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Mark Lenders · 09-30-2012, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Topspindoctor

Ferrer 5-2 H2H against Del Shitro.

Not bad for a vulture

Not bad at all. That said, having a favorable H2H against a Grand Slam winner is the only noteworthy aspect of his otherwise lackluster career. And Del Potro will probably end up overturning that H2H anyway; although Ferrer does pose some matchup issues to JMDP, Juan is clearly the better tennis player by far and the H2H mostly an anomaly.

Topspindoctor · 09-30-2012, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Lenders

Not bad at all. That said, having a favorable H2H against a Grand Slam winner is the only noteworthy aspect of his otherwise lackluster career. And Del Potro will probably end up overturning that H2H anyway; although Ferrer does pose some matchup issues to JMDP, Juan is clearly the better tennis player by far and the H2H mostly an anomaly.

No no, you're quite incorrect. Both are quite similar in the regard of having mediocre careers. If you take away Del-Shitro USO, both failed to win masters, both only win MM events, both fail against top 3 and both are seen as tier 2 players. David is a better player obviously, with better H2H, better ranking and more consistent game. Del Shitro is just a ballbashing clown whose fans are still hiding behind his limp wrist as an excuse that he can't beat a 31 year old Noserer.

Mark Lenders · 09-30-2012, 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Topspindoctor

No no, you're quite incorrect. Both are quite similar in the regard of having mediocre careers. If you take away Del-Shitro USO, both failed to win masters, both only win MM events, both fail against top 3 and both are seen as tier 2 players. David is a better player obviously, with better H2H, better ranking and more consistent game. Del Shitro is just a ballbashing clown whose fans are still hiding behind his limp wrist as an excuse that he can't beat a 31 year old Noserer.

Exactly, if you take away the USO. However, Del Potro did win that US Open beating Federer and Nadal on the way, so there's no reason why it shouldn't be counted. That weekend alone eclipsed Ferrer's entire career, both in terms of level of play and achievements. Even with a limp wrist, JMDP is still easily better than Ferrer.

rocketassist · 09-30-2012, 02:10 AM

Both have been to 4 in the world, both have won a lot of small tier events but JMDP has a US Open title so his career is quite comfortably superior to Ferrer's. That being said, Ferrer has things in his game that bother the Argentine such as the ability to rush him (JMDP likes to get a rhythm going off the ground but Ferrer gets balls back with interest)

Mark Lenders · 09-30-2012, 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocketassist

Both have been to 4 in the world, both have won a lot of small tier events but JMDP has a US Open title so his career is quite comfortably superior to Ferrer's. That being said, Ferrer has things in his game that bother the Argentine such as the ability to rush him (JMDP likes to get a rhythm going off the ground but Ferrer gets balls back with interest)

Pretty much this. It's not like the Murray vs JMDP comparison before Murray won the USO either, because with Murray it was always obvious he had the potential/ability to win a Slam himself too, which Ferrer simply doesn't.

And yeah, it's an awkward matchup for Delpo. He hates playing guys who can absorb and redirect power seamlessly, because his default gameplan doesn't work against them, he needs to be more offensive. Against most players he can gain the upperhand in a rally by hitting one single forehand (even if down the middle), that is not the case against Ferrer (and the current top 4). Still don't think it will that much of an issue if/when JMDP gets himself back to top form (no injuries), the gulf in ability is big enough to make matchup issues not as relevant, although Ferrer will probably remain someone JMDP will not want to see in his draws.

Topspindoctor · 09-30-2012, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Lenders

Exactly, if you take away the USO. However, Del Potro did win that US Open beating Federer and Nadal on the way, so there's no reason why it shouldn't be counted. That weekend alone eclipsed Ferrer's entire career, both in terms of level of play and achievements. Even with a limp wrist, JMDP is still easily better than Ferrer.

The context of that win was very dodgy to say the least. Nadal had an abdominal tear - he shouldn't have been in SF in the first place, while Noserer was choking left and right, when was the last time you saw him DF in double digits and serve at ~50% in a slam? He was still owning the ballbasher even playing like shit until the choke came

Honestly, as a Fed hater, I can say that USO 2009 was the biggest waste of his career. If he didn't inexplicably choke like a mug, he would be sitting on 18 at the moment. Ferrer and many other players were never afforded an opportunity to have the stars align for them like Delpo. That's why he's a fluke. He never backed up his results, he just got hot and lucky for 2 weeks. At least Mandy made multiple slam finals until USTA gifted him the USO

Mark Lenders · 09-30-2012, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Topspindoctor

The context of that win was very dodgy to say the least. Nadal had an abdominal tear - he shouldn't have been in SF in the first place, while Noserer was choking left and right, when was the last time you saw him DF in double digits and serve at ~50% in a slam? He was still owning the ballbasher even playing like shit until the choke came

Honestly, as a Fed hater, I can say that USO 2009 was the biggest waste of his career. If he didn't inexplicably choke like a mug, he would be sitting on 18 at the moment. Ferrer and many other players were never afforded an opportunity to have the stars align for them like Delpo. That's why he's a fluke. He never backed up his results, he just got hot and lucky for 2 weeks. At least Mandy made multiple slam finals until USTA gifted him the USO

Let's imagine you are right and the circumstances were really that favorable. Please tell me which players in that USO 2009 draw were of higher quality than this Nadal with an abdominal tear and 'choking' Federer. There might be a case for Djokovic, but that's pretty much it.

I agree that it was a missed chance for Federer, he had plenty of chances to win against an unexperienced opponent who, despite being on fire, was playing his first Slam final. It's still great that he didn't though, considering what happened to Del Potro after that USO - his wrist injury and surgery. Without that USO title, JMDP would be in serious jeapordy of ending his career Slamless and he's way too good a player for that. Even if injury ends up derailing the rest of his career, at least he's already got a Slam, which is only fair.

The stars can never align for Ferrer. Even if he had the nerve to win a Slam (which he doesn't), he simply doesn't have the game. Can you imagine him ever beating any of the current top 4 (and even Tsonga, Berdych...) in a Slam final?