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Old 07-09-2008, 02:14 PM   #106
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

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Originally Posted by luie View Post
Ok!Ok! nadal's gamesmanship is actually benefiting to the other players. I GUESS that's why it increases astronomically when he is facing BP to help the other players concentrate & "gather themselves"
to plan their next move..
MacTheKnife made his own point better >> enjoy!
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Below is the rule from the ATP Rule Book: …

That's the rule, but I just have a different perspective on Nadal and the time he takes. I truly believe that the main one that would benefit from him speeding up his play is Nadal himself. IMO, he is the fittest guy in tennis right now, so why would he want to intentionally give his opponent time to regroup physically and mentally before he hits the next serve. If he would pick up his pace of play, I honestly believe he could wear opponents down even quicker than he does now. I know if I was playing a guy anywhere near his physical ability, I would never complain that he was taking to much time. I frankly, would enjoy the time to collect my thoughts and catch my breath. Nothing was tougher for me to play than a guy that was extremely physical and played quickly. It is much harder to deal with than being given that extra amount of time to collect oneself. That's why I don't think his opponents complain. Would you want him to speed up, or get some extra time between his grueling style.
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Old 07-09-2008, 05:09 PM   #107
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

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Apart from Nadal himself, is it the fault of the umpires for being too lenient, or are they under instructions to go easy on him? Officials certainly appear reluctant to do anything to upset him. Or should his opponents be complaining to the umpires more about it?

Secondly, is Nadal's timewasting deliberate gamesmanship, or a consequence of his supersized ego and over-inflated opinion of himself, or due to something else?
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Old 07-10-2008, 02:02 PM   #108
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

Nadal and Massu, they could play a 100 minute set for 6-3.

The ball would be in play for around 35 minutes.
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I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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Old 07-10-2008, 02:57 PM   #109
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

I think both Nadal and the umpire(s) have to take their share of the blame here if it's causing concern amongst the other players. If the umpire(s) aren't going to apply the rules consistently and fairly, then Nadal will see no need to alter his own game if all he knows he's going to get is a warning for exceeding the threshold allowed.

If they were, Nadal and his backroom team would then have to have a serious discussion in order to speed up his game. I don't peraonlly think Rafa is intentionally doing it to disturb his opponents' rhythm, but it does take him longer to compose himself on important points, which can be taken in a number of different ways by player's on the other side of the net.

Point is, if the umpire(s) were consistent enough to pull him up for it and delve out more severe punishments, then he'll stop doing it. A bit like a naughty child: he does something silly and they get a telling off, and they go do the same thing again, but put them on the naughty step for 15 minutes and they learn their lesson.
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Old 07-10-2008, 03:13 PM   #110
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

They should have a countdown clock like in basketball.
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Old 07-10-2008, 04:10 PM   #111
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

Both Rafa and Novak take their time. But Rafa's time wasting is all a part of his well known routine. Take a look when he serves, he maybe wasting time but his opponent knows when he's about to serve. He's ready as the short picking, ball bouncing and hair touching is over. Nadal then bounces the ball with his racket, then bounces the ball 6 times and serves.

Now, look at Novak. Did anyone read the match review from the US open site last year when Novak beat Carlos Moya? The review started with the word "bounce" on repeat for 28 times. Those were the number of times Nole bounced the ball when he was down a set point. Now, there I do see malice not only cause Nole was trying to psyche Moya out, but also, how can a player get ready to return if your opponent bounces the ball 28 times?

For all of you guys who really play tennis, take a look around and see how every tennis player is more or less waiting for the serve, but it's only when the player who's serve finally hold the ball after the bouncing when they position themselves for the return. Nole bounces the ball 28 times and he serves right after the last bounce with no time in between so the player expecting the serve has to be focus for all the time he's bouncing the ball. This is also tricky for the umnpires cause they don't know when Nole will finish bouncing the ball (I assume they are probably thinking, three more times and I call a warning, but the warning never happens).

To sum up, I do agree both players should be warned and penalized for time wasting, but Nole's timewasting is far more annoying than RAFA's.

On a side note, Nole started his time wasting spree in 2007, after RG. In 2006, when he lost to RAFA in the Quarters, or even at the IW final in 2007, he had not yet started to bounce as many times as he did in the second half of 2007.
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Old 07-10-2008, 04:20 PM   #112
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

I don't see anything wrong with Rafas bouncing. Novak was doing his more to calm and concentrate, rather than to psyche out opponents. Now he bounces less and is generally within 'appropriate limits' - even the pseudo-moralistic ones.

Anyway, all this bounce-related moaning came from couple of fancy pancy players who got overwhelmed by it - like Tsonga.

And by Fed fans, who - Oh My! - felt it was endangering their prospects of greatness.
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Old 07-10-2008, 04:38 PM   #113
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

We wouldn't be having this discussion if umpires enforced the rules consistently throughout the season.
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Old 07-10-2008, 05:08 PM   #114
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

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We wouldn't be having this discussion if umpires enforced the rules consistently throughout the season.
Exactly.
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Old 07-11-2008, 08:06 AM   #115
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

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We wouldn't be having this discussion if umpires enforced the rules consistently throughout the season.
That would be great in theory, but not bloody likely.
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I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
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Old 07-27-2008, 01:46 AM   #116
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

nadal didn't take it lightly when morier decided to issue a warning today - mainly because he came up with a df right after that. he was pretty pissed and had a go at the umpire, there was some "puta" in those sentences but i'm not sure if it was actually directed at morier (neither was he, obviously).

it was about damn time though, as nadal has been taking lots of time tonight throughout the match. umpires should really law down the law earlier in matches in order to show him who's in charge of the whole thing and who's not.
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Old 07-27-2008, 01:59 AM   #117
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

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nadal didn't take it lightly when morier decided to issue a warning today - mainly because he came up with a df right after that. he was pretty pissed and had a go at the umpire, there was some "puta" in those sentences but i'm not sure if it was actually directed at morier (neither was he, obviously).

it was about damn time though, as nadal has been taking lots of time tonight throughout the match. umpires should really law down the law earlier in matches in order to show him who's in charge of the whole thing and who's not.
Yeah, but ultimately what's the point? You know he's not going to give him a point pentalty. Nadal knows it too, which is why he continued to take his time after the warning.
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Old 07-27-2008, 01:59 AM   #118
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

but still Umpires call a time violiation just one per match ,Nadal is going to keep doing this over and over.
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Old 07-27-2008, 02:31 AM   #119
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

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but still Umpires call a time violiation just one per match ,Nadal is going to keep doing this over and over.
It would mean a hell of a difference if a player who continuously breaks the rules on time-wasting would not just recieve a code violation (which in fact means NOTHING), but would in fact be punished with LOSING a point.

I love Rafa, I truly do, but yes, I would be very pleased if finally one umpire would have the guts to do so, as I really think that's where Rafa truly breaks the rules of the game. But as Money Talks And Shit Walks, it's not going to happen.
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Old 07-27-2008, 02:43 AM   #120
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Default Re: Nadal's timewasting - who's to blame?

Mourier did exactly what all the umpires do when they are going as far as they dare. They wait until a big point. Rafa was a set and break up, was serving to consolidate and fell behind 15-40, 30-40. While he took much longer on previous points, he got the warning serving at break point, and promptly double faulted. The closest the umpire dares without taking point penalty.

If the umpire really was bent on enforcing the rules, he'd call out the violation as soon as it happens, the FIRST time, on some meaningless point if it happens to be. Then the players would know, or be aware, that there might be another code violation and a point penalty coming down the pike later.
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