How much luck has to do with Nole's success? - Page 2 - MensTennisForums.com

MensTennisForums.com

MenstennisForums.com is the premier Men's Tennis forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.Please Register - It's Free!

Reply

Old 01-30-2012, 09:49 PM   #16
country flag Ultravox
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Age: 38
Posts: 153
Ultravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

You didnt answer the question. Was Nadal "lucky" not to lose 3-1? Yes or no?
Ultravox is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 

Old 01-30-2012, 09:51 PM   #17
country flag nole_no1
Registered User
 
nole_no1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Age: 20
Posts: 13,121
nole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond reputenole_no1 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

If he's not winning "he's a loser"
If he's tired and retiring "he's a pussy"
If he wins easily "the field is weak"
If he wins in difficult conditions coming back in the match "he is lucky"

Pretty pathetic tbh
nole_no1 is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 09:52 PM   #18
country flag Time2burn
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Age: 34
Posts: 7,680
Time2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond reputeTime2burn has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Its not just luck nole has big balls if fed had noles balls he would be unbeatable
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiseller
I can't wait to quote you in 5-6 hours.
Time2burn is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 09:53 PM   #19
country flag MaxPower
Registered User
 
MaxPower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Age: 30
Posts: 7,003
MaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond reputeMaxPower has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

The AO Final Nole had bad luck if anything. Had so many points lost due to bad line calls. Then when he challenged they were usually in his favor. Instead he got to replay the point and naturally lost about 50% of those bad calls. Can't remember last time I've seen a player robbed that badly by linesmen.

I do agree that he fluked out vs Fed in USO. But that's how it is. Sometimes you go for broke and make it. A funny example in 2011 was Verdasco vs Soderling when Nando had 40-0 and his own serve. Soderling goes for one big all or nothing return, then next rally hits a winner. After that Verdasco tries to go for his serve and hits like 3-4 DFs in very short time.
It's the ballsy play that puts the pressure on the opponent, especially his serve

Nole definitely took the risk to at least have some of it in his own hands. Luck to make that big return but let's not kid ourselves. He knew EXACTLY what he was doing. If he tried pushing he knew Fed would have it entirely in his hands instead and probably paint the line with a winner. Many other players wouldn't have taken that insane risk on MP and Federer wouldn't have gotten under the same pressure with his serve and probably closed it out.

As for the Murray SF it's the same as their Rome match. Nothing was over. 5-5 15-40 in 5th set? Give me a break. In Rome he even served for it but never got MPs. It was far from over
MaxPower is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 09:55 PM   #20
country flag Ultravox
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Age: 38
Posts: 153
Ultravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond reputeUltravox has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nole_no1 View Post
If he's not winning "he's a loser"
If he's tired and retiring "he's a pussy"
If he wins easily "the field is weak"
If he wins in difficult conditions coming back in the match "he is lucky"

Pretty pathetic tbh
Yes, but Novak is not coming from Bulgaria. It is his greatest sin...
Ultravox is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 09:57 PM   #21
country flag latso
Registered User
 
latso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Age: 37
Posts: 8,247
latso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultravox View Post
You didnt answer the question. Was Nadal "lucky" not to lose 3-1? Yes or no?
yes, of course. In the same way.

I'm not denying facts here, just stating the obvious.
latso is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 09:58 PM   #22
country flag SetSampras
Registered User
 
SetSampras's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Age: 31
Posts: 3,173
SetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond reputeSetSampras has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Watching the AO it seems more to do with the opponent serving like shit and getting tight in tight points. (Murray, Nadal etc) Djoker didn't look all that impressive. Certainly not as he did last year. Murray and Nadal had Nole on the ropes reeling. But then again MUrray and Nadal have never been known to be Ivanisevic or Sampras when it comes to Serving so I guess its to be expected. Djoker can get broken easy, but if you are serving like shit and hand the break back easy, it doesn't mattter
SetSampras is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 09:59 PM   #23
country flag stewietennis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,041
stewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond reputestewietennis has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Quote:
Originally Posted by latso View Post
That's way too general.

Even at first sight you can name some absolute beat downs like most of Rafa's RGs, earlier Roger's Wimbies, as well as most his USOs.
Luck is random. It doesn't favour one player over another.

Luck also exists in beatdowns although they're not really a determining factor in the outcome of the match. Maybe Rafa hits a ball that clips the net just enough to send it rolling over to Roger's side – that's luck. Maybe Roger shanks a routine backhand – that's luck. Maybe Safin hits an overhead but his opponent guesses right and sends it back – that's luck. Maybe they don't have to play Karlovic or Isner in Round 1 – that's luck. Maybe their opponent is feeling under the weather – that's luck. Maybe Roger is put in Novak's half of the draw – that's luck, for someone.
stewietennis is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 10:03 PM   #24
country flag latso
Registered User
 
latso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Age: 37
Posts: 8,247
latso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxPower View Post
The AO Final Nole had bad luck if anything. Had so many points lost due to bad line calls. Then when he challenged they were usually in his favor. Instead he got to replay the point and naturally lost about 50% of those bad calls. Can't remember last time I've seen a player robbed that badly by linesmen.

