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Old 03-20-2013, 06:49 PM   #16
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinceremo View Post
there's some exceptions however. Camoranesi never sang the italian national anthem but it was related to the fact that he probably never took the time to memorize the lyrics, specially considering he is from Argentina (born and raised) although, of course, with italian ancestry. We could say he also didn't 'feel it' due to that fact. Thing is, we really can't blame the players who choose not to sing the NA specially if there's a 'family connection' to it explaining the reason why they don't do it. He still gave 100% effort on the pitch and constantly praised the opportunity to represent Italy (even if he would've preferred to play for Arg).

Like his case, there are plenty, and I don't think they should leave the NT due to it
You described the exact opposite of an exception.
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Old 03-20-2013, 06:57 PM   #17
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

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Originally Posted by MachimoI View Post
You described the exact opposite of an exception.
how so? 'refusing to sing the NT is refusing to honour your country and take part of it's symbols'

isn't Camo's example an exception to it?
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Old 03-20-2013, 07:10 PM   #18
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

That's the biggest problem that I have with the political left ...

Picking a case - which must be said is fairly 'stupid' - in order to disqualify opponents as "racists", while it's primarily a case of exagerated patriotism. There's nothing racist in wanting somebody to sing a national anthem. It might be stupid but it's not racist.

However those leftists wouldn't realize they're defending a guy who earns €1484 per hour, just for kicking a ball against a party, which is very much socially oriented.

The French FN has nothing to do with libertarian like Dutchman Wilders or like pro EU Belgian De Wever. They want to exit the Eurozone and take money creation back into Public hands, lending money to the state at 0% interest rate. Nobody even on the far-left proposes that.

OK that is an idea that they filched the UPR, but still they propose that.


Oh and as a monarchist, I of course have to say that I hate the Marseillaise too.

This should be the French anthem :

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Old 03-20-2013, 07:33 PM   #19
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

Let us talk reasonably about this. Not singing the national song dont need to mean anything at all, but really does the entire french squad burn for love of the country they play for? I mean there are some people of foreign background who fully take their new country's identity as their own, but these are a minority from personal experience. Most, even 2nd and 3rd generation immigrants form outside Europe still love most their parents country of origin from personal experience.

There is nothing wrong with that, but can you expect them to sweat for thenational sqauad as if it was their country and their people they were playing for?

Seriously, I have never seen almost anyone from lets say middle eastern origin or south american origin who doesnt cheer for their country of origin first and foremost and maybe if I moved to lets say Japan probably my children and grandchildren of danish/swedish origin would cheer for Denmark/Sweden and not play hearths out for the japanese squad, what do you think?

Only a blind man would deny that the french national team has serious lack of moral strength and unity, even Spain with their castillians, catalans and basques seem to have more in common and play with more hearth than the french.

This doesnt need to be about racial diversity, Brazil got a mix of three distinct races and they all seem to be united in love for their country.
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Old 03-20-2013, 09:25 PM   #20
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

There is a big difference between Brazil and other New World countries, that derive their identity from the mixing of the people that immigrate on the one hand and Eurasian and African countries on the other hand, where identification is more based on specificness of language and culture. Here in Europe at least we are still in the process of switching from ethnic nationalism to a more civic kind of nationalism, like there is in the Americas and Australia. And this takes time.

As a kid of foreign parents myself, I could see myself representing both the country where I live and the country of my ethnic background, even if my identity is mixed, i.e. I do not belong 100% to either country. But I get those that cling more to one country than another, as Benzema does here.
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Old 03-21-2013, 07:19 AM   #21
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

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Originally Posted by MachimoI View Post
They're absolutely right.

There's no point in playing for a *national* team, if you hate your country. If you only care about showing your skills to a wider audience in order to get a better contract, GTFO - you're not needed.
When did Benzema say that he hated his country? so if you're not a dumb blind nationalist it means you're hating on your country? Strong logic here.
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Old 03-21-2013, 08:45 AM   #22
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

From an article about the controversy:
Quote:
Platini et ses coéquipiers ne chantaient pas la "Marseillaise". Si, depuis, les supporters se sont habitués au playback des joueurs pendant l'hymne, Laurent Blanc, Didier Deschamps, Zinedine Zidane ou encore Marcel Desailly ne la chantaient pas non plus. Mais pourquoi le journaliste du Point Jérôme Béglé en veut-il à Karim Benzema

http://leplus.nouvelobs.com/contribu...seillaise.html
My translation:
Quote:
Platini and his team mates did not sing the "Marseillaise". Since then, supporters have gotten used to the players doing their playback during the hymn but Laurent Blanc, Didier Deschamps, Zinedine Zidane or also Marcel Desailly did not sing it either. So, why does this journalist have a problem with Karim Benzema?

