It's a fact. He might not have been able to hang with the current top 4 post surgery, but he's still comfortably a better player than anyone else. He's also 5-5 in his last 10 matches against said top 4 so the signs are that the gap is closing, not increasing.
Surgery/injuries have affected his relative standing in the game compared to the current top 4, but that's all. He's still better than everyone else. This has been the case ever since his return.
How about voting honestly? This is the real issue here: people who vote Ferrer either follow the rankigns blindly or just do it as a wind-up. Any unbiased observer can easily conclude that there are only four people in the world whose ability to play tennis exceeds Del Potro at this point in time and none of them has wings.
Re: The reality is than del Potro is the fifth best tennis player in the world
Rest Of Top 8's Record In Slams And Masters Over Last 12 Months-
2012 French Open- Ferrer Semi Final
Berdych Round of 16
Del Potro Quarter Final
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Wimbledon-
Ferrer Quarter Final
Berdych Round 1
Del Potro Round of 16 Tsonga Semi Final
2012 US Open- Ferrer Semi Final Berdych Semi Final
Del Potro Quarter Final
Tsonga Round 2
2013 Aussie Open- Ferrer Semi Final
Berdych Quarter Final
Del Potro Round of 32
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Madrid Masters-
Ferrer Quarter Final Berdych Finalist
Del Potro Semi Final
Tsonga Round of 16
2012 Rome Masters- Ferrer Semi Final
Berdych Quarter Final
Del Potro Round of 16
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Canada Masters-
Ferrer DNP Berdych Round of 16
Del Potro Round 2
Tsonga Round 2
2012 Cincinnati Masters-
Ferrer Round 2
Berdych Round of 16 Del Potro Semi Final
Tsonga DNP
2012 Shanghai Masters-
Ferrer DNP Berdych Semi Final
Del Potro DNP
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Paris Masters- Ferrer- Champion
Berdych Quarter Final
Del Potro Round of 16
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Tour Finals-
Ferrer 3rd Place Group
Berdych 3rd Place Group Del Potro Semi Finals
Tsonga 4th Place Group
2013 Indian Wells-
Ferrer Round 2
Berdych Semi FInals Del Potro Finalist
Tsonga Quarter Final
2013 Miami Masters- Ferrer Finalist
Berdych Quarter Final
Del Potro Round 2
Tsonga Round of 16
2013 Monte Carlo-
Ferrer DNP
Berdych Round of 16
Del Potro Round of 16 Tsonga Semi Finals
Amount of Times Performed The Best of Ferrer, Berdych, Del Potro and Tsonga-
Ferrer 6
Berdych 4
Del Potro 3
Tsonga 2
To be the 5th best player in the world you must be the most consistent over the year and this proves that your point of Ferrer only being in the top 5 because of "Vulturing" is entirely wrong. As over the last year Ferrer has performed the best when it really mattered.
Rest Of Top 8's Record In Slams And Masters Over Last 12 Months-
2012 French Open- Ferrer Semi Final
Berdych Round of 16
Del Potro Quarter Final
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Wimbledon-
Ferrer Quarter Final
Berdych Round 1
Del Potro Round of 16 Tsonga Semi Final
2012 US Open- Ferrer Semi Final Berdych Semi Final
Del Potro Quarter Final
Tsonga Round 2
2013 Aussie Open- Ferrer Semi Final
Berdych Quarter Final
Del Potro Round of 32
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Madrid Masters-
Ferrer Quarter Final Berdych Finalist
Del Potro Semi Final
Tsonga Round of 16
2012 Rome Masters- Ferrer Semi Final
Berdych Quarter Final
Del Potro Round of 16
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Canada Masters-
Ferrer DNP Berdych Round of 16
Del Potro Round 2
Tsonga Round 2
2012 Cincinnati Masters-
Ferrer Round 2
Berdych Round of 16 Del Potro Semi Final
Tsonga DNP
2012 Shanghai Masters-
Ferrer DNP Berdych Semi Final
Del Potro DNP
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Paris Masters- Ferrer- Champion
Berdych Quarter Final
Del Potro Round of 16
Tsonga Quarter Final
2012 Tour Finals-
Ferrer 3rd Place Group
Berdych 3rd Place Group Del Potro Semi Finals
Tsonga 4th Place Group
2013 Indian Wells-
Ferrer Round 2
Berdych Semi FInals Del Potro Finalist
Tsonga Quarter Final
2013 Miami Masters- Ferrer Finalist
Berdych Quarter Final
Del Potro Round 2
Tsonga Round of 16
2013 Monte Carlo-
Ferrer DNP
Berdych Round of 16
Del Potro Round of 16 Tsonga Semi Finals
Amