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Old 01-28-2011, 01:26 AM   #1936
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
Damned, too silent and brief a come-back for me.



I would like to bump this thread because I've been thinking for a while about Ennio Morricone being possibly a prog rock musician on several of his tunes. Thought I was crazy until I found this:

http://www.progarchives.com/forum/fo...nnio-morricone

What do you think?
Ennio Morricone.

And OF COURSE, he's included at ProgArchives.com!!!
I might have had a bit to do about that eh?

Check out his gorgeous 'Il Giardino Delle Delizie', actually written for a 1960's porn movie (YouTube is your friend! ) - for instance, as about ALL his work is fantastic - and just be amazed to hear that immaculate choir/organ/mellotron/Rickenbacker 4001-bass -FEAST. If that isn't 'progrock', I don't know what IS.

Okay, off again, my dear friends, but I just cannot help but check out my Proggie Dorks-thread once in a while!
Love ye all who contributed so far, and please keep on doing so.

[EDIT]: just found the vid:



Man, that is just immaculate...
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Old 01-29-2011, 04:30 AM   #1937
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

Just a bit of a to all of the "ProgRock-is-Dead"-tards.


Opeth's Deliverance- the outro with that immaculate drumming job by Mr. Martin Lopez...



And here's the guy doing that job all by himself:



Damn man... BRING HIM BAAAAAAACCCKKKKK!!!!

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Old 01-29-2011, 12:49 PM   #1938
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

It's hard to say goodbye, isn't it?

I remember we've talked about that psyche song from Il Giardino delle Delizie. The song is Adonai, by the way. And I remember that you were not 100% sure it was a Rick bass. During your absence I thought about you because I found the movie scene, so that the bass can be identified.





But however good it is, I'm not sure this is really prog. There are 3 themes in it and repeated in a cyclical structure.


I really thought about this one as prog: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kmh6rdRhcOw
Il Triello (which happens to be my favourite). I distinguish between five themes in it. The rise in power is repeated but there's still a progressive structure, isn't there? Just for this coda at the end !

By the we are here in 1966, thus one year before A Day in the Life, one year before Nights in White Satin, two years before all the stuff by The Nice and 3 years before The Court of the Crimson King.

And I'm sure Keith Emerson said Morricone greatly influenced his work.


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Old 01-31-2011, 12:48 AM   #1939
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
It's hard to say goodbye, isn't it?
From this particular thread, yeah it is...

Quote:
I remember we've talked about that psyche song from Il Giardino delle Delizie. The song is Adonai, by the way. And I remember that you were not 100% sure it was a Rick bass. During your absence I thought about you because I found the movie scene, so that the bass can be identified.
Awesome, thanks so much for that! What a fantastic vid, those hippies dancing on the beach, in contrast to those Catholic Religion-stiffies moving in the background. Yeah, I like that. I know which side I'd choose.
Could you send me a link to the ENTIRE movie, even if it's 1960's porn?
As for the bass, it's a semi-acoustic one - an Epiphone, perhaps?

Yeah well I guess I am a sucker for that old classic 1960-1970's recording sound just as much as for the classical instruments from that period, it sounds so grudgy, so 'garage' - unintentional of course, the recording equipment just wasn't any better at that time. At times, I think we've gone *over-the-hill* with the quest for 'perfection' in recording techniques nowadays...

The only current band that I know of that really manages to hit the mark with achieving a truly 'vintage' sound, is Sweden's Anekdoten:


Yeah and that IS a Rick, no doubt about it.

Quote:
But however good it is, I'm not sure this is really prog. There are 3 themes in it and repeated in a cyclical structure.
Haha, the Never-Ending Discussion on 'What's-Prog-And-What's-Not', again!

It will never end, and there will never ever come a definite answer to that discussion.
The Archives' forums are so much stuffed with battles concerning this very issue between the 'Hard-Liners' (i.e. the folks that believe that "Prog Music died with the departure of Peter Gabriel from Genesis back in 1974" or so) and the 'Anything-Goes'-folks (even regarding Iron Maiden as 'prog' - uhm, WOT??? ), that it comes close to matching MTF's worst tard-wars.

