[GSMnadal]

Nothing wrong with mindgames

[FleetSeb]

Originally Posted by Nathaliia

took med timeouts on gulbis breakpoints (yes, plural) at queens 2008

he didnt hear one bad word from british journos for that, but it made me dislike him ever since

Funny how he withdrew from his next match, eh. Yeah totally faking.

[Murray Mint]

This isn't the first time I've seen it suggested that Murray was somehow faking his issues against Nieminen. Did he decide to donate the first set as well?! Ffs, I don't think there's a more obvious case of someone genuinely having a physical struggle.

Funniest thing was that blog of Nieminen's where he was suggesting Andy had nothing to hurt him with.. Christ, Andy was even handing him his backside when he was still a scrawny kid, how delusional can you be...

[tektonac]

his psychedelic outfit does the job.

[Tag]

the only mind games murray plays are those involving kim and anal

if you want mind games, go watch a frauderer or greedal match

[TennisPhan1]

Originally Posted by retister

"I don't mind mind games as it brings spice to the confrontations, but please, spare me of this BS that Federer is some classy guy who doesn't play dirty. He does, just like Nadal, Nole and Murray"
Quoted from the closed thread.
I thought about it and I can't remember a single occasion when he tried to disrupt his opponent in such way, unlike the other three. He is mostly abusive to himself only.
Can anyone actually remember him doing something like that?

another serbhatingfed thread. now that's classy...

[MuzzahLovah]

Originally Posted by Action Jackson

Murray did it to Nieminen at Roland Garros. Always looking like he is dead tired is mind games, but players have to be professional and focus on the round yellow thing and hit it.

This is a joke? He needs mind games to beat Nieminen? Or was he actually in pain and he fought through it? The Murray hate on this board is absurd.

[MuzzahLovah]

Originally Posted by Nathaliia

took med timeouts on gulbis breakpoints (yes, plural) at queens 2008

he didnt hear one bad word from british journos for that, but it made me dislike him ever since

Your most recent example is from 4 years ago?

[Tag]

Originally Posted by MTwEeZi

Oh so this thread is about Frauderer? Tell me more.

every thread here gets turned into a frauderer thread

disgraceful fed fans

[MuzzahLovah]

Originally Posted by MaxPower

guilty of the injury "faking" and questionable MTOs but at least he isn't delaying all aspects of the game.

Also Murray is one of the better at turning matches. Playing bad himself or opponent in god mode then he has horrible body language. That can give the opponent confidence. Even crappy lower ranked guys starting to take out the victory. Then suddenly he smells weakness and goes all super-pumped. The pushing can be relentless and he can go from looking like he had given up to look like he's fighting for his life on every point.

Some opponents crap their pants then and choke. Murray has turned many matches being 0-2 down with such mind games. Maybe it wasn't on purpose early in his career but now that he's seen it work so many times I think he's being very self-destructive / injured on purpose just to set the opponent up for a nasty surprise.

How many MTO's has Murray taken this year? In the last 3? Against top players? Hardly any compared Nadal or Djokovic.

[zcess81]

Murray does play mind games, just like the other top guys. His main trick is to give impression to his opponent that he is struggling, that he is physically exhausted. How many times have we seen Murray grab his back, or his knee when he loses a point? Then when he wins a point and he's fine. Few minutes later he loses a point and he starts grabbing his knee/back again.

It's VERY tricky to play an opponent who is REALLY either injured or physically tired. When you play someone who looks injured, your natural instinct (conscious and/or sub-conscious) is to lower your game, to play safer, to make him run. Why go for the lines, red-line your game when your opponent is struggling, right? Wrong! Murray is not injured, he is not tired, he just wants you to think he is, so that you lower your standard of play, and then he strikes. Once you lower your standard of play, it's very difficult to raise it. Momentum is gone, confidence is gone, and you start making errors you were not making few games earlier. Nothing wrong with that trick imo. If you as a player, as a pro, allow yourself to be manipulated like that, you deserve everything you get, and you're not a pro (in that match at least) no matter what your ranking says.

Murray's tactic is no different to Nole or Rafa taking a medical timeout. Both tricks serve the same purpose: to destroy your opponent's rhythm, his confidence. To swing the momentum back in your favor. The only difference between the two tricks is that what Murray is doing takes a little longer to work (few games, or even a set), while medical timeout can have an immediate effect, unless the opponent is a true pro and blocks it out. Once the momentum is gone, there is no going back. These top guys are almost impossible to stop once you give them back the momentum, especially against lower ranked opponents.

Pros are impermeable to mind games.

[MuzzahLovah]

Originally Posted by FleetSeb

Funny how he withdrew from his next match, eh. Yeah totally faking.

Yeah, as far as I know when he appears seriously injured or takes MTO's, he actually withdraw or loses early. Compare that to Fed and his back problems at Wimbledon, before he went on to win, you have to to look at that with a little suspicion.

[MuzzahLovah]

Originally Posted by zcess81

Murray does play mind games, just like the other top guys. His main trick is to give impression to his opponent that he is struggling, that he is physically exhausted. How many times have we seen Murray grab his back, or his knee when he loses a point? Then when he wins a point and he's fine. Few minutes later he loses a point and he starts grabbing his knee/back again.

It's VERY tricky to play an opponent who is REALLY either injured or physically tired. When you play someone who looks injured, your natural instinct (conscious and/or sub-conscious) is to lower your game, to play safer, to make him run. Why go for the lines, red-line your game when your opponent is struggling, right? Wrong! Murray is not injured, he is not tired, he just wants you to think he is, so that you lower your standard of play, and then he strikes. Once you lower your standard of play, it's very difficult to raise it. Momentum is gone, confidence is gone, and you start making errors you were not making few games earlier. Nothing wrong with that trick imo. If you as a player, as a pro, allow yourself to be manipulated like that, you deserve everything you get, and you're not a pro (in that match at least) no matter what your ranking says.

Murray's tactic is no different to Nole or Rafa taking a medical timeout. Both tricks serve the same purpose: to destroy your opponent's rhythm, his confidence. To swing the momentum back in your favor. Once the momentum is gone, there is no going back. These top guys are almost impossible to stop once you give them back the momentum, especially against lower ranked opponents.

Pros are impermeable to mind games.

This is a joke. No, there is clear difference between an involuntary tic and clearly deciding when you opponent is a on a roll to delay play to check out the tape on your knee.

More often than not when Murray is grabbing himself, he does not play any better or worse, nor does his opponent, he can do it when he's winning and still win, and when he's losing and still lose.

[zcess81]

Originally Posted by MuzzahLovah

This is a joke. No, there is clear difference between an involuntary tic and clearly deciding when you opponent is a on a roll to delay play to check out the tape on your knee.

More often than not when Murray is grabbing himself, he does not play any better or worse, nor does his opponent, he can do it when he's winning and still win, and when he's losing and still lose.

Do not fool yourself. There is nothing "involuntary" about what Murray is doing. How come that "involuntary tick" only comes into play when Murray is losing? I've seen him MANY times exhibit that "involuntary tick" when he loses a few points, when he starts losing the momentum, then when he starts winning, it mysteriously vanishes.

[retister]

Originally Posted by MuzzahLovah

This is a joke. No, there is clear difference between an involuntary tic and clearly deciding when you opponent is a on a roll to delay play to check out the tape on your knee.

More often than not when Murray is grabbing himself, he does not play any better or worse, nor does his opponent, he can do it when he's winning and still win, and when he's losing and still lose.

The essence of the matter. Even if he does it on purpose (and my gut tells me he doesn't), the opponent still has the chance to just ignore it and keep doing his thing.
MTOs, on the other hand, physically prevent the opponent from playing. It's not just a mind game anymore.
Those things are not the same, not by a longshot.