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Old 01-26-2013, 12:16 AM   #106
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Default Re: Fitzpatrick about prize money: very interesting article

you're contradicting you're own argument if you think Niland was getting huge funding from the national association and still only breaking even, relying on his parents after a successful year on the challenger tour.

for what it's worth, Niland was on 3k per year from the Irish Sporting Council. Tennis Ireland helped with coaching and facilities while he was in Ireland but didn't pay anything towards travel and other expenses. If he wanted to take one of their coaches or physios on the road he had to pay for it.
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Old 01-26-2013, 07:52 AM   #107
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Default Re: Fitzpatrick about prize money: very interesting article

Dutra Silva is actually a perfect example. He was always considered talented but he wasted many years without any money for travels or coaching. Finally, Larri Passos (ex Guga coach) found him and helped him put his game together when the guy was 27 or so. I think he's having a very good career for someone who had to wait this long. Although he says a coach is a big expense (but it pays back in results, doesn't it?) at least now he has Brazilian Post paying his travels (no federation at all, still, and he's #2 in Brazil behind Bellucci now I think). But guy plays slams, gets to weak ATP events in singles or/and doubles and surely is earning now.

Federations are proving themselves to be pieces of shit, unfortunately. As for Tennis Australia, they had this Jessica Moore girl who broke to top200 and then had to stop with tennis when her financial sources finished. Cmon, not like they have a million players in the top 200. How about helping these they have to get to top 100? I didn't believe what I heard, but heard it from a few people so maybe it's true, she became a waitress to be able to play some tournaments again.

Polish federation - last year couldn't buy a plane ticket to Australia to Janowicz. It's not like we have any other player in 10 years sight to be such a prospect. I seriously don't know on what they are spending the money if they aren't able to spend it on most obvious things. But then again, we talk about federation who turned down Wozniacki and Kerber when they wanted to represent Poland, and didn't offer anything to Peliwo's parents when there was a chance, so no wonder he stuck to Tennis Canada.

TC seems to be - at least from the outside - some very well run federation. Not always the case with American federation. It's already famous junior #1 ITF Taylor Townsend (how much more you can do to prove you're a talent?) received a WC to AO qualifying and the federation didn't help her financially to make the trip happen. So what other, more justified expenses do they have?

Russian federation - not like they have plenty of young ATP prospects, they only have this Donskoy and Kuznetsov. And yet they leave Donskoy on his own not moving anywhere with his game, until by miracle Safin finds him and invests in him (might have as well not happened) and now the guy is in top 100 and makes AO 3rd round. Safin says it was a federation's job but they didn't give a shit.

It's nice to find out these ITF livescore money will actually go to federations for development, but it seems federations struggle with managing these resources they already have...

Now, onto other things. Ofc futures guys should never earn anything close to Federer. Typically, providing a decent, clean place to sleep for free and maybe even voucher for dinner would be enough. Players wouldn't have to sleep in cars, or in 7 + tennis bags in 1 room, cos it's not much human. This Guido Pella who lately broke to top 100, said he was getting depressed already and wanted to finish career. The kid was only 20-21 or so, and had good junior career behind him, when it happened. Actually providing decent conditions maybe would keep some 40 yo vultures who go nowhere with their uninteresting games, but also would be more fair for these who can actually play something.

Money prize in futures in that situation wouldn't even need to be raised IMO, unless in SF and F, or just in some events. For example this week we have a 10K event in Mexico where Benneteau's 26 yo brother ranked below top 450 is the top seed, and we have 10K event in Florida where in R2 2 recent junior slam winners Fratangelo and Peliwo already could play, and you've got Ginepri over there. I doubt in Mexico anything below SF, maybe even F is worth watching. In Florida you can have many interesting matches. Crivoi is the top seed, this one can play too.

