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Old 05-31-2007, 07:01 PM   #46
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

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Originally Posted by safin-rules-no.1 View Post
please stop - it's getting more and more pathetic if you have nothing against gay people you wouldnt be writing this. And calling gay parenting messed up is just ignorance again - no evidence suggests that i have read states that the children experince any difference in love or attention.
Not that I disagree with all your points but there have actually been many studies showing that same sex parentage produces a far higher rate of depression in children as well as other things. There are also contradictory studies though so I guess it is up to a person to make up their own mind.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:03 PM   #47
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

I agree that homosexuality isn't a free choice, no-one's sexuality is in the end, but I do question how anyone can be born gay, or straight for that matter. Isn't it a matter of nurture rather than nature, the interaction with others and the development of sexual feelings as one grows older? It is something that develops over time and it isn't a clear-cut, cast iron thing, where someone's skin colour is an unalterable fact from birth.
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ROGER FEDERER: Yeah, I remember this one time when I went on a vacation on the Maldives. That was in the year 2001, I think. I went to this spa. I went to walk around with my girlfriend. I walk in, and we want to book a spa. This guy goes, "AHH, I remember you. You beat Sampras. I saw you on TV." That was like, really, how can you remember me? This guy has probably never been off his island and still knows me. I was a little bit shocked. Then I went to play tennis with him because he was actually the tennis teacher. It was nice.

Q. Were you naked at the time in the spa?

ROGER FEDERER: No. It was at the front desk. I didn't walk in naked.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:12 PM   #48
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

LOL at the advertising banner on this page, BTW. Are these things thread-sensitive or what?

As regards the original issue of the thread, the hotel owner does make clear that only heterosexual people whose behaviour is unacceptable will be barred, not straight people full stop. Of course there is the implication behind this statement that gay people displaying unacceptable behaviour will not be given the same treatment, but in reality I imagine that they would be ejected for rudeness or harassment in exactly the same way.

It comes down to the same issue of integration vs segregation that affects every minority group in society, although with gay people I don't think the cultural difference is as big as with religious and ethnic minorities (or is that a mistaken assumption on my part?). I can understand why many homosexuals would say that if society isn't willing to accept them on equal terms then they do want places and events of their own; it's not desirable, but it seems almost inevitable. The gay Olympics does seem a rather ludicrous idea, though - what does it prove athletically if you as a sportsman who happens to be gay does better than other sportsmen who happen to be gay? They'd surely much rather test themselves against the best athletes full stop, regardless of sexuality.
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The Wit and Wisdom of the Tennis Journalist, Indian Wells 2004

ROGER FEDERER: Yeah, I remember this one time when I went on a vacation on the Maldives. That was in the year 2001, I think. I went to this spa. I went to walk around with my girlfriend. I walk in, and we want to book a spa. This guy goes, "AHH, I remember you. You beat Sampras. I saw you on TV." That was like, really, how can you remember me? This guy has probably never been off his island and still knows me. I was a little bit shocked. Then I went to play tennis with him because he was actually the tennis teacher. It was nice.

Q. Were you naked at the time in the spa?

ROGER FEDERER: No. It was at the front desk. I didn't walk in naked.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:14 PM   #49
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

OK, so it's a different advertisement on this page now. Well, that was a meaningless quip...
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The Wit and Wisdom of the Tennis Journalist, Indian Wells 2004

ROGER FEDERER: Yeah, I remember this one time when I went on a vacation on the Maldives. That was in the year 2001, I think. I went to this spa. I went to walk around with my girlfriend. I walk in, and we want to book a spa. This guy goes, "AHH, I remember you. You beat Sampras. I saw you on TV." That was like, really, how can you remember me? This guy has probably never been off his island and still knows me. I was a little bit shocked. Then I went to play tennis with him because he was actually the tennis teacher. It was nice.

Q. Were you naked at the time in the spa?

ROGER FEDERER: No. It was at the front desk. I didn't walk in naked.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:17 PM   #50
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

I actually don't give a shit if homosexuals want to get married. I don't agree with it but don't care enough to go out of my way and make a big deal about it so arguing with you is useless since it never really crosses my mind or ever bothers me.

However, when it comes to a gay parenting...that's just wrong. Every child needs a mother and a father so why give equal rights to adopting families whether they be two men, two men or a man/woman couple? That's not fair that some adopted kids would be placed in a man/man parenting situation. Like I said, every mother has a purpose for a young child and every father has a purpose for a young child. By allowing this, you now have to start teaching kids in school about same sex relationships and how its the same as anything else when it really is not. Cmon man...dont kid yourself. There is a huge difference between a kid who has a mom and a dad and a kid who has two dads.

Now that brings us back to gay marriage. If you don't allow it, then there is no problem with the adoption process because without the marriage, there is no court hearing for adoption.

