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View Poll Results: TT season 2007:WC's: Yes or no?

Yes 30 40.00%
No 45 60.00%
Voters: 75. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-08-2006, 11:00 PM   #61
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Default Re: Wildcards

my best results in singles have been in challengers 1win and 1 SF in 4-5 chall played

ATP: 2SF in round 25 played
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerRafaFan View Post
That will be the last victory of Rafa for quite some time.. With his joke mentality and pathetic game, I hope the disgusting player loses every single match next season. He's disgraceful. He should just retire. He's a joke.
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:05 PM   #62
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Default Re: Wildcards

Quote:
Originally Posted by FiBeR View Post
tell me.. the top 25 players playing on challenger level.. NONE of hardly any made it to the final stages... and besides.. it is not the point.. the point is that it is harder..
By your logic then the challengers should all be worth more points than the ATP level tournaments.
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:07 PM   #63
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Default Re: Wildcards

Quote:
Originally Posted by adee-gee View Post
FiBeR + tennisfancroatia = The Dream Team
it is not a matter of team or whatever, it is a matter of common sense

You have your point, you see things from YOUR point of view.. that is.. up there in rankings

I see things from MY point of view..down here


I believe a good board member (And i include everyone else on the board) should see things from EVERY point of view.. taht is the reason why the board members should be there..


They should look after top 10 players.. top 50.. and top 200...



I mean.. what do strong players care if more points are granted to lower ranked tournaments? Is it that you re afraid to lose your points and newcomers beat you and take you out of rankings?


I believe the way the board is managing the game is making progress and challenges.. much harder to come


The idea of the game is a much fair game to everyone, right? i mean.. everyone should get the same chance to get to everywhere


you re making with all these decitions.. easier for guys who are up in rankings stay up..and guys who are down..stay down.. and that is not the idea

the idea should be, lower players could get the chance to get up there as well.. and guys who are up, should prove they are really the best beating new and old folks..

if not, how come can you really feel you re the best if you restrict maybe good players to challenge those who are up?

Im not saying giving free stuff to us.. im just saying..with the points breakdown nowadays..it is hardly impossible for us to make it to your level..and it is not fair

and that is something the board is missing.. A VISION .. and moreover, standing up for those who are ill-ranked..


honestly, the board seems to only stand for the highly ranked..

and if not.. please prove me wrong, ill be delighted to ..

thanks
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:10 PM   #64
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Default Re: Wildcards

I really have no problems with giving more ranking points to challengers, i just don't like the wild card idea.



Quote:
Originally Posted by uglyamerican View Post
Nearly same for me at Naples. I'd seen 2 of the players.
I think that it was about the same for me
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:11 PM   #65
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Default Re: Wildcards

FiBeR, my ranking is 89 your idea would help me but I'm still against it.

And I'd like to cater for everyone's needs, but it's simply not possible. And have a look at the poll results - would it be fair to implement this system when it's 66% - 33% in favour of no?
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:11 PM   #66
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Default Re: Wildcards

Quote:
Originally Posted by FiBeR View Post
Im not saying giving free stuff to us.. im just saying..with the points breakdown nowadays..it is hardly impossible for us to make it to your level..and it is not fair
It doesn't have to be fair. You're not entitled to participate in an activity that other people have been enjoying for months already.

How do you know it's impossible? You haven't even given yourself a chance, yet.
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:14 PM   #67
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Default Re: Wildcards

I agree with more points to TT CH than ATP CH. I said this idea in my first post of Rules and Changes Thread.