Generally from my observations, as I've been to many tournaments like challengers and futures, these top 250-300 guys are in huge amount very interesting to watch, and should be able to earn on tennis. Well, some of them have inflated ranks from playing African futures or small South American challengers, while some in futures ranked lower are also technically fine and can develop points (this Polish guy Grzegorz Panfil comes to my mind. He's a part time player these days, ofc turned into such due to no money for travel after his successful junior career). But the general is 250-300. I would personally like these guys to be able to afford the coach. Top 200 are very good players without a doubt, for these matches even random tennis fans can go and find entertainment. I think they deserve for it to be able to pay debts for early tournaments and get some savings off tennis.
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Old 01-26-2013, 08:18 AM   #108
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Default Re: Fitzpatrick about prize money: very interesting article

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathaliia View Post
Polish federation - last year couldn't buy a plane ticket to Australia to Janowicz. It's not like we have any other player in 10 years sight to be such a prospect. I seriously don't know on what they are spending the money if they aren't able to spend it on most obvious things. But then again, we talk about federation who turned down Wozniacki and Kerber when they wanted to represent Poland, and didn't offer anything to Peliwo's parents when there was a chance, so no wonder he stuck to Tennis Canada.
Impressive. That's almost UK LTA-level of wastefulness.
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:20 AM   #109
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Default Re: Fitzpatrick about prize money: very interesting article

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Chinaski View Post
you're contradicting you're own argument if you think Niland was getting huge funding from the national association and still only breaking even, relying on his parents after a successful year on the challenger tour.

for what it's worth, Niland was on 3k per year from the Irish Sporting Council. Tennis Ireland helped with coaching and facilities while he was in Ireland but didn't pay anything towards travel and other expenses. If he wanted to take one of their coaches or physios on the road he had to pay for it.
3K per year? really? if that is true it would totally change my vision toward their situation indeed.

But he also was trained by Wayne Ferreira, an ex top 10, which couldn't be cheap. Is it Niland's parents like filthy rich or smth?

If all youngsters get 3K per year and not 20K per year, then it's possibly a problem, but again Niland isn't a good example i think.
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Quote:
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Dimitrov will never win anything above 250 level.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sauletekis View Post
there won't be many WC matches that are going to be played at the same time of Wimby, but if I have to choose, WC will always come first by a long shot. Even if it's Argelia vs. South Korea.
no shit..

Quote:
Originally Posted by R0B1S View Post
Both as long as they don't overlap, but when they do - it's world cup every time for me.
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:27 AM   #110
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Default Re: Fitzpatrick about prize money: very interesting article

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathaliia View Post
Dutra Silva is actually a perfect example. He was always considered talented but he wasted many years without any money for travels or coaching. Finally, Larri Passos (ex Guga coach) found him and helped him put his game together when the guy was 27 or so. I think he's having a very good career for someone who had to wait this long. Although he says a coach is a big expense (but it pays back in results, doesn't it?) at least now he has Brazilian Post paying his travels (no federation at all, still, and he's #2 in Brazil behind Bellucci now I think). But guy plays slams, gets to weak ATP events in singles or/and doubles and surely is earning now.

Federations are proving themselves to be pieces of shit, unfortunately. As for Tennis Australia, they had this Jessica Moore girl who broke to top200 and then had to stop with tennis when her financial sources finished. Cmon, not like they have a million players in the top 200. How about helping these they have to get to top 100? I didn't believe what I heard, but heard it from a few people so maybe it's true, she became a waitress to be able to play some tournaments again.

Polish federation - last year couldn't buy a plane ticket to Australia to Janowicz. It's not like we have any other player in 10 years sight to be such a prospect. I seriously don't know on what they are spending the money if they aren't able to spend it on most obvious things. But then again, we talk about federation who turned down Wozniacki and Kerber when they wanted to represent Poland, and didn't offer anything to Peliwo's parents when there was a chance, so no wonder he stuck to Tennis Canada.

TC seems to be - at least from the outside - some very well run federation. Not always the case with American federation. It's already famous junior #1 ITF Taylor Townsend (how much more you can do to prove you're a talent?) received a WC to AO qualifying and the federation didn't help her financially to make the trip happen. So what other, more justified expenses do they have?

