I think gay marriage will eventually be allowed in California and many other states, it will just take a few years before that happens.
So, you're telling me that if a referendum comes through which states that coloured people cannot legally marry you would stand by it because it is what the people want? What bullshit.

I completely understand that it's really not for the good of the constitution for the court to overrule its people's vote, which is a very tricky situation to be in. It is however absolutely appalling that the referendum was held in the first place. It should have been discounted as unconstitutional before ballots were cast.
Garson007 is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 11:15 PM   #12
country flag Henry Chinaski
Registered User
 
Henry Chinaski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,752
Henry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond reputeHenry Chinaski has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

tyranny of the majority. whatever happened to Fed 10
__________________
www.shanktennis.com
Henry Chinaski is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2009, 11:56 PM   #13
country flag GlennMirnyi
Banned!
 
GlennMirnyi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: I'm in Porto Alegre, bitch!
Posts: 42,099
GlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond reputeGlennMirnyi has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Quote:
Originally Posted by tangerine_dream View Post
You and everybody else in this thread completely missed the point. The Supreme Court was not voting on whether gays have the right to be married or not, they were voting to uphold the voter's decision, which was a legal and fair state vote. If they overrule a legal majority vote then what's the point of voting? That would have been worse for our constitutional rights. As a non-American you wouldn't understand that.

I'm not saying I agree with the gay marriage ban, but I agree that the original vote must be upheld. I think gay marriage will eventually be allowed in California and many other states, it will just take a few years before that happens.

"The California Supreme Court today upheld Proposition 8, the voter-approved law restoring a ban on same-sex marriages in the state, but at the same time left intact the more than 18,000 marriages for gay and lesbian couples who wed last year before the ballot measure went into effect.

The Supreme Court's decision puts California in unusual territory for the time being, establishing a two-tiered system of marriage across the state for same-sex couples. Under the ruling, Proposition 8 will continue to outlaw same-sex marriage in the future, but those gay and lesbian couples who got their marriage licenses before last November's election will remain on equal legal footing with heterosexual couples.

Chief Justice Ronald George, who authored last year's ruling striking down the state's prior ban on gay marriage, wrote today's majority opinion upholding Prop 8, cautioning that the decision is not based on whether the measure "is wise or sound as a matter of policy,'' but instead "concerns the scope of the right of the people ... to change or alter the state Constitution itself.

In a statement, Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger repeated his past stance that he believes gay marriage willl eventually be permitted in California. "While I believe that one day either the people or courts will recognize gay marriage, as governor of California I will uphold the decision,'' he said, adding the justices "made the right decision" to keep the existing marriages intact."
This is bullshit.

So if the people decide that killing is legal the courts must uphold that?

The courts are there to not let the people do idiotic/unreasonable things (exactly what it is more prone to do).
GlennMirnyi is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2009, 12:58 AM   #14
country flag prima donna
Banned!
 
prima donna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 7,319
prima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond reputeprima donna has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Quote:
Originally Posted by GlennMirnyi View Post
So if the people decide that killing is legal the courts must uphold that?
It's illogical to draw a moral equivalency between a ban on same-sex marriage and the legalisation of murder.
prima donna is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2009, 01:01 AM   #15
country flag Pfloyd
Registered User
 
Pfloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Madrid
Age: 26
Posts: 14,793
Pfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond reputePfloyd has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: California Supreme Court upholds Proposition 8

Hah. What Bullshit.

Religion fucking it up, again. :retard:
__________________
I'm gonna get me a motor car Maybe a Jaguar Maybe a plane or day of fame I'm gonna be a millionaire So can you take me there? Wanna be wild 'cos my life's so tame Here am I, going nowhere on a train Here am I, growing older in the rain
- "Going Nowhere" Oasis
Pfloyd is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


Copyright (C) Verticalscope Inc
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBCredits v1.4 Copyright ©2007, PixelFX Studios