To me, anything Morricone made absolutely hits the marks set for ProgRock, or at least 'Prog-Related' or 'Proto-Prog'.

Quote:
I really thought about this one as prog:
I distinguish between five themes in it. The rise in power is repeated but there's still a progressive structure, isn't there? Just for this coda at the end !
Absolutely among his best work, and most certainly Prog imho.

You raise an important element on the 'What's Prog?'-question here, though. For many, it is indeed the (# of) presence of certain structures, 'technicalities' as I call them, and the like. For me - but this is of course very personal - technicalities are a non-issue in deciding whether-or-no some artist's work is 'Prog-or-Not'.

A lot of very technical Jazz-Rock is much loved sub-genre of progrock at the Archives for this very reason, but I feel no shame in admitting that I never managed to get into most of that material, despite (or maybe, because of?) all those very elaborate proggie structures - apart from a few exceptions, mainly being Zappa, Miles Davis, UK, & Bruford.

I tend to miss the conveyance of pure EMOTION in most of that kind of music, and that is an integral part of ProgRock to me... overdoing it on 'structures' at the cost of emotion has never worked all too well for me.
Read: it doesn't work at all for me.

At the same time, the genre of 'atmospheric prog' mainly consists of repeated patterns of the same structures - hence, it is so-called 'simple' - but it works very well with me, as the best bands within that genre never forget to emphasize on emotion.

Ah it's all a matter of personal taste in the end, isn't it? :wink:
The BEST bands, imho, are those who manage to combine elaborate structuring of their music with still being able to convey genuine emotion. Guess that's why I am still a fan of Yes' and Genesis' early works.

Quote:
By the we are here in 1966, thus one year before A Day in the Life, one year before Nights in White Satin, two years before all the stuff by The Nice and 3 years before The Court of the Crimson King.

And I'm sure Keith Emerson said Morricone greatly influenced his work.
- and that's exactly one of the major reasons why I think Morricone rightfully is included on the Archives. He was a genuine 'Premier Adapter' along the line of thought of 'Anything Goes' -'eclectic prog-related' best describes his music I think.

Quote:
PS: you can send me a PM if you don't wanna come here again.
- no worries about that. I will NEVER be able to totally abandon this thread, that's for sure.

Thanks so much for that, and to all other nice people who sent me reps lately as well!
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Old 02-01-2011, 02:30 PM   #1940
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

I don't know why say goodbye, say hello.
LOL I had that experience on other forums, saying goodbye and then come back, too addicted. Ironically I've left them for good now, not even realizing it. But well, I know it's none of my business but whatever happened, it's just a forum, nothing to be taken seriously.


I haven't found the entire film, so I don't know if it's porn or not. The scene is very much a cliché, though.

So it's not a Rick, then? I love the Rickenbacker 370/12 guitar, when used by McGuinn. On your clip, it's definitely one, I do recognize it.


I'm not sure technicity really is a criteria for prog rock, actually or perhaps I don't understand what it is. I rather thought about conceptualization. Having different themes in mind and connecting them, as if it were different songs in one. My problem is that every rock songs might be called progressive then if they contain a solo. Might progressiveness be a relative notion? Where do you draw the line between what is and what is not?

About Ennio, the problem is that I already knew you considered him prog but I don't know many who would agree on this.

If we want to consider him prog rock, then it must also be proved he was a rocker. That's not easy for me but he definitely worked with a great guitarist, namely Alessandro Alessandroni. And Alessandroni worked on Il buono,...


I've recently seen the film at the cinema . It was the first time I had seen it in the English version and what's more, it was the extended version. I was delighted. Leone really invented westerns. American westerns were crap.

See you !
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Old 02-01-2011, 03:46 PM   #1941
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
I don't know why say goodbye, say hello.
LOL I had that experience on other forums, saying goodbye and then come back, too addicted. Ironically I've left them for good now, not even realizing it. But well, I know it's none of my business but whatever happened, it's just a forum, nothing to be taken seriously.
- yeah well this thread is the only part of MTF which I still care about. A lot, apparently.

