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-   -   TT 2012 - Ranking System? (http://www.menstennisforums.com/showthread.php?t=210693)

keqtqiadv 09-30-2012 11:57 PM

TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
This topic was raised during the last off-season. We agreed to discuss it in 2012 for a possible implementation in 2013, because of the dificulties of a possible transition to a different system and how deeply a change in the rankings would affect the game as a whole.

ATP & TT points breakdown:
http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...ps185da990.gif

There hasn't been much discussion on this topic, but we're opening a poll anyway. Which of the systems do you prefer, the ATP system or the current TT system? Please vote (TT players only).

The suggestion of giving points for wins in qualifying will be discussed/voted in the TT Changes thread.

Goldenoldie 10-01-2012 12:00 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
I believe the major advantage of the TT rankings is that they give more weight to the challengers and lower ranked tournaments.
Two points in favour of this:-
1. A Challenger is no easier to predict - in fact it is probably harder.
2. Newcomers can probably rise through the ranks quicker.

I can understand players wanting the setup to mirror real tennis as closely as possible, but we are not all Nadals or Federers.

savesthedizzle 10-01-2012 12:22 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Goldenoldie (Post 12455403)
I believe the major advantage of the TT rankings is that they give more weight to the challengers and lower ranked tournaments.
Two points in favour of this:-
1. A Challenger is no easier to predict - in fact it is probably harder.
2. Newcomers can probably rise through the ranks quicker.

I can understand players wanting the setup to mirror real tennis as closely as possible, but we are not all Nadals or Federers.

Agreed.

Lazyking 10-01-2012 02:39 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
I think the ranking system is fine.

Hidalgo 10-01-2012 04:20 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Goldenoldie (Post 12455403)
2. Newcomers can probably rise through the ranks quicker.

it will be not too interesting:D
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lazyking (Post 12455620)
I think the ranking system is fine.

adreed. but maybe some points for players (teams) who lost in Final round Qualies of ATP250 (ATP500, ATP1000) (and in the 2d round and final round qualies of GS)

Lazyking 10-01-2012 04:36 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
I would be in favor of grand slam qualies points simply because some players choose not to play because qualies is so diffucult. You're making over 60 picks just to get to the third round of qualies.

fsilva 10-01-2012 09:03 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
I'd only suggest that Futures wouldn't count as much as Challengers! It's not a matter of how difficult it can be to predict or not.. It's simply to have an "entry level" tournament where new comers could feel more at ease. Say something like:
W: 60
F: 42
S: 27
Q: 14
R16: 6
R32: 0
Q: 1

lolada_4 10-01-2012 11:12 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
i don't agree the TT ranking system - I think we need to use the same amount of Points like in real life tennis
For example ATP250: 250, 150, 90, 45, 20.

I think itīs better! :D

abollo 10-20-2012 03:44 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
I think we should use the breakdown from the ATP. For me I don't think it would have a negative effect on newcomers or challengers players. I think that would make it easier not harder for new players to rise in the ranking especially when they are playing grand slams for example. In ATP it's uncommon that low ranked players would defeat seeded players in first rounds in slams, while in TT it's always possible as there are always equal chances to win any match.
If it happened I think a transition would be the whole next year I think using two parallel rankings, the normal one we currently using and creating a parallel one with a new ranking system which won't be used and then in the beginning of 2014 start using the new one.
Maybe a vote would help see what the majority really wants?!

Thanks

Goldenoldie 10-20-2012 04:10 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by abollo (Post 12497089)
I think we should use the breakdown from the ATP. For me I don't think it would have a negative effect on newcomers or challengers players. I think that would make it easier not harder for new players to rise in the ranking especially when they are playing grand slams for example. In ATP it's uncommon that low ranked players would defeat seeded players in first rounds in slams, while in TT it's always possible as there are always equal chances to win any match.
If it happened I think a transition would be the whole next year I think using two parallel rankings, the normal one we currently using and creating a parallel one with a new ranking system which won't be used and then in the beginning of 2014 start using the new one.
Maybe a vote would help see what the majority really wants?!

Thanks

It depends what you mean by low ranked. Only a very few low ranked players even play in the first round of slams

supertom 10-20-2012 04:36 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hidalgo (Post 12455762)
it will be not too interesting:D

adreed. but maybe some points for players (teams) who lost in Final round Qualies of ATP250 (ATP500, ATP1000) (and in the 2d round and final round qualies of GS)

I agree with the last idea to promote the qualifications by giving some points in different tournaments (if the QD is complete)

Thunderfish8 10-22-2012 07:01 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
I have a few opinions.

1. I am totally fine with adjusting certain things like rewarding more points per round (e.g. Finalists getting more than half the champions points in TT as opposed to exactly half as many in ATP). It basically gives points for winning matches instead of making 8 QF equal to 1 title.
I guess it rewards consistency??? Idk, but I like it.

2. What bugs me is the way that the points are scaled back. It doesn't make sense to me that a challenger title is worth a bit less than an ATP 250 final. The 250 field is much more competitive and although you could argue that the picks are more difficult, everybody is at the same advantage/disadvantage. It's all comparative. I understand that it is designed to help newcomers rise up faster, but it is almost too easy.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is:
Let's continue to adjust points per round to give more credit to finalists, semifinalists, etc.
But rescale the ATP events to match the current ATP ranking system (e.g. Slams = 2000 ; Masters = 1000)
It's fine if you want to make a GS final worth 1300 points, or a Masters SF worth 450 points or something. Just don't treat CH on the same level as ATP 250 events.

keqtqiadv 10-26-2012 01:14 AM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
There hasn't been much discussion on this topic, but we're opening a poll anyway. Which of the systems do you prefer, the ATP system or the current TT system? Please vote (TT players only).

The suggestion of giving points for wins in qualifying will be discussed/voted in the TT Changes thread.

mateusz2904 10-27-2012 07:09 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
I think we should swich to ATP system. If someone is able to 'convert' rankings during off-season, it shouldn't be a problem.

Personally, I don't think we should give more points for challengers. I spent a lot of time building my rankings to play ATP tournaments regulary (it was 2 years I think) and it shouldn't be easier now.

Goldenoldie 10-27-2012 07:20 PM

Re: TT 2012 - Ranking System?
 
I endorse the current system, and applaud fsilva's idea of a lower tier for futures. Hopefully we are attracting more players, which will mean more Futures.


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