Fair question, this. If there wasn't any problem with Platini never singing the anthem, why should it be a problem if Benzema doesn't?
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Old 03-22-2013, 07:40 AM   #23
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

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Originally Posted by Dextertje View Post
When did Benzema say that he hated his country? so if you're not a dumb blind nationalist it means you're hating on your country? Strong logic here.
You just called everyone singing their national anthem a 'dumb, blind nationalist'.

Good job, and strong logic indeed.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:31 AM   #24
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

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Originally Posted by MachimoI View Post
You just called everyone singing their national anthem a 'dumb, blind nationalist'.

Good job, and strong logic indeed.
You were the one stating that Benzema was hating on his country. Unless he personally told you that I guess you came to that conclusion based on him not singing his national anthem. So anyone not singing their national anthem hate on their country?

I don't know the lyrics of my national anthem so wouldn't be able to sing it. Yet, I wouldn't trade my citizenship with any other.
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:16 PM   #25
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

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Originally Posted by Dextertje View Post
You were the one stating that Benzema was hating on his country. Unless he personally told you that I guess you came to that conclusion based on him not singing his national anthem. So anyone not singing their national anthem hate on their country?

I don't know the lyrics of my national anthem so wouldn't be able to sing it. Yet, I wouldn't trade my citizenship with any other.
Not only you don't know the words of your national anthem, but your literacy in general should be questioned, as I've never stated that Benzema hates his country. So, basically, you're on par with an average 4 year old. Congratulations.
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Old 03-23-2013, 01:04 AM   #26
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

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Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
That's the biggest problem that I have with the political left ...

Picking a case - which must be said is fairly 'stupid' - in order to disqualify opponents as "racists", while it's primarily a case of exagerated patriotism. There's nothing racist in wanting somebody to sing a national anthem. It might be stupid but it's not racist.

However those leftists wouldn't realize they're defending a guy who earns €1484 per hour, just for kicking a ball against a party, which is very much socially oriented.

The French FN has nothing to do with libertarian like Dutchman Wilders or like pro EU Belgian De Wever. They want to exit the Eurozone and take money creation back into Public hands, lending money to the state at 0% interest rate. Nobody even on the far-left proposes that.

OK that is an idea that they filched the UPR, but still they propose that.


Oh and as a monarchist, I of course have to say that I hate the Marseillaise too.

This should be the French anthem :

! French revolution is the one of the best thing that ever happened to humanity! Period! On other hand the best thing that happened to monarchists is the Guillotine..
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Old 03-23-2013, 01:49 PM   #27
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

French Revolution = Genocide, Conscription, Ban on trade unions and any form of social solidarity and basic freedoms scorned ...




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Old 03-23-2013, 03:28 PM   #28
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

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French Revolution = Genocide, Conscription, Ban on trade unions and any form of social solidarity and basic freedoms scorned ...




Royalists and aristocrats deserved no less. 3rd class was oppressed and disenfranchised for centuries by absolute ruler and aristocrat and church scum around him who left ordinary men to beg for piece of bred what happened during the revolution was a normal consequence. I dont care if you are descendant of some snobbish decapitated noble Thanks to French Revolution absolute monarchy's are past. And considering the freedom just read La Déclaration des droits de l'Homme et du citoyen.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:05 PM   #29
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Default Re: French right-wing party wants Benzema out of the national squad...

Dude, you don't know anything about the old regime and the Revolution.

The Church was not oppressive but was constantly oppressed by the Parliaments, Jansenists and the Enlightenment. The Kings were not tyrants, there were plenty of counter-powers.

The Monarchies fought starvations and epidemics. 18th century was a century of prosperity. Most 18th century country farms are still standing today.

However the French Revolution committed one of the first genocide in history in the Vendée. They massacred COMMON people, women, children, oldies. Even the Vendeans with sympathies for the Republic were not spared.

The Revolution was a bourgeois undertaking. They wished to take the control lever instead of the risticrats but left the common men in worse conditions then before. And if you suggest my reading the Human Rights Declaration, I'd recommand you reading the Le Chapelier Lawand then you'd tell me if this Revolution was made BY the people and FOR the people. This law is ignominious.
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Old 03-25-2013, 07:23 PM   #30
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Another Abraxas whining topic, move along nothing to see here...


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