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Old 12-26-2008, 01:59 AM   #91
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

Trucul, I can be your Co-Manager in Australia Open.
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Old 12-26-2008, 03:50 AM   #92
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

if anybody can me my Assistant Manager in Memphis will be so cool so i can play it that tournament
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Old 12-26-2008, 08:39 AM   #93
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

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Originally Posted by vmbf View Post
Trucul, I can be your Co-Manager in Australia Open.
Thanks vmbf !

I am looking for an assistant manager for Doha. If anybody is interested, please let me know.
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Old 01-13-2009, 07:28 PM   #94
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

Hello everybody,

it seems that I have seen many complaints in the previous days related to new DTT rules + some top DTT players considering retirement (diego36arg today but also Björki, Drikke being very busy, Alex having some difficulties to manage Sydney, ...).

I think it is time to find a way to be less time consuming for this game for DTT managers and players. Like the majority of you, I am also a TT player (I am also trying women TT since beginning of year) but also PAW, FITD player and I don't think that DTT is one of the priority games (but maybe this is the case, I would be very glad about that).

That is why I think it is time (based on our experience since beginning of the year with new rules) to reconsider DTT rules and maybe the way this game is played.

Do not hesitate to suggest some othe enhancements (even the craziest ones !) with still an objective to keep DTT attractive but less time consuming.

You will find hereunder some thoughts I have.
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Old 01-13-2009, 07:44 PM   #95
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

First thing is about DTT tournaments themselves. The average number of players is currently around 30 per week which is good, but with some players not sending picks on time in the early rounds. Note also the complexity for DTT Managers to know whether or not they should set up qualies and on which matches should qualies be based based on 3 OOP of tournaments of the week. That is a real nightmare, especially if timezone of tournaments is not compatible with timezone of manager.

What I would suggest is following thing:

- be inspire to reality. In real life, ATP doubles players can be spread into 2 categories:
- the Singles players who consider Doubles as a way to warm up for their singles matches and as a way to keep an interest and an objective in the tournament they attend if they are out very soon in Singles.
- the Doubles specialists who do not play singles at all (or at a very modest level).

In DTT, I guess this is the same as with TT. Some DTT players consider this game as a good way to play TT once they are out of TT competition, some others consider DTT as a regular activity with great interest because they are well ranked in DTT and have a poor rank in TT (or are suspended in TT like diego36arg like year).

In real life, Doubles matches include only 16 spots for a tournament so that the number of matches is limited.

That is why I would suggest to have tournament entries (ATP 200 and 500) with only 16 players (14 being accepted in MD and 2 qualifiers) for DTT Singles and 8 pairs for DTT Doubles (7 accepted in MD + 1 qualifier). And the picks would only be based on the specific tournament.

For instance, this week, there would have been one DTT Sydney based on picks of Sydney matches and one DTT Auckland based on picks of Auckland matches. Entry acceptance would be the same as the one of TT.
For weeks where there are ATP 1000, entries would be 32 players (28 accepted in MD + 4 qualifiers).
For Grand Slam weeks, 64 players in MD.

This would allow in for ATP 200 / 500 to start tournament a little bit later (on Monday ?) for players being in MD and focus on TT matches on Monday. For DTT manager, this would be less matches to handle but, of course, this would require one manager per tournament, so more than 1 manager per week.
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Old 01-13-2009, 07:47 PM   #96
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

Then, regarding deadline and publishment of diffs, I think we all agree rule set in place in TT is unfair and we should come back to rule of last year.

I would like to have a small update anyway to the rule of last year to ease the job of DTT managers.

Assume you have following OOP in a tournament:

14:00 CET: Federer vs. Nadal
followed by Nestor/Zimonjic vs. Bryan/Bryan.

=============

Deadline will be by default "when matches start" but starting from 14:00 CET, if all picks are available to the DTT Manager, it will not be possible for DTT players to change their picks, which means that, once DTT Manager has picks from everybody, he can publish diffs without waiting for matches to start.

Of course, if some diffs are missing, DTT Manager will have to wait for matches to start before publishing diffs.

Regarding late picks, we can come back to rule of last year (consider late picks only for matches having already started).

In order not to penalize doubles partner who has sent picks, I am also thinking about a joker rule which would be "if your partner has not sent picks or sends late picks", his picks can be replaced by your picks (for doubles only, not singles). However, your partner will not get DTT points for this match (only you) if your team wins.
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Old 01-13-2009, 07:47 PM   #97
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

Trucul I dont consider retirement (unless I really can't win matches anymore)

I really like DTT because I like watching doubles too.
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Old 01-13-2009, 07:54 PM   #98
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

about the deadline I would prefer "when first doubles match start" if this is okay for manager.

Quote:
In order not to penalize doubles partner who has sent picks, I am also thinking about a joker rule which would be "if your partner has not sent picks or sends late picks", his picks can be replaced by your picks (for doubles only, not singles). However, your partner will not get DTT points for this match (only you) if your team wins.
I dont like it, to use the partners picks if someone is late. It's really their fault.

Quote:
Regarding late picks, we can come back to rule of last year (consider late picks only for matches having already started).


what about alternate teams (LL like in TT)
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Old 01-13-2009, 07:56 PM   #99
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

Regarding publishment of diffs and results by DTT Manager, you can see that last week, I found eaasier to publish results in format +1:00 instead of the real score. This is based on my way of counting diffs (I am not using Excel sheet and doing it manually). However, I think that publishment of diffs is quite time consuming (if you are using Excel sheet, you need to dump PMs in Excel format; if you are not using Excel sheet like me, you need to copy/paste PM in a file and build manually your diffs. Very difficult especially when picks come just before deadline and when you are at work office.