Quote:
I haven't found the entire film, so I don't know if it's porn or not. The scene is very much a cliché, though.
It says on the liner notes on one of my Morricone-albums that he wrote many scores for obscure 1960's porn movies, this song being one of those. Morricone apparently didn't bother all too much about in which 'artworks' his own art would be appearing. Quite notably too is that Morricone has been (still is, I suppose) a massive fan of the works of Pier Paolo Pasolini, responsible for what's been called "the most obscene movie ever made", Salò.

Quote:
So it's not a Rick, then? I love the Rickenbacker 370/12 guitar, when used by McGuinn. On your clip, it's definitely one, I do recognize it.
It still looks like a Rick, but not the 'classical' Rickenbacker 4001 (which is used in Anekdoten's clip). The one used in the Morricone film-clip could well be an earlier model, it surely looks like a semi-acoustic variation, indeed highly resembling the outlooks of the Rickenbacker guitars.

All of the Ricks - whether basses or guitars - have this unique, tinkling, 'twangy' sound which I like very much indeed. The brand has of course been made famous by the Beatles first and foremost, who played about all of their music on Ricks - not just Lennon and Harrison, but Paul McCartney, too. You always see him depicted with that Hohner bass on official band pictures, but he only used that thing on stage - most of his studio recordings were done using the Rickenbacker 4001.

Quote:
I'm not sure technicity really is a criteria for prog rock, actually or perhaps I don't understand what it is. I rather thought about conceptualization. Having different themes in mind and connecting them, as if it were different songs in one. My problem is that every rock songs might be called progressive then if they contain a solo. Might progressiveness be a relative notion? Where do you draw the line between what is and what is not?
The technical capabilities (odd time-signatures, off-keys, etc.) that a band shows in their music is most definitely a criterium for most to decide whether 'prog-or-no', certainly for the jazz-rock and prog-metal freaks. Point is, there are many more criteria, and others find 'conceptualization' a lot more important. The big problem is of course, some bands have neither, and are still considered prog... some 90% of neo-prog bands come to mind.
'Progressiveness' is indeed a very relative notion. It's quite a silly name nowadays though, as some bands try as much as they can to revive the 1970's sound... is that indeed 'progressive'? I don't think so.

Therefore, there will always be fighting about the matter among the progfans. It's a very thin line indeed. I personally do consider Deep Purple 'prog-related' for instance, whereas Iron Maiden - NOPE - but it's damn hard to explain why, and I won't even try to do so.

Quote:
About Ennio, the problem is that I already knew you considered him prog but I don't know many who would agree on this.
Plenty folks do so, if only for his massive influence on classical prog from 1970's onwards. I personally share no doubts on him being a rocker, too!

Quote:
I've recently seen the film at the cinema . It was the first time I had seen it in the English version and what's more, it was the extended version. I was delighted. Leone really invented westerns. American westerns were crap.
It's a genuine masterpiece and along with Leone's "Once upon a time in the west", perhaps the best ever western ever made.
And of course, Morricone's score for both of them is an integral part of them being masterpieces.
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Old 02-05-2011, 05:05 PM   #1942
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

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Originally Posted by Bonnie the Cat View Post
Quite notably too is that Morricone has been (still is, I suppose) a massive fan of the works of Pier Paolo Pasolini, responsible for what's been called "the most obscene movie ever made", Salò.
Me too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonnie the Cat View Post
The brand has of course been made famous by the Beatles first and foremost, who played about all of their music on Ricks - not just Lennon and Harrison, but Paul McCartney, too. You always see him depicted with that Hohner bass on official band pictures, but he only used that thing on stage - most of his studio recordings were done using the Rickenbacker 4001.
Actually Mr Rickenbacker (spelling?) was a Beatles-fan and hence personally offered his new model of 12 string electric guitar to Harrison. McGuinn didn't know that that existed and noticed Harrison was playing with it during their first US tour. But McGuinn was definitely the one who could optimized all the options that that new model could offer (with his roll, banjo-picking technique and the jangle sound, lovely. I'm a true Byrds fan )

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonnie the Cat View Post
The technical capabilities (odd time-signatures, off-keys, etc.)
off-keys? Is that what is meant by dissonances ??? Because I rather relate that to psychedelia and not necessarily prog, though can also be.


