WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ) - Page 2 - MensTennisForums.com

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Old 04-05-2013, 12:02 PM   #16
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

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Originally Posted by JamieMU30 View Post
Thanks, that makes sense!! I knew I had 810 as being right...So will he be at 51 or 52? If you are tied with someone, doesn't the player playing that week or reaching those points come first in the rankings?
In a moment. My live rankings update will confirm his exact position and I will tell you.
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:13 PM   #17
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

He will be 52.

The first tiebreaker is the GS+Masters points. If two players are tied at that, the second tie-breaker is the number of tournaments played. The one with the lowest amount is in front. If this again is a tie, the next tiebreakers are the points gained in each tournaments played. PlayerA's maximum points gained vs. PlayerB's maximum points gained after which PA's second maximum points vs PB's second maximum points and so on.
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:19 PM   #18
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

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Originally Posted by Slasher1985 View Post
He will be 52.

The first tiebreaker is the GS+Masters points. If two players are tied at that, the second tie-breaker is the number of tournaments played. The one with the lowest amount is in front. If this again is a tie, the next tiebreakers are the points gained in each tournaments played. PlayerA's maximum points gained vs. PlayerB's maximum points gained after which PA's second maximum points vs PB's second maximum points and so on.
Very in-depth, thank you...52, 51, whatever...I am okay with either one...Too bad there probably won't be a live 4th rubber for him to gain more points and crack the Top 50
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:24 PM   #19
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

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Originally Posted by duong View Post
Slasher, do you have any evidence that the 10 points from R1 and the 65 from QF can be cumulated ?
No superior round of Davis Cup has ever dropped out points earned in a previous round, and all round points drop only after 52 weeks, including Bonus Points, which drop out 52 weeks after the Final is counted in.

Rosol's 10 points have been earned because he didn't win any match in Round 1. No QF match can remove his points, unless it's a ATP error, like it happened last year with the playoff and ATP didn't catch it until Round 1 this year. I have made sure about this rule by corresponding with the ATP via e-mail.

From the rulebook:

Quote:
Participation: For the first round only, any player who competes in a “live”
singles match(es), without a win, shall receive 10 ranking points.
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:30 PM   #20
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

BTW, I hope you guys counted Hajek as earning 40 points, and not 65, since he didn't play Round 1.
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:36 PM   #21
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

This was a pure choke from Golubev since 4-5 in the 2nd set he threw away every chance he had.
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:41 PM   #22
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

Golubev is a huge mug. Choked that 4th set away like he did numerous times against Nadal at USO when he served for the set like 5 times.
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:59 PM   #23
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

To be fair duong, I don't remember (since 2009) a case where live rubber points from any round were not cumulated across 52 weeks (apart from the errors I mentioned happening last year). That is why I'm saying that these 10 points will also be cumulated and is enough evidence for me.

Quite a rare case to have a player with 10 points in R1 winning a rubber in QF, because it's rare to have a team qualify after one of their singles player loses both live rubbers.

It's all a matter of "let's see on Monday". In any case it's win-win even if I'm not right, because we learn something new about the rules yet again.

Let's put in here what DC site says:

Quote:
a) Accumulated points for all Davis Cup play over the preceding 52-week period will count as one result and form part of the ATP World Tour 500 category, the best of which count towards a player’s ranking.

b) ATP ranking points are awarded for performances in live rubbers. Points will not be awarded for dead rubbers.

c) Players who miss a round of ties (i.e. not among the four nominated players at the draw) will be awarded points based on the immediately preceding round.(For example, a player who doesn’t play the first round but plays the second round will earn 40 points for each singles match won in that second round).

d) Points will be added after every round of ties and deducted at the same stage the following year.
Marked in bold are the phrases that tell me that Rosol's 10 will be added to the 65.

Last edited by Slasher1985 : 04-05-2013 at 01:04 PM.
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Old 04-05-2013, 01:15 PM   #24
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

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Originally Posted by GSMnadal View Post
MTF's dream match this. No pushing, tactics, topspin, rallies or brain use whatsoever in this one.
Even the flattest of players are still using minimal topspin the vast majority of the time.
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Old 04-05-2013, 01:16 PM   #25
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

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Old 04-05-2013, 01:16 PM   #26
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

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Originally Posted by duong View Post
Of course they will not take off points from winning rubbers but it's a peculiar case because the 10 points are a very peculiar case of getting points from losing in an optional tournament then some people viewed it as an "encouragement" to commit to Davis cup which would be deleted for a more "normal" rankings points method when you could get points by winning at one moment.

And I remember that we had talked a lot of that case when the Davis cup points were first introduced and that many people were surprised when we had the evidence that they could be cumulated with the points won from winning a live rubber in play-offs. To show you that what looks "obvious" for one person can be the opposite from what looks "obvious" for another one.

Moreover, I didn't invent that the mention that they could not be cumulated which was previously written on the Davis cup website. I don't have the document anymore on my computer but the fact that I wrote it came from somewhere.
Yeah, but now they're saying "Accumulated points for all Davis Cup play" not win.

I know you didn't invent that rule, of course, but as always ATP take surprising decisions sometimes to change rules.

Right now though, giving 10 points even for losing is not a good idea only when talking about players ranked outside Top 200, to which 10 points is the equivalent of a Futures final and has a big impact on the rankings. But it's not gonna be an often scenario to have a team consisted mainly of players outside Top 200 part of the main World Group, so I don't see it as big trouble.
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Old 04-05-2013, 02:49 PM   #27
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

So much for Rosol being 'curb-stomped' eh Everko?
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Old 04-05-2013, 02:51 PM   #28
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

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Even the flattest of players are still using minimal topspin the vast majority of the time.
But you do agree on no brain use whatsoever apparently?

Way to take it way too literally man.
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Old 04-05-2013, 04:57 PM   #29
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Default Re: WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

Who needs Berdych and Stepanek when you have Hajek and Rosol?
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