Another idea it's more Challengers per week with 16 players. It's less bored to play in Challengers with only 4 rounds and more opportunity to reach advanced rounds (and win more points).
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:16 PM   #68
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Default Re: Wildcards

Quote:
Originally Posted by FiBeR View Post

and much more difficult.. dont miss that keqtjvwhatever ( i cant spell that nickname) in maui.. lost in R16..and he is a GS winner.. and i made it to QF.. i ..a newbie.. picked and guessed right much better than him in that tournament.. i mean.. that is proof it is harder, for e.g.

no, that proves that you are better than him and will kick his ass in AO

VAMOSSSSS
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerRafaFan View Post
That will be the last victory of Rafa for quite some time.. With his joke mentality and pathetic game, I hope the disgusting player loses every single match next season. He's disgraceful. He should just retire. He's a joke.
Quote:
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:30 PM   #69
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Default Re: Wildcards

Quote:
Originally Posted by FiBeR View Post
it is not a matter of team or whatever, it is a matter of common sense

You have your point, you see things from YOUR point of view.. that is.. up there in rankings

I see things from MY point of view..down here


I believe a good board member (And i include everyone else on the board) should see things from EVERY point of view.. taht is the reason why the board members should be there..


They should look after top 10 players.. top 50.. and top 200...



I mean.. what do strong players care if more points are granted to lower ranked tournaments? Is it that you re afraid to lose your points and newcomers beat you and take you out of rankings?


I believe the way the board is managing the game is making progress and challenges.. much harder to come


The idea of the game is a much fair game to everyone, right? i mean.. everyone should get the same chance to get to everywhere


you re making with all these decitions.. easier for guys who are up in rankings stay up..and guys who are down..stay down.. and that is not the idea

the idea should be, lower players could get the chance to get up there as well.. and guys who are up, should prove they are really the best beating new and old folks..

if not, how come can you really feel you re the best if you restrict maybe good players to challenge those who are up?

Im not saying giving free stuff to us.. im just saying..with the points breakdown nowadays..it is hardly impossible for us to make it to your level..and it is not fair

and that is something the board is missing.. A VISION .. and moreover, standing up for those who are ill-ranked..


honestly, the board seems to only stand for the highly ranked..

and if not.. please prove me wrong, ill be delighted to ..

thanks
Not everyone that is low in the rankings think the same as you. I'm 150 and i think exactly like the higher members on this issue.
And the majority of the people voting seem to agree with that thought.

And Uglyamerican is right, it doesn't neccesarily have to be fair, you may choose to play or not . And no matter how much calculations you make you should wait until the system is up and running, i'm pretty sure it's not as hard to rise in the rankings as you seem to believe.
You are not a bad player, so you'll see that you will be fine
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:31 PM   #70
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Default Re: Wildcards

Quote:
Originally Posted by adee-gee View Post
ok.

1) Where is the cut off point as to which ranked players get WC?
2) There were arguments that the old system was unfair that whoever was online at the time the thread was posted got in - with limited space for WC, the same thing would happen and everyone would want to play in similar events.
3) I thought we wanted to make TT as realistic as possible - granting random WC's to lower ranked players isn't realistic.
4) Why should lower ranked players get into tournaments ahead of higher ranked players? (my ranking is 91 I think so I can't be accused of being highly ranked). Put it this way, if I was ranked 25th in the world and I got pushed out of playing a tournament I wanted to play in by people ranked in the 200s using their WC's I'd be pissed off.
5) If you look at the rankings, there isn't a big points gap. Someone ranked in the 200s, if they had a couple of good challenger results they'd fly up the rankings. It's not that hard to progress through the rankings (there are also a lot of players inactive).

.
you said TFC would get your respect if he ansdwered those questions :


I may give it a try..

1) no cut off! just first in.. first gets a spot.. a really good thing for lucky players that are around when the thread is up.. just like its been all year.. same system.. just granting..4 spots.. the same number of wc in a tournament..

that is fair for everyone, and gives a lot of colour to the tournament.. some by rankings..and 4 by luck.. by first in..first gets.. and they should say "WC REQUEST!"