Whatever, it's not a huge deal but the more it expands, the more society is going to have problems adjusting and developping to these new standards and this new culture. No matter how much you want or try or hope, the homosexual lifestyle will never be considered okay in society by everyone and it will be next to impossible to give equal rights in all forms of society. That's just how things go.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:18 PM   #51
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

I agree with Mista on this one. I dont care whether someone is gay and people can do what they wish but it just isnt right for a child to be raised by two men.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:19 PM   #52
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

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Originally Posted by stebs View Post
Not that I disagree with all your points but there have actually been many studies showing that same sex parentage produces a far higher rate of depression in children as well as other things. There are also contradictory studies though so I guess it is up to a person to make up their own mind.


You are 100% right. If gay couples start having equal rights to adopting children as regular couples, the consequences could be catastrophic. Check this out:


The implications for children in a world of decaying families are profound. A recent article in the Weekly Standard described how the advent of legally sanctioned gay unions in Scandinavian countries has already destroyed the institution of marriage, where half of today's children are born out of wedlock.

It is predicted now, based on demographic trends in this country, that more than half of the babies born in the 1990s will spend at least part of their childhood in single-parent homes.

Social scientists have been surprisingly consistent in warning against this fractured family. If it continues, almost every child will have several "moms" and "dads," perhaps six or eight "grandparents," and dozens of half-siblings. It will be a world where little boys and girls are shuffled from pillar to post in an ever-changing pattern of living arrangements-where huge numbers of them will be raised in foster-care homes or living on the street (as millions do in other countries all over the world today). Imagine an environment where nothing is stable and where people think primarily about themselves and their own self-preservation.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:21 PM   #53
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistaflava View Post
Whatever, it's not a huge deal but the more it expands, the more society is going to have problems adjusting and developping to these new standards and this new culture. No matter how much you want or try or hope, the homosexual lifestyle will never be considered okay in society by everyone and it will be next to impossible to give equal rights in all forms of society. That's just how things go.
I think you're right, but it's far easier for you and I to adopt this "Que sera, sera" attitude than it is for members of a prejudiced minority to accept that they will always be discriminated against in some shape or form.
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The Wit and Wisdom of the Tennis Journalist, Indian Wells 2004

ROGER FEDERER: Yeah, I remember this one time when I went on a vacation on the Maldives. That was in the year 2001, I think. I went to this spa. I went to walk around with my girlfriend. I walk in, and we want to book a spa. This guy goes, "AHH, I remember you. You beat Sampras. I saw you on TV." That was like, really, how can you remember me? This guy has probably never been off his island and still knows me. I was a little bit shocked. Then I went to play tennis with him because he was actually the tennis teacher. It was nice.

Q. Were you naked at the time in the spa?

ROGER FEDERER: No. It was at the front desk. I didn't walk in naked.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:21 PM   #54
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

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I agree with Mista on this one. I dont care whether someone is gay and people can do what they wish but it just isnt right for a child to be raised by two men.


Exactly. I just don't understand why they feel the need to mess up a child like that? Why do they need to adopt? Why not just live a happy life? The kid is 100% going to be teased and harassed his entire life, depression is almost guaranteed once he's a teenager and how the hell is a kid supposed to understand that he doesn't have a mom (because moms do things only moms can do). There is a huge difference between a single parent (because you can explain that the other is not around) and a member of the same sex acting like a mom...it makes no sense.

My problem is...homosexuals see things their way and their way only...there is no balance between what they see and what society is trying to explain. It's ridiculous...
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:25 PM   #55
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

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Originally Posted by Mistaflava View Post
Exactly. I just don't understand why they feel the need to mess up a child like that? Why do they need to adopt? Why not just live a happy life? The kid is 100% going to be teased and harassed his entire life, depression is almost guaranteed once he's a teenager and how the hell is a kid supposed to understand that he doesn't have a mom (because moms do things only moms can do). There is a huge difference between a single parent (because you can explain that the other is not around) and a member of the same sex acting like a mom...it makes no sense.

My problem is...homosexuals see things their way and their way only...there is no balance between what they see and what society is trying to explain. It's ridiculous...
I think you know full well that no gay couple tries to adopt a child with the intention of "messing them up", and such a development is by no means guaranteed, although I agree that a child loses out by not having the benefit of both male and female input from their parents while growing up. Incidentally one could also point out that lesbian couples also adopt children and in that case the idea of a woman as a substitute father figure might be what causes problems.
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The Wit and Wisdom of the Tennis Journalist, Indian Wells 2004

ROGER FEDERER: Yeah, I remember this one time when I went on a vacation on the Maldives. That was in the year 2001, I think. I went to this spa. I went to walk around with my girlfriend. I walk in, and we want to book a spa. This guy goes, "AHH, I remember you. You beat Sampras. I saw you on TV." That was like, really, how can you remember me? This guy has probably never been off his island and still knows me. I was a little bit shocked. Then I went to play tennis with him because he was actually the tennis teacher. It was nice.