I was thinking about having a way to send picks to a mailbox (either a generic account in MTF like DTT_Game or an account under hotmail ...). The password of this account would be owned by a DTT Manager, so only this manager could access mailbox. When deadline is reached, this DTT Manager could publish password so that everybody could consult this account and make its own diffs. That would require that we have a minimum of discipline (no spam to send to this account, when you are connected, do not erase mails ...). I don't know if possible but we could modify properties of this account to make it read-only at some times, only viewable during some periods of time. Well, maybe also, a kind of site with some basic javascript of VBscript could do that but I am not expert on that.
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Old 01-13-2009, 08:00 PM   #100
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

about publishment:

I dont like this +1:00 so much (the other one seems easier to me ) but I wont complain if it is easier for the managers who has a lot of work. (maybe SR should be added)
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Old 01-13-2009, 08:09 PM   #101
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Björki View Post
about the deadline I would prefer "when first doubles match start" if this is okay for manager.

I dont like it, to use the partners picks if someone is late. It's really their fault.



what about alternate teams (LL like in TT)
Of course, that is what I meant 'when first doubles match start' which means in my example when "Nestor/Zimonjic match starts". But, we never know .. Since Nadal/Federer may not be played because of w.o., in theory, to secure things, all DTT players should send their picks between 14:00 CET. So, if all picks are there at 14:00 CET, DTT manager should be allowed to publish diffs at that time if this is more convenient for him.

Regarding your remark about "it is their fault", I agree. But, for instance, I am out this week in Doubles because of diego36arg not sending picks even if we were +3 after day 1. And diego sent me his picks 2 hours after deadline. Of course, this should be exceptional (allowed only once in the tournament, and you could have penalties for that, eg. if you are tied, this should be first TB criterion before SRs) but it would help to keep the fun and be more tolerant with a player not sending picks (and not penalizing too much the partner). When I was in opposite situation, it is not fun for me to win by wo because one guy of opponent team did not send picks.

Of course, if you have alternate teams sending both picks, they should replace the team who has sent 0 or 1 pick. So, this "exceptional" rule does not apply on day 1 of first round of tournament (except if there is no alternate).
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Old 01-13-2009, 08:10 PM   #102
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Björki View Post
about publishment:

I dont like this +1:00 so much (the other one seems easier to me ) but I wont complain if it is easier for the managers who has a lot of work. (maybe SR should be added)
Sure, SR is always added also in the same manner:

00:00 SRs: +1:00

Of course, if we need to go to CB, I will have to count the real number of correct picks.
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Old 01-13-2009, 09:26 PM   #103
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

My opinions:

- The system should stay about the same like it is now (like TT more or less)
- Qualifying should be done on Saturdays and Sundays like in TT, but with the semifinals and finals of the week before (also challengers!). Then it is easier to manage.
- Deadline for picks. The new rule is easier for managers. If play (first doubles match according to OOP) starts at 3 AM CET, I can see if the manager says deadline is then and then it should be accepted that no more picks can be sent after that! On the other hand, if there is a delay due to whatever reason and the manager is around, then can also accept if they are sent later

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Old 01-13-2009, 09:31 PM   #104
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by maldini View Post
My opinions:

- The system should stay about the same like it is now (like TT more or less)
- Qualifying should be done on Saturdays and Sundays like in TT, but with the semifinals and finals of the week before (also challengers!). Then it is easier to manage.
- Deadline for picks. The new rule is easier for managers. If play (first doubles match according to OOP) starts at 3 AM CET, I can see if the manager says deadline is then and then it should be accepted that no more picks can be sent after that! On the other hand, if there is a delay due to whatever reason and the manager is around, then can also accept if they are sent later

Agree with this and with the +1:00 system
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Old 01-13-2009, 09:47 PM   #105
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Default Re: Doubles Tennis Tipping (DTT) Managers Thread-- Managers needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by maldini View Post
My opinions:

- The system should stay about the same like it is now (like TT more or less)
- Qualifying should be done on Saturdays and Sundays like in TT, but with the semifinals and finals of the week before (also challengers!). Then it is easier to manage.
- Deadline for picks. The new rule is easier for managers. If play (first doubles match according to OOP) starts at 3 AM CET, I can see if the manager says deadline is then and then it should be accepted that no more picks can be sent after that! On the other hand, if there is a delay due to whatever reason and the manager is around, then can also accept if they are sent later

Thanks for valuable remarks. Regarding qualifying on week-ends, this is difficult to put in place because, quite often, Saturday is considered as day of Doubles final, so we may have 2 or 3 matches only on Saturdays (even including Challengers) and no matches on Sundays. If we add Saturday + Sunday + Monday, we could have a decent number of matches for 2 rounds of qualies but that is not 100% guaranteed.

Regarding deadline for picks, new rule is easier for managers but it leads to too much frustration for the player who sends picks before match has started but is not accepted. With singles, this is easier because most of time deadline corresponds to first match being played in the day. In doubles, it is often difficult to give a firm deadline since matches are often after singles matches and are after a match which as a deadline. So, between this deadline and start of first Doubles match, we may have 1 to 2 hours which is enough to have frustration from players who send picks during that time.



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