2) darling, "question" n2 is not a question..looks like a statement, and i dont get the point

The old system granted everyone ranked to get to any tournament.. nowe with the new system.. you get your spot safe.. and granting wildcards by first in..grants by luck -and merith.. it is merith to stay around waiting for the thread up.. it is a lot of pressure- to play as well....everyone wants to play on similar events.. Dah! who wouldnt like to see his or hers best and favourite players play a tounramnet? and pick them as winners? that is sth exciting..

anyway..if i didnt answer your question, rephrase it in a question way.. and tell me what would u like me to answer you or PM me

3) oh yeah?!! LOL!!!!! you think granting lower ranked players a WC is not realistic?!

Tell me.. you know.. last year in 2005 Buenos Aires ATP Tournamnet.. organizers granted ROLAND GARROS FINALIST mariano puerta a WC and made it to the final..with those points.. he built up his ranking and had an stunning year.. furthermore.. juan martin del potro was granted a lot of WC.. see ANY tournament on ATP .. and check out who gets a WC?

this year in Costa do Sauipei Guga Kuerten was granted a WC.. a lot of players get WC.. the idea of WC is to grant a lower ranked player who doesnt make it to the main draw a spot

AND/OR eventually..a really good player who hasnt sign up for the tournament when he should


you making that question is evidence of not knowing the idea of ATP...

4) hey.. hello! with your way of thinking.. how come McEnroe isnt still world n1? or Sampras.. or becker!

new players come up and forth.. besides.. you are not a real tennis player.. you built up your ranking predicting others success..

there is no special skill in that.. its not like.. you have an awesome forehand and you yourself win your matches down there on courts.. hello!

you ahve the same chance to beat anyone, it is up to your choices..the idea of denying someone who is in same conditions as others to compete, is not fair.. furthermore.. i klnow a lot of tennis, i may not know the most..but i do know.. my only "crime" is to get here quite late, are you gonna deny someone who may be good the chance to compete against the old folks just because they got to the game late? yeah..its my bad to sign up late.. i know.. but it is not about you, its about picking players, you re forgetting the esence of game.. and besides.. why?

because Ivanisevich won wimbledon on a WC.. why should you let an ill ranked player into a tournament? because you never know! there are lots of players winning tournaments on wc with low ranked.. on real tennis

like.. Ventura.. the spaniard..2 years ago.. they proved the best on that week..


5) reallyˇ? have u summed up ok?

to be in top 100 you have to be like 250..300 points..

a challenger grants.. lets say..50 points.. you have to win 6 challengers to get a decent world n100..

tell me.. how many players up there in rankings have 6 tournaments per year?

and dont tell me it is somehow easier to win a challenger.. it requires a lot of efford.. in my opinion it is as hard as an atp level,it is not sth easy..it requires a lot .. because most of those players.. i really dont know their game..


here.. there are the 5 questions that will grant me your respect -not that i need it-



gluck


hey im off.. gotta go
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:32 PM   #71
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Smile Re: Wildcards

Quote:
Originally Posted by Melvins;4540954
Another idea it's [B
more Challengers per week with 16 players[/b]. It's less bored to play in Challengers with only 4 rounds and more opportunity to reach advanced rounds (and win more points).
This is a very good idea, you can make more differences with more matches to predict...

If you dont like Wildcards or more challenger points, this is a best idea.
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HELlas ole ole
thanks felip for your help.i m priciate u friend
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:35 PM   #72
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Default Re: Wildcards

have a nice weeked




im off
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:54 PM   #73
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Default Re: Wildcards

Quote:
Originally Posted by uglyamerican View Post

I was going to write these same thoughts, but I was too lazy.

I can't believe how much complaining is happening before the system even begins to be implemented.

And you're exactly right--it's not hard to look up the players profiles and activities and make an educated guess. Even in tour-level tournaments (especially the majors) TT players will have to pick matches with non-famous competitors, and these matches will be more important to get right, because people will have a lot of similar picks in the matches where we all know who the players are.

As for WCs...

the only thing that would make any sense is to reserve a couple of WCs for highly ranked players who forgot to sign up in the designated time-frame, but I don't think this will be necessary.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ufokart View Post
Most of us don't know those players very well, there are a lot of them outside the top 200 and even some unranked. But even without knowing any of them i reached the final of a challenger. If you don't know a player you can look it up in the ATP website, there you'll find information of his ranking and recent results and you will also have an idea of which surface suits him best. I mean, i don't think it is that much harder to predict a challenger than an ATP tournament. In fact in a challenger a great deal of matches consist of a player ranked 150 and one ranked 1000 (for example), you can't tell me that that's a difficult decision. Most of the matches in the ATP tournaments are between top 50's or top 100's, except when federer is playing, i believe those matches are even harder to predict. Maybe a challenger is a little bit harder to predict overall, but not as much as some people here say.

I don't know why you have some kind of obsession with playing the ATP tournaments. I mean, it's a game, you are supposed to play to have fun, what does it matter if you play challengers the whole year or if you play ATP tournaments? You are not going to make more money, and you are not going to play against retarded people in those challengers or anything like that.
Maybe other players don't agree with me on this but i just play here to have fun and i really don't care that much if i'm stuck with challengers the whole year or if i'm seeded at the slams . If i can rise in the rankings i'll be happy, but if i don't, i'd still be happy .

I have only played 3 singles tournaments in the whole year and i'm 150 in the rankings. yeah, i'm never gonna make it to the top 100, maybe i'll whine about it
As many people already said, there are players that are still in the ranking list but that don't play anymore and with 3 events per week (that would mean 96 players and i'm not counting all the players that can go to qualifying for those tournaments) i really think that your chances of playing ATP tournaments are pretty good, but if you want to be that pessimistic, then be my guest.

Maybe i would expect all this ridiculous whining coming from a 10 year old, but according to your profile you are 21
I think that the logical thing you must do now is shut up until next year tournaments begin and see if all this whining of you was justified or not.
God I love smart men.

There are only 2 people out of 200 players who seem to be incredibly pissed off about this. Most other people see that aspects of the system are fair and are willing to give it a shot. TFC, you seem so sure that you won't improve your ranking before you give it a shot. People will be more willing to listen to you if next December you still haven't improved. Right now we're saying, "It's just a game, give it a chance and if it doesn't work we'll change it." But I'm fairly sure it will work

When the majority of people don't agree with you it's not all high ranked players. ufokart has played like 4 tournaments total and he disagrees. Get over yourself.

BTW I think the year end challengers are a poor examples of what challenger level matches will be next year. Usually there are better fields with only players from 90-200 playing, but post-Paris most of them were already done with their seasons It's not always going to be like Maui where it is guys ranked 800 and 1200 It will be easier. And if you don't know about guys who are ranked right around 100, I don't know what to tell you because these guys are the ones playing quallies for ATP matches too, so it looks like you wouldn't do great there either.
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Old 12-09-2006, 07:32 AM   #74
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Default Re: Wildcards

I think TT is a really nice game because of his similarities with the ATP, then if we start to try to improve with changes in the game we would be making it less realistic. We should try to imitate ATP in many things as we can. But no with things like WC´s, we have the rankings then. From the challenger points discussion, isn´t it motivating for you guys with low rank to start winning points from challengers to become a real No. 1 of the world? I mean... ok when i started to play TT there were very little players who played the game, now there are a lot, so players like FiBeR maybe are in a worth position compared with mine at that time of my TT career. Now we have a good amount of TT players and the game is turning bigger and bigger. And i could see most of the complains come from the low ranked players, as we (the high ranked players) are being kind of benefited with rank.
Finally i think we should give them a break and start thinking of restart ranks from the next season beginning.
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Old 12-09-2006, 07:59 AM   #75
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Default Re: Wildcards

Quote:
Originally Posted by FiBeR View Post
you said TFC would get your respect if he ansdwered those questions :


I may give it a try..

