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Old 11-16-2003, 09:47 PM   #31
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Default Re: Re: Champions race standing - updated Saturday: Federer closes on #2!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bunk18bsb
safe CR points? HUH??
It means "safe Champions Race points".

It's basically taking off all the points they have earned/need to defend.

For example, if Roger wins the final against Andre at TMC, he will add 50 points, and overtake Andy, after Andy's SF points and Roger's 4th rd. points are taken off from AO.
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Old 11-16-2003, 09:54 PM   #32
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Default Re: Champions race standing - updated Saturday: Federer closes on #2!

I know what it meant, I just don't like thinking about the CR that way. I like keeping them separate, it's better for my mind LOL. I'd rather think about the ES that has the defending points and all that and just think of the CR as starting from 0
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Old 11-16-2003, 10:12 PM   #33
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Default Re: Champions race standing - updated Saturday: Federer closes on #2!

Well sure. But technically it's easier this way. You're right about the ES, but the CR is just the ES divided by 5. So it's the same thing, really...just with smaller numbers to deal with.
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Old 11-16-2003, 10:21 PM   #34
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Default Re: Champions race standing - updated Saturday: Federer closes on #2!

Of course the real champions race points from 2003 are not carried over to 2004...
It was just easier to calculate, since the ATP website doesn't give points breakdown in entry list points... you will get the "safe entry list points" if you multiply the CR points by 5...
Not only the points from AO were deducted, but also the points in tournaments before AO, for example Ferrero's 24 pts for runner-up in Sydney...
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Old 11-16-2003, 10:25 PM   #35
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Default Re: Champions race standing - updated Saturday: Federer closes on #2!

oh ok, cool
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Old 11-17-2003, 12:22 PM   #36
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Default Re: Champions Race year-end standing - Federer move to #2!

So, Federer won the Masters Cup, and finished 2003 in 2nd place in the ranking, just 32 pts behind Roddick.
When they go to Melbourne in 2 months time, Federer is likely to be ahead of Roddick on "safe points", which means if they both reach the same stage in AO, Federer will take over #1, with good chance to hold it until Wimbledon.
Roddick's only chance to stay ahead of Federer is to go to Doha on the 1st week of 2004 and win it. This will add 36 CR pts to his tally. If Federer do the same, he will gain only 25 pts, because he has better 5th optional result.
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Old 11-17-2003, 01:57 PM   #37
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Default Re: Champions Race year-end standing - Federer move to #2!

That's very interesting. I wonder if Andy will do that.

But why Doha? There are warm-up tourneys in Australia/NZ. Don't they offer enough points?
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Old 11-17-2003, 02:37 PM   #38
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Default Re: Champions Race year-end standing - Federer move to #2!

I don't think Andy is playing anything til that Kooyong exhibition. but nothing has been officially announced from his camp about next year's schedule. The only tournaments we know he's playing are where the tournament has announced (Scottsdale, Memphis, Houston, etc.).

Plus, playing in Doha is NOT the *only* way he can stay #1. If Andy were to do better than Roger at the AO he would still stay #1 and I mean it'll be the start of the season, we have no clue how either of them will do. And I don't think Andy will do anything out of the ordinary to keep his #1 (such as playing a tournament he wouldn't normally play), and nor should he, he should just play the best he can and try to make it to the same level or even further than the previous year
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Old 11-17-2003, 09:59 PM   #39
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Default Re: Champions Race year-end standing - Federer move to #2!

Let me make it clear... these points are what players will have BEFORE the AO...
Of course if Roddick gets further than Federer in AO he'll regain #1...
Doha is the biggest tournament before AO, with prize money of 1M$ and 60 pts for the winner... the other tournaments have only 400K$ prizes and 35 pts for the winner.
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Old 11-17-2003, 11:18 PM   #40
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Default Re: Champions Race year-end standing - Federer move to #2!

What I'm confused about with what you say is that Andy will "regain" it....but, why would he lose it? Andy only played sydney last year before the AO and it's not in his best countable since he lost in like the second round. So he doesn't have anything to defend til AO.

Or is there something I'm missing somewhere?
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Old 11-17-2003, 11:54 PM   #41
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Default Re: Re: Champions Race year-end standing - Federer move to #2!

The point is bunk, if you remove Roddick's and Federer's ranking points from the AO this year (which is what happens as soon as the tournament starts next year), Federer is provisionally no. 1 by virtue of losing fewer points. Whoever gets further in the AO gets no. 1, so in that sense Roddick would have to regain it since hypothetically he would lose it right at the beginning of the tournament.
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Old 11-18-2003, 12:02 AM   #42
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Default Re: Champions Race year-end standing - Federer move to #2!

Ok I get it. I mean I got it all along, but I wasn't sure if there was something I was missing because of the specific terminology.
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