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View Poll Results: Who's Better?

Tsonga 35 49.30%
Ferrer 36 50.70%
Voters: 71. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-04-2012, 05:42 PM   #46
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
Slam Finals:

Tsonga - 1 Ferrer - 0
Ferrer was very near in that match against Murray in AO 2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
Masters Titles:

Tsonga - 1 Ferrer - 0
Bercy 2008, Fed and Nadal retiring in quarters, no top-4 in semis

in these conditions Ferrer would also have won one M1000
he made 3 M1000 finals to Tsonga 2 (and remember how Tsonga reached Bercy final last year defeating Seppi and Isner on his favorite surface )

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
H2H against the top 3:

Tsonga - 11-19 Ferrer - 9-34
if you take out pre-2007 Federer who was a very special player who Tsonga didn't have to meet,

you have Tsonga 11-19 Ferrer 9-26

Moreover Ferrer is 4-5 against Murray, Tsonga is 1-5, Ferrer is 4-2 against del Potro, Tsonga is 1-5, etc etc ... Tsonga can be excellent against top-4 players but he often loses to a little bit less good players who have a lot of difficulties against Ferrer, ask Gasquet who he prefers to meet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
Current ranking:

Tsonga - 5 Ferrer - 6 with Berdych about to overtake him.
Ferrer has been ahead of Tsonga how many months before ??

PS : personally I prefer Tsonga over Ferrer, but I've just been struck how much Ferrer is underrated ! Including by me ... I reconsidered his case around 2 years ago when I looked more closely at the H2Hs. I learnt to look more closely at what he did rather than just keeping cliches and ignoring him as many people actually do. Moreover, people say he's older than Tsonga : yes, but Ferrer has clearly been better for around 2 years than he was before ! As for Tsonga, I like him but I think that last year he was sometimes lucky, like in Bercy or in WTF (he met a tired Berdych who had played a great match previous night against Ferrer ; I think Ferrer played great matches against Murray and Djokovic in that WTF)

Last edited by duong : 05-04-2012 at 05:55 PM.
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Old 05-04-2012, 05:46 PM   #47
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

Hate to say this but Tsonga is better (on any type of hard court or grass; Ferrer does win easily on clay). He's the one who actually threatens the elite, whereas Ferrer plays them close but can't win the big points.

Now which one is easier to root for? Easily Ferrer because Tsonga's brain isn't always functioning on the court. But even with that in mind, I know Tsonga is better and has had the results to back that.
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Old 05-04-2012, 05:50 PM   #48
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by duong View Post
Ferrer was very near in that match against Murray in AO 2011



Bercy 2008, Fed and Nadal retiring in quarters, no top-4 in semis

in these conditions Ferrer would also have won one M1000
he made 3 M1000 finals to Tsonga 2 (and remember how Tsonga reached Bercy final last year defeating Seppi and Isner on his favorite surface )



if you take out pre-2007 Federer who was a very special player who Tsonga didn't have to meet,

you have Tsonga 11-19 Ferrer 9-26

Moreover Ferrer is 4-5 against Murray, Tsonga is 1-5



Ferrer has been ahead of Tsonga how many months before ??
He wasn't near. He lost in 4 and Murray's victory was never in doubt.

If Ferrer could win in those conditions, then why didn't he win Bercy 2008?

Why should we take pre-2007 Federer? To make Ferrer look better? What about removing the special Djokovic 2011 to make Tsonga look better as well? Federer is always Federer.

An who cares about H2H about Murray? Murray is not a multi slam winner. Should I pull the H2H against some random tour player to make Tsonga look better.

Regardless of excuses, Tsonga has better achievements and has beaten each of the top 3 in GS tournaments.
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Old 05-04-2012, 05:52 PM   #49
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

He had set point for 2 set to love lead, missed easy putaway on BP next game. Hugely unappreciated choke, the Ferrer-Murray AO match
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Old 05-04-2012, 05:56 PM   #50
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

Murray was NEVER losing to Ferrer at the Australian Open. He came close to going 2 sets down but when he needed to up his game, he did such as in the tiebreaks. Ferrer is never reaching a GS final or winning a MS title.
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Old 05-04-2012, 06:01 PM   #51
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

For the Murray-Ferrer in AO 2011, Ferrer was also very near to coming back 2 sets-all in my memories.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
If Ferrer could win in those conditions, then why didn't he win Bercy 2008?
of course you know that indoor hardcourt conditions are the best for Tsonga

just imagine Ferrer on clay in these conditions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
Why should we take pre-2007 Federer? To make Ferrer look better? What about removing the special Djokovic 2011 to make Tsonga look better as well? Federer is always Federer.
About Fed : did you watch tennis before 2007 ?

As for Djokovic, how do you think Tsonga is 5-4 against Djokovic except that he didn't meet a great Djokovic in those ? (I saw all of those matches, they were good but it was not at all a top-Djokovic)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
An who cares about H2H about Murray? Murray is not a multi slam winner. Should I pull the H2H against some random tour player to make Tsonga look better.
I think the H2H with Murrays, Söderlings, Berdychs, Nalbandians, Roddicks, Del Potros, Ljubicics is also very important, not only the bling-bling of top-3 players.

If Tsonga is 0-5 against Söderling (Ferrer 4-10), 3-3 against Ljubicic (Ferrer 6-1), 3-4 against Gasquet (Ferrer 6-1), doesn't it mean that he showed some limits in these matches ?