1) no cut off! just first in.. first gets a spot.. a really good thing for lucky players that are around when the thread is up.. just like its been all year.. same system.. just granting..4 spots.. the same number of wc in a tournament..

that is fair for everyone, and gives a lot of colour to the tournament.. some by rankings..and 4 by luck.. by first in..first gets.. and they should say "WC REQUEST!"

2) darling, "question" n2 is not a question..looks like a statement, and i dont get the point

The old system granted everyone ranked to get to any tournament.. nowe with the new system.. you get your spot safe.. and granting wildcards by first in..grants by luck -and merith.. it is merith to stay around waiting for the thread up.. it is a lot of pressure- to play as well....everyone wants to play on similar events.. Dah! who wouldnt like to see his or hers best and favourite players play a tounramnet? and pick them as winners? that is sth exciting..

anyway..if i didnt answer your question, rephrase it in a question way.. and tell me what would u like me to answer you or PM me

3) oh yeah?!! LOL!!!!! you think granting lower ranked players a WC is not realistic?!

Tell me.. you know.. last year in 2005 Buenos Aires ATP Tournamnet.. organizers granted ROLAND GARROS FINALIST mariano puerta a WC and made it to the final..with those points.. he built up his ranking and had an stunning year.. furthermore.. juan martin del potro was granted a lot of WC.. see ANY tournament on ATP .. and check out who gets a WC?

this year in Costa do Sauipei Guga Kuerten was granted a WC.. a lot of players get WC.. the idea of WC is to grant a lower ranked player who doesnt make it to the main draw a spot

AND/OR eventually..a really good player who hasnt sign up for the tournament when he should


you making that question is evidence of not knowing the idea of ATP...

4) hey.. hello! with your way of thinking.. how come McEnroe isnt still world n1? or Sampras.. or becker!

new players come up and forth.. besides.. you are not a real tennis player.. you built up your ranking predicting others success..

there is no special skill in that.. its not like.. you have an awesome forehand and you yourself win your matches down there on courts.. hello!

you ahve the same chance to beat anyone, it is up to your choices..the idea of denying someone who is in same conditions as others to compete, is not fair.. furthermore.. i klnow a lot of tennis, i may not know the most..but i do know.. my only "crime" is to get here quite late, are you gonna deny someone who may be good the chance to compete against the old folks just because they got to the game late? yeah..its my bad to sign up late.. i know.. but it is not about you, its about picking players, you re forgetting the esence of game.. and besides.. why?

because Ivanisevich won wimbledon on a WC.. why should you let an ill ranked player into a tournament? because you never know! there are lots of players winning tournaments on wc with low ranked.. on real tennis

like.. Ventura.. the spaniard..2 years ago.. they proved the best on that week..


5) reallyˇ? have u summed up ok?

to be in top 100 you have to be like 250..300 points..

a challenger grants.. lets say..50 points.. you have to win 6 challengers to get a decent world n100..

tell me.. how many players up there in rankings have 6 tournaments per year?

and dont tell me it is somehow easier to win a challenger.. it requires a lot of efford.. in my opinion it is as hard as an atp level,it is not sth easy..it requires a lot .. because most of those players.. i really dont know their game..


here.. there are the 5 questions that will grant me your respect -not that i need it-



gluck


hey im off.. gotta go
1) Would turn into a farce.
2) It was a statement.
3) Those were chosen by the tournament organiser and mainly because they were born in the country of the tournament. The players didn't just have 5 wildcards and choose when they wanted to use them
4) I have no idea what you're talking about. I agree that someone new and ranked 200 might be better than someone ranked 50. It's irrelevant though.
5) Challengers are worth more than 50 points. And I'm not saying you have to win them all, just have some good results.

Anyway, that's my last post in this thread because I could argue till the cows come home and yourself and tennisfancroatia would still go on.
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