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Dem Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords shot in the head

3K views 36 replies 15 participants last post by  Lee 
#1 ·
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#2 ·
No surprise. It's easier to get a gun that a porn magazine in some parts of the U.S. And all the heatd political enviroment :help:
 
#7 ·
Conservative press? Now that is comedy. It's the information age. His youtube and facebook among other things have all been copied and widely distributed. All of his fellow students and teachers identified him as ranting leftist. He posted pictures of Marx, Mao and Cesar Chavez all over his site.

He rants about the "racist" tea party and supports Obama. So you hold Obama responsible as people seem to want to do Palin if someone who calls himself her supporter does something stupid.

But let the revisionism begin.
 
#8 ·
What is your source for that information?

I've looked at several news sites and have not found it.

On My Space he listed books and it contains both the communist manefesto and mein kampf. Also George Orwell and Huxley. On his last youtube video he spoke of not trusting the current government, reading the constitution, and creating his own currency. It's not very logical and he appears to have a mental illness.

Source for where I watched the videos is http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/08/jared-lee-loughner-gabrielle-giffords-shooter_n_806243.html
 
#10 ·
I have not seen an authentic Facebook page for the shooter, just the fake ones that suddenly popped yesterday after the shooting with pictures of Obama and Clinton. (If any one has a link, please post it).

His myspace page was taken down pretty quickly as well, and I have not seen a screenshot of that either, just descriptions of the alleged content including a list of his favorite books ranging from 1984, Brave New World, Gulliver's Travels, The Republic, Mein Kampf, and The Communist Manifesto, and a few photos purported to be from there.

The only thing that is still on the internet intact is his youtube account (http://www.youtube.com/classitup10) with nearly incoherent ramblings about currency, grammar, fraud commited by his community college, and the incorrect year on the calendar. I have seen absolutely NOTHING from a reliable source that this guy had any political alliance to a party or side whatsoever, just ridiculous finger pointing from both sides. He seems to be just another in a long line of mentally deranged American white males who gets a gun to express himself, just when I thought we were running out of those and had to find something else to worry about.

The Sarah Palin thing is old news. It was brought up yesterday as a knee jerk reaction to the shock and grief that people felt, their search for answers in the time before this guy was identified. Palin was brought to task for that image last March when she first posted it, she defended it and left it up. Yesterday, she took it off her website (but left it on her facebook page). It is time to move on from that topic, Palin is NOT a viable part of this discussion any longer (start another topic about violent rhetoric separate from this event, she can be the center of that).

While the discourse in this country has become increasingly vitriolic and even violent (with Sharron Angle's 'second amendment solutions' comment at the top of the list), I sincerely doubt it had any effect on the actions of this particular individual.
 
#11 ·
While the discourse in this country has become increasingly vitriolic and even violent (with Sharron Angle's 'second amendment solutions' comment at the top of the list), I sincerely doubt it had any effect on the actions of this particular individual.
I don't know what affected this young man. I can't discount the rampant depictions of violence in this country as a cause though.

As unfortunate as I find Ms. Palin and her rhetoric, I doubt that was a direct cause. The shooter didn't seem affiliated with anyone in particular. His writing on You Tube just seems sad, lonely, suspicious and dearranged.

If this does serve to make public figures (of all sided) calm down a bit in their lurid speech, I for one would be thrilled. It's gotten to be too much. There was this bit that was very disturbing:

Kelly held an event on June 12th urging supporters to "Get on Target for Victory in November/Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office/Shoot a fully automatic M15 with Jesse Kelly."

Here's how the Arizona Daily Star described the event at the time:

Jesse Kelly, meanwhile, doesn't seem to be bothered in the least by the Sarah Palin controversy earlier this year, when she released a list of targeted races in crosshairs, urging followers to "reload" and "aim" for Democrats. Critics said she was inciting violence.

He seems to be embracing his fellow tea partier's idea. Kelly's campaign event website has a stern-looking photo of the former Marine in military garb holding his weapon. It includes the headline: "Get on Target for Victory in November. Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office. Shoot a fully automatic M16 with Jesse Kelly."
I doubt that had anything to do with the shooting, but nevertheless, it's disturbing.
 
#16 ·
Which woman are you referring to? Giffords is not dead, but 6 other people are.
 
#19 ·
That Sheriff was already well-known for his partisan politics before the shooting. The people making him out to be some kind of voice of truth are just plain idiots. The guy needs to be focused on how this happened in his jurisdiction and obtaining all facts about any other people being involved. He doesn't need to be airing his politics on news shows. He's Nifong with a badge.
 
#21 ·
I might have believed that if it wasn't coming from the right-wing nutjob that is you.
 
#23 ·
We could all do a great deal to lower the temperature of political debate by simply refusing to watch outlets that engage in political baiting and polemics. I don't watch Fox or MSNBC. CNN has so trivialized itself that it is unwatchable. Too bad because once CNN was a great source of international news reporting.

Just say no.
 
#24 ·
Which leaves what? The major network news that most people see (CBS in particular) are far more biased than CNN or Fox. There is an unbreakable entrenchment of left-wing bias there. Couric in particular now. The report they did on the shooting, even when it was clear that he wasn't a tea party type, was entirely about Sarah Palin being responsible. The internet is sadly the only place to get the right information.
 
#25 ·
So just to be clear, you consider CBS to be more biased than Fox News? The same network created solely to advance a point of view with almost every major presumptive Republican candidate for 2012 on their payroll?

I do agree with you that the focus in the last few days has been too heavy on Palin. But her whole relationship with the media is more complex than simply being a consistent victim of bias from the major networks. Objectively, the worst possible case scenario for Sarah Palin would be for the mainstream media to stop covering her every tweet, speech, and policy pronouncement. She feeds off it, and it fuels her popularity on the right. It also helps keep her celebrity going - which is as important to her as any political aspirations at the moment. And honestly, whether its right or wrong, the fact she openly mocks the profession of journalism and refers to everyone bar Fox News as the "lamestream" media - well, that might explain why she's not necessarily the most popular politician in the United States with the scribes.
 
#27 ·
Wow, definitely silly to debate politics or biases in a situation like this. Condolences go out to the families of the killed ones, including the 9(?) year-old girl (who had just made student council in her school class and wanted to be a politician one day), and I hope Giffords gets a warm reception if/when she returns to work.

Weird to see that the 9 year old girl was born on 9/11, BTW :eek:
 
#34 · (Edited)
This incident is a clear example why I distrust the media so much. That means everybody from Fox on up to CNN and the NYT. They're all pushing a political agenda; they are the ones who have charged up the incendiary political rhetoric. The fact that so-called trustworthy news sources have actually tried to blame Palin or the Tea Party for this Communist Manifesto-reading nutjob's behavior is one reason why this country has lost its collective mind. For them to have instantly politicized this incident, without any proof as to what his motive was, was irresponsible journalism. We need more of Jon Stewart's Rally for Sanity talk.

The guy who shot Ms. Giffords was a plain old, garden-variety lunatic looking for his fifteen minutes of fame. Sometimes I wonder if people like him would exist if the media didn't give him the infamy he sought?
 
#35 ·
I don't care if the shooter's favorite book is Horton Hears a Who (his book list seems like a young person's idea of impressive more than a real list). Palin is not unconnected, because her casually violent rhetoric permeates the entire political atmosphere, in forsaken Arizona more than most places in the US.
 
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