Yes, I follow many of Tsonga's matches : he looks limited quite often as well All this is Tsonga, the brilliance and the limits ... and it's not even about consistency : actually he has had a good consistency for around one year, I mean for a player of his level all of them have a few bad losses, even Ferrer.

Last edited by duong : 05-04-2012 at 06:11 PM.
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Old 05-04-2012, 06:07 PM   #52
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by duong View Post
For thge Murray-Ferrer in AO 2011, Ferrer was also very near to coming back 2 sets-all in my memories.



of course you know that indoor hardcourt conditions are the best for Tsonga

just imagine Ferrer on clay in these conditions



About Fed : did you watch tennis before 2007 ?

As for Djokovic, how do you think Tsonga is 5-4 against Djokovic except that he didn't meet a great Djokovic in those ? (I saw all of those matches, they were good but it was not at all a top-Djokovic)
Yes, but he did not. And Murray simply upped his intensity and disposed of Ferrer.

Ferrer on clay is overrated. He's never been to the semis of RG. He's not losing to the top players, but to Monfils, Melzer and co. There's no guarantee he'd win a Masters if the top players didn't participate. Even recently he lost to Bellucci in Monte Carlo.

Yes, I watched tennis before 2007. Federer was great, but not invincible. Ignoring matches played vs Federer before 2007 in H2H is just silly.

Tsonga lost his 2 matches vs Djokovic 2011. If we exclude Ferrer vs pre-2007 Federer, we should also exclude Tsonga vs peak Nole for the sake of fairness.
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Old 05-04-2012, 06:10 PM   #53
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

Quote:
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Murray was NEVER losing to Ferrer at the Australian Open. He came close to going 2 sets down but when he needed to up his game, he did such as in the tiebreaks. Ferrer is never reaching a GS final or winning a MS title.
This.
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Old 05-04-2012, 06:17 PM   #54
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
Murray simply upped his intensity and disposed of Ferrer.
Murray probably wishes it had been "simple" : he was very relieved

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Lenders View Post
Ferrer on clay is overrated. He's never been to the semis of RG. He's not losing to the top players, but to Monfils, Melzer and co.
Melzer beat Djokovic that year, Monfils was really special in 2008 ... he also lost to Söderling before he beat Nadal, and so what ?

yes they are not big names but it doesn't mean they didn't play great.

Moreover if you want this kind of defeats by Tsonga, you will have tuns of them

It doesn't mean that he couldn't win Bercy then
And Ferrer reached 3 MS1000 finals, 2 on clay losing to Nadal and without looking ridiculous : surely without Nadal he'd have won

Ps : I'm not a Ferrer-fan, I prefer Tsonga, and I prefer generally the kind of play like Tsonga's, but I just say there are many cliches about Ferrer which are not correct, and he's always underrated. The truth is that Ferrer and Tsonga are very near
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Old 05-04-2012, 06:42 PM   #55
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

TSonga is superior clerly, if you are not blind you must see it. Ferrer is more consistent guy , but if we are talking game-wise better player is Tsonga-Ferer is better on clay what is obvious, but even on slow HC i would favor Tsonga, on grass, fast HC and indoors Tsonga is clearly better.

Ferrer is hard-worker,consistent guy, decent top 10 but that´s it, he was 5th recently just because Delpo was out for so long, Soderling is out and now even Tsonga-joke on clay is ahead of him in ranking... that´s telling us, even Berdych will go past him i believe.

Slam wise, Tsonga is always threat besides RG to take down anyone if he is playing good, but by Ferrer you know he is not making more than SF-thanks to draw too, he is beating guys he is suppose to beat, but you never expect from him to beat higher ranked guys at slams -Murray on clay was only good match-up for him, but they haven´t played on clay some time so maybe even that last thing is over and Murray maybe will beat him next time on clay.
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Old 05-04-2012, 08:40 PM   #56
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

are you kidding me? the fact that Tsonga can't keep a high form for more than 1 or 2 tournaments straight alone makes him lose this one.

Tsonga at his best is great but when does that happen? Every year or 2 sporadically? David's consistancy means he is a much greater player. Even if you compare their games, Ferrer's average level is far better than Tsonga's.

I'd take a steady drive over a slow one that gains some pace down a hill occasionally, any day
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Old 05-04-2012, 08:43 PM   #57
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

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are you kidding me? the fact that Tsonga can't keep a high form for more than 1 or 2 tournaments straight alone makes him lose this one.

Tsonga at his best is great but when does that happen? Every year or 2 sporadically? David's consistancy means he is a much greater player. Even if you compare their games, Ferrer's average level is far better than Tsonga's.

I'd take a steady drive over a slow one that gains some pace down a hill occasionally, any day
Bull. If this was the case, Tsonga would not be ahead of Ferrer in the rankings right now.

Neither of them has had any injuries, Tsonga has just been more consistent than Ferrer over the past year.

Tsonga is a greater player than Ferrer in terms of achievements and his level of play is also higher, especially peak level.
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Old 05-04-2012, 08:45 PM   #58
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

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Ferrer. His game is just more aesthetically pleasing.
Now I've seen/read it all. Ridiculous statement.

As for the question, Ferrer is better rankingswise except for the past few weeks. So, with that, goes the question. Everything else depends on personal preference and surface.
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:05 PM   #59
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Default Re: Who's Better - Tsonga or Ferrer?

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Ferrer. His game is just more aesthetically pleasing.
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:45 PM   #60
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