Russian federation - not like they have plenty of young ATP prospects, they only have this Donskoy and Kuznetsov. And yet they leave Donskoy on his own not moving anywhere with his game, until by miracle Safin finds him and invests in him (might have as well not happened) and now the guy is in top 100 and makes AO 3rd round. Safin says it was a federation's job but they didn't give a shit.

It's nice to find out these ITF livescore money will actually go to federations for development, but it seems federations struggle with managing these resources they already have...

Now, onto other things. Ofc futures guys should never earn anything close to Federer. Typically, providing a decent, clean place to sleep for free and maybe even voucher for dinner would be enough. Players wouldn't have to sleep in cars, or in 7 + tennis bags in 1 room, cos it's not much human. This Guido Pella who lately broke to top 100, said he was getting depressed already and wanted to finish career. The kid was only 20-21 or so, and had good junior career behind him, when it happened. Actually providing decent conditions maybe would keep some 40 yo vultures who go nowhere with their uninteresting games, but also would be more fair for these who can actually play something.

Money prize in futures in that situation wouldn't even need to be raised IMO, unless in SF and F, or just in some events. For example this week we have a 10K event in Mexico where Benneteau's 26 yo brother ranked below top 450 is the top seed, and we have 10K event in Florida where in R2 2 recent junior slam winners Fratangelo and Peliwo already could play, and you've got Ginepri over there. I doubt in Mexico anything below SF, maybe even F is worth watching. In Florida you can have many interesting matches. Crivoi is the top seed, this one can play too.

Generally from my observations, as I've been to many tournaments like challengers and futures, these top 250-300 guys are in huge amount very interesting to watch, and should be able to earn on tennis. Well, some of them have inflated ranks from playing African futures or small South American challengers, while some in futures ranked lower are also technically fine and can develop points (this Polish guy Grzegorz Panfil comes to my mind. He's a part time player these days, ofc turned into such due to no money for travel after his successful junior career). But the general is 250-300. I would personally like these guys to be able to afford the coach. Top 200 are very good players without a doubt, for these matches even random tennis fans can go and find entertainment. I think they deserve for it to be able to pay debts for early tournaments and get some savings off tennis.
Well, this might be the solution after all.

With tennis becoming more and more physical, perhaps just naturally those older vultures will be pushed to retire, so perhaps it would be better to have a certain increase of at least the CH tour.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abel View Post
Dimitrov will never win anything above 250 level.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sauletekis View Post
there won't be many WC matches that are going to be played at the same time of Wimby, but if I have to choose, WC will always come first by a long shot. Even if it's Argelia vs. South Korea.
no shit..

Quote:
Originally Posted by R0B1S View Post
Both as long as they don't overlap, but when they do - it's world cup every time for me.
NID
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:54 AM   #111
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Default Re: Fitzpatrick about prize money: very interesting article

When Muster tried to come back, he scored an epic fail, so there is probably some point where it's not fun anymore.

Also, when a guy is 28-30 and all he did at life was seeing some foreign countries playing futures, and his game didn't even lift him to challengers, the biological clock should be actually telling him to do something more productive with his life (go to college, have family, get a job).

At least this is how I think a logical person would behave
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Old 01-26-2013, 01:19 PM   #112
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Default Re: Fitzpatrick about prize money: very interesting article

Quote:
Originally Posted by latso View Post
3K per year? really? if that is true it would totally change my vision toward their situation indeed.

But he also was trained by Wayne Ferreira, an ex top 10, which couldn't be cheap. Is it Niland's parents like filthy rich or smth?

If all youngsters get 3K per year and not 20K per year, then it's possibly a problem, but again Niland isn't a good example i think.
The coaching with Ferreira was back when he was at college. He didn't work with him as a pro.

His father is a surgeon so I guess they have some money to spare without being mega-rich.

A federation in a small country like Ireland is always going to struggle for cash. In this economy there is zero funding from government level and it's tough to attract sponsorship.
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Old 10-16-2013, 08:09 PM   #113
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Default Re: Fitzpatrick about prize money: very interesting article

as for the original guy, he ended up well
dating sloane stephens who will be probably making millions the next couple of years
no more couchsurfing
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