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Old 12-06-2007, 03:33 AM   #196
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Default Re: Sudanese hissy fits over teddy bear

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Originally Posted by mangoes View Post
Seriously?......That isn't the same thing in my opinion. The USA gains a lot from a well protected border. Protecting the border isn't about economics. It is about drugs......etc. Lastly, people aren't being separated or divided........Mexico and US are two different countries. Not the East and West of a country being divided.
The drug dealers have many more methods than trying to walk or drive across the desert in 110°F temperature. There's a Pacific Ocean between USA and the golden triangle in Asia but drugs from there still have a way getting in.
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Old 12-06-2007, 05:43 AM   #197
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Default Re: Sudanese hissy fits over teddy bear

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The drug dealers have many more methods than trying to walk or drive across the desert in 110°F temperature. There's a Pacific Ocean between USA and the golden triangle in Asia but drugs from there still have a way getting in.
I'm going to go do a little research on this tomorrow night to offer some facts on this subject, but if I recall correctly, the border is the largest gateway for drugs to the US.



EDIT

I decided to look this up before going to bed. I vaguely remembered reading about this drug trafficing problem some time ago. I'm quoting from the US Drug Enforcement Administration website: http://www.dea.gov/pubs/state_factsheets.html
Quote:
The U.S./Mexico border is the primary point of entry for cocaine shipments being smuggled into the United States. According to a recent interagency intelligence assessment, approximately 65 percent of the cocaine smuggled into the United States crosses the Southwest border. Cocaine is readily available in nearly all major cities in the United States.

Traffickers operating from Mexico now control wholesale cocaine distribution throughout the western and midwestern United States. Mexico-based trafficking groups in cities such as Chicago, Dallas, Denver, Houston, Los Angeles, Phoenix, San Diego, San Francisco, and Seattle control the distribution of multiton quantities of cocaine, once dominated by the Colombia-based drug groups. In the early 1990s, when the organized crime groups from Mexico were expanding their roles as cocaine transporters and wholesale-level distributors, most of their U.S.-based command and control operations were in southern California. Today, Chicago is also a key command and control center for their cocaine operations, and Atlanta is increasingly important as a trafficking hub for cocaine movement. Currently, these traffickers control cocaine shipments from the time they are smuggled across the border until they are distributed to markets across the country.

The role of Mexico-based trafficking organizations is continuing to evolve. Recent reports suggest that some major international criminals in Colombia are further distancing themselves from day-to-day wholesale-level cocaine distribution in the United States by turning this task over, at least occasionally, to the organizations operating from Mexico.

Mexican heroin has been a threat to the United States for decades. It is produced, smuggled, and distributed by polydrug trafficking groups, many of which have been in operation for more than 20 years. Nearly all of the heroin produced in Mexico is destined for distribution in the United States. Organized crime groups operating from Mexico produce, smuggle, and distribute the black tar heroin sold in the western United States. Traditionally, trafficking groups operating from Mexico evaded interdiction efforts by smuggling heroin to the U.S. market as they received orders from customers. By keeping quantities small, traffickers hoped to minimize the risk of losing a significant quantity of heroin in a single seizure. Even large polydrug Mexican organizations, which smuggle multiton quantities of cocaine and marijuana, generally limited smuggling of Mexican heroin into the United States to kilogram and smaller amounts. Nevertheless, trafficking organizations were capable of regularly smuggling significant quantities of heroin into the United States.

Although illegal immigrants and migrant workers frequently smuggle heroin across the U.S./Mexico border in 1- to 3- kilogram amounts for the major trafficking groups, seizures indicate that larger loads are being moved across the border, primarily in privately owned vehicles. Once the heroin reaches the United States, traffickers rely upon well-entrenched polydrug smuggling and distribution networks to deliver their product to the market, principally in the metropolitan areas of the midwestern, southwestern, and western United States with sizable Mexican immigrant populations.

Marijuana smuggled into the United States, whether grown in Mexico or transshipped from other Latin American source areas, accounts for most of the marijuana available in the United States. Marijuana produced in Mexico remains the most widely available.
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Last edited by mangoes : 12-06-2007 at 07:11 AM.
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Old 12-06-2007, 12:30 PM   #198
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Default Re: Sudanese hissy fits over teddy bear

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Not a great comparison. It hardly bears mentioning that the Iron Curtain and Berlin Wall were built to keep people in, whereas the wall along US border with Mexico would be built to keep intruders out. If Mexico built the wall to keep Mexicans in Mexico, then you would have a fair comparison.
Do you let anybody who so desires come and live in your house, uninvited? Then think of the US as a big house and Americans just wanting to be able to enjoy their home, inviting people in as they see fit. Pretty simple, really.
Agree to an extent, but a wall to keep people in or a wall to keep people out has the same practical effect. The individual has no mobility.

It exposes the major flaw in the demands of Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher for Eastern European countries to give their citizens freedom to leave their countries. What is the point in giving citizens mobility to move to other countries if they are not admitted.

In the cold war, western countries were complaining about them not allowing peolple to leave now western countries are complaning because people are arriving in western countries from Eastern Europe in large numbers. It seems the west are never pleased on this issue. As far as Reagan and Thatcher were concerned, privately they probably approved of the regimes in Eastern Europe because they did not have a flow of immigrants from these countries coming to the west.
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Old 12-06-2007, 01:54 PM   #199
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Default Re: Sudanese hissy fits over teddy bear

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It exposes the major flaw in the demands of Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher for Eastern European countries to give their citizens freedom to leave their countries. What is the point in giving citizens mobility to move to other countries if they are not admitted.
Well, they could do what people have been doing for centuries and that is to legally migrate. But anyway, I don't think Reagan said, "Tear down this wall'' so that all East Germans could move to the US. He said it so that Germans could have their united country back.
But you seem intent in your belief that a person has the right to go where he likes in the world. And I disagree.
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Old 12-06-2007, 05:59 PM   #200
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Default Re: Sudanese hissy fits over teddy bear

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Originally Posted by mangoes View Post
I'm going to go do a little research on this tomorrow night to offer some facts on this subject, but if I recall correctly, the border is the largest gateway for drugs to the US.



EDIT

I decided to look this up before going to bed. I vaguely remembered reading about this drug trafficing problem some time ago. I'm quoting from the US Drug Enforcement Administration website: http://www.dea.gov/pubs/state_factsheets.html

Mangoes, I am not disagreeing that the border is not a place for drug trafficking. I am pointing out that for drug trafficking, building a wall between the border is not going to stop. The drug dealers will find another way.
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Old 12-06-2007, 07:43 PM   #201
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Default Re: Sudanese hissy fits over teddy bear

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I don't believe linguistic difference (or even add your cultures, sets of grievances vs the other) will result in the separation of a country. Economy is more powerful.
India and Pakistan split on religion.
The former Yugoslavia split on ethnic grounds.
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Old 12-06-2007, 07:53 PM   #202
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Default Re: Sudanese hissy fits over teddy bear

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India and Pakistan split on religion.
The former Yugoslavia split on ethnic grounds.
Did I mention religion and/or ethnic in the quote?
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Old 12-06-2007, 08:11 PM   #203
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Default Re: Sudanese hissy fits over teddy bear

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If any US citizens think that illegal immigrants use government resources without paying tax is a way of "robbing your money", remember the money need to secure the border in a way that hardly any illegal immigrants will slip thru will be much much higher.
Money well spent.
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