Not really prog, but first use of the Moog synthe on film scores, this is my tribute to the great John Barry



RIP !

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Old 02-06-2011, 07:38 PM   #1943
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

Apparently Gary Moore passed away in his sleep during the early hours today while vacationing in Spain.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-12377862



Cheers, Gary.
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Old 02-06-2011, 10:55 PM   #1944
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

RIP Gary. A heck of a guitar player he was. One of my favorite rendition of this Hendrix classic ever. Pino Palladino on the bass is also crisp.

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Old 02-09-2011, 03:12 AM   #1945
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

Hi, my dear Music Lovers!

Yeah, isn't it sad... though not a progger, but yet another brilliant guitar player bites the dust.
A 'Dirty White Boy' from Ireland, managing to capture the true heart of the *blues* like... well the guys he played along with, including BB King. So sad to know that he never ever felt any true satisfaction within his life, neither within his career, despite all the successes that finally came to him past the 1990's.

I've had the good luck of seeing Gary Moore a couple of times LIVE, somewhere back in the late 1980's.
One of those times, a good twenty years ago.

This will always be a favourite of mine - of his:



Parisienne Walkways - with Thin Lizzy

There was a well-worded obituary about the guy in my newspaper yesterday -
"Gary Moore, the guy that could genuinely make his guitar WEEP".

And so it was, and is. R.I.P., you dear fellow.
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Old 02-09-2011, 03:35 AM   #1946
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

Oops. Did I just say that Gary Moore wasn't prog?

Just listen to THIS:


Hurricane - from his 1982 Westfalen Halle gig in Dortmund, Germany. WOW!!!
btw, that's Deep Purple's Ian Paice and Rainbow's Don Airy playing along with him...

It comes pretty close to progrock, if I dare say so.

Another one truly bit the dust...
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Old 02-14-2011, 04:43 AM   #1947
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

I mainly listen to classical, but a good proggie is always butter to the ears. That Morricone at the top of the page is rad
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Old 02-15-2011, 02:01 AM   #1948
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

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I mainly listen to classical, but a good proggie is always butter to the ears. That Morricone at the top of the page is rad
Welcome to the thread, mate.

If you like Classical, and Proggie, as well, and Morricone...

Check out Therion.

The Wine of Aluqua:



Shit man, I WAS THERE!!!


From Mr. Johanson's fantastic album "Vovin"
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Old 02-15-2011, 02:14 AM   #1949
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!

Oh Oh Oh....

The Rise of Sodom and Gomorrah...



That fantastic big, red-heared lady singing there from around the 2:00 minutes mark, isn't that the gorgeous Ms. Sarah Jezebel Deva - devil?
Yep it is.

SHEEEET MAN, what a singer! WHAT A VOICE!!!! Immaculate!!!

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Am I still here? As one, with The Fear?
Am I still alive? I'm still f*cking ... Here...!"


"The Storm Before The Calm"

Anathema

Into music of the PROG-Dorky-kind? visit my blog or MTF's Prog Rock Thread.

Last edited by Sunset of Age : 02-15-2011 at 04:30 AM.
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Old 02-15-2011, 02:38 AM   #1950
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Default Re: Bonnie the Cat's, formerly know as Stupid Dream - PROG ROCK thread!



"But still the Sun Refused to Burn!!!"
AKA, Nexus Polaris.

Shitty, Black Metal. Rubbish. Which I like very, very much.
Featuring that so-called Fat Woman/Goddess named Sarah Jezebel Deva.
__________________
"It's getting colder, I'm getting colder, older, it's getting colder...

Am I still here? As one, with The Fear?
Am I still alive? I'm still f*cking ... Here...!"


"The Storm Before The Calm"

Anathema

Into music of the PROG-Dorky-kind? visit my blog or MTF's Prog Rock Thread.
Sunset of Age is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
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