Q. Were you naked at the time in the spa?

ROGER FEDERER: No. It was at the front desk. I didn't walk in naked.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:26 PM   #56
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

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Originally Posted by Mistaflava View Post

Whatever, it's not a huge deal but the more it expands, the more society is going to have problems adjusting and developping to these new standards and this new culture. No matter how much you want or try or hope, the homosexual lifestyle will never be considered okay in society by everyone and it will be next to impossible to give equal rights in all forms of society. That's just how things go.
hmm we seem to be doing quite well in this country. Im sure there are some people disagreeing too, but they are mostly those who live in a certain part of the country where they follow their religion to the letter. I'd say 90% of this country is okay with it.

Even with straight couples it's not always guaranteed that the children will be raised by a mother & father. I lost my dad when I was 5 and was raised by my mother.

I believe as long as kids are loved it doesnt matter WHO raises them. It's true that, at first, they might be judged as being weird for having two mums or two dads. But if you educate children, this won't be such a big deal.

But that's just my opinion
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:29 PM   #57
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

JTorian,

My point exactly...you will never find a single homosexual human being who has an open mind and who is willing to see things both ways. NEVER!

Anyways. There is a huge difference between two dads raising a child and an aunt/uncle/single parent whatever raising a child. Would a kid get teased at school if he was being raised by his grandfather and his uncle because his parents had passed away and he did not have female relatives? Fuck no! But will a kid get teased at school if he has two daddies? FUCK YES son...so stop the stupid arguments and give your head a shake.

That reason alone makes it wrong, it's not fair for a child and it should not be allowed. Why compromise his position in society from the minute he is adopted by chosing a lifestyle for him that is not accepted by many in society. Thats really ridiculous and I will never understand why its fair for a child to have two dads or two moms.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:32 PM   #58
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

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Originally Posted by Sjengster View Post
I think you know full well that no gay couple tries to adopt a child with the intention of "messing them up", and such a development is by no means guaranteed, although I agree that a child loses out by not having the benefit of both male and female input from their parents while growing up. Incidentally one could also point out that lesbian couples also adopt children and in that case the idea of a woman as a substitute father figure might be what causes problems.

its not about intention...its about reality. I don't doubt that there is no intent there whatsoever...but there is no doubt and it has been proven that kids like this will have problems integrating normally in our social world. Thats not fair to them.

And can we please stop taking this as gay bashing? Seriously though...you guys talk about stereotypes...well most gays have the stereotype of being DRAMA QUEENS and the way some of you babies are reacting, that stereotype looks pretty damn true. Arguing and being against something like that is not gay bashing. I have never and would never treat a gay person any differently.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:32 PM   #59
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

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Originally Posted by ~*Carlita*~ View Post
hmm we seem to be doing quite well in this country. Im sure there are some people disagreeing too, but they are mostly those who live in a certain part of the country where they follow their religion to the letter. I'd say 90% of this country is okay with it.

Even with straight couples it's not always guaranteed that the children will be raised by a mother & father. I lost my dad when I was 5 and was raised by my mother.

I believe as long as kids are loved it doesnt matter WHO raises them. It's true that, at first, they might be judged as being weird for having two mums or two dads. But if you educate children, this won't be such a big deal.

But that's just my opinion


Thats the problem hun, you will never ever be able to educate everyone to be okay with this which is why it becomes problematic in the end. It will never happen.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:34 PM   #60
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Default Re: Heterosexual discrimination

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How is sexuality a lifestyle choice? I suppose being straight is a choice. You could have easily chosen to like guys, but you did the right thing and chose girls, is that how it works? The only "choice" a gay man makes is whether to follow his natural inclinations or suppress them.
I think that third sentence is exactly how many people think, and for two reasons: 1) that heterosexual union is what reproduces the human species, making it the natural, "default" mode of sexuality; and 2) that homosexuals, or at least confirmed, unambivalent homosexuals, constitute such a small percentage of the population that they must have chosen to follow a lifestyle, to consciously deviate from the norm, rather than followed their true feelings. I'm not saying these arguments are right (sexuality is such a grey area that there must be many more people with homosexual leanings than mere statistics would indicate), but that's what they would use in their defence.
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The Wit and Wisdom of the Tennis Journalist, Indian Wells 2004

ROGER FEDERER: Yeah, I remember this one time when I went on a vacation on the Maldives. That was in the year 2001, I think. I went to this spa. I went to walk around with my girlfriend. I walk in, and we want to book a spa. This guy goes, "AHH, I remember you. You beat Sampras. I saw you on TV." That was like, really, how can you remember me? This guy has probably never been off his island and still knows me. I was a little bit shocked. Then I went to play tennis with him because he was actually the tennis teacher. It was nice.

Q. Were you naked at the time in the spa?

ROGER FEDERER: No. It was at the front desk. I didn't walk in naked.
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