I do agree that he fluked out vs Fed in USO. But that's how it is. Sometimes you go for broke and make it. A funny example in 2011 was Verdasco vs Soderling when Nando had 40-0 and his own serve. Soderling goes for one big all or nothing return, then next rally hits a winner. After that Verdasco tries to go for his serve and hits like 3-4 DFs in very short time.
It's the ballsy play that puts the pressure on the opponent, especially his serve

Nole definitely took the risk to at least have some of it in his own hands. Luck to make that big return but let's not kid ourselves. He knew EXACTLY what he was doing. If he tried pushing he knew Fed would have it entirely in his hands instead and probably paint the line with a winner. Many other players wouldn't have taken that insane risk on MP and Federer wouldn't have gotten under the same pressure with his serve and probably closed it out.

As for the Murray SF it's the same as their Rome match. Nothing was over. 5-5 15-40 in 5th set? Give me a break. In Rome he even served for it but never got MPs. It was far from over
That's fait enough and i agree with all the above.

It is exactly like this. Nole goes for the shots, he's good enough to make them and then the momentum changes.

The luck factor is there, but the better you are, the lesser luck affects your plays.

As mentionned above, except his FH return against Roger, all those points were actually flawlessly played and fought.

In an very similar way Roger put himself in position to play for and eventually win his only RG tittle, we all remember this inside out FH against Haas in a desperate situation.

These things are part of the game, but just blindly denying some facts like the other kids around is plain stupid.
latso is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 10:04 PM   #25
country flag tektonac
Registered User
 
tektonac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,597
tektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond reputetektonac has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

when you eat lots of paprika (пипер) you grow balls of steel.

tektonac is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 10:05 PM   #26
country flag Right On
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 193
Right On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond reputeRight On has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

No luck involved in getting up 7-0. You have to be blind not to see that Djoker >> Nadal right now. Djoker had a very bad day sunday, next matches between them won't be so close.
Right On is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 10:11 PM   #27
country flag latso
Registered User
 
latso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Age: 37
Posts: 8,247
latso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Quote:
Originally Posted by stewietennis View Post
Luck is random. It doesn't favour one player over another.

Luck also exists in beatdowns although they're not really a determining factor in the outcome of the match. Maybe Rafa hits a ball that clips the net just enough to send it rolling over to Roger's side – that's luck. Maybe Roger shanks a routine backhand – that's luck. Maybe Safin hits an overhead but his opponent guesses right and sends it back – that's luck. Maybe they don't have to play Karlovic or Isner in Round 1 – that's luck. Maybe their opponent is feeling under the weather – that's luck. Maybe Roger is put in Novak's half of the draw – that's luck, for someone.
That's the punter speaking here (or a student having his statistics period )

I agree with you that luck is always equal to 0, But with one important condition - Over a period of time!

On a single point, when the ball clips the net - t's pure luck wether it will fall on this or that side.

On generl terms, if Nole is worth winning 10 slams in his career, it won't matter if he won them in 3 years or in 15, as he'll luck some out, some will unluckily lose, that's when it goes down to 0.

But in a shorter period of time this is a factor indeed.

just imo
latso is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 10:13 PM   #28
country flag Gagsquet
Banned!
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Paris
Age: 24
Posts: 6,128
Gagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond reputeGagsquet has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Quote:
Originally Posted by leng jai View Post
No luck, just egg.
Well said

When times got tough in 2010 season, Novak's coach said to him:

Adversity provides you 2 choices:

1) To crack like an egg

or

2) To bounce back like a tennis ball better than ever.

which one will you be: The egg or the tennis ball?


Nole chose the egg, bought one and slept inside. He started to think and behave like an egg. He shaved his hair in December 2010 to look like an egg. The egg is the root of his success.
Gagsquet is offline View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 10:13 PM   #29
country flag latso
Registered User
 
latso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Age: 37
Posts: 8,247
latso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond reputelatso has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tektonac View Post
when you eat lots of paprika (пипер) you grow balls of steel.


Hvala
latso is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 10:49 PM   #30
country flag NID
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,809
NID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond reputeNID has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: How much luck has to do with Nole's success?

Djokovic is all luck, primarly because he was born in Serbia, the land of plenty. Mighty Serbian Lawn and Tennis Association helped him make the breaktrough, frequently outbidding Tio Tony and the Swiss Mafia when fixing the draws and bribing the linespeople.
NID is online now View My Blog!   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


Copyright (C) Verticalscope Inc
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBCredits v1.4 Copyright ©2007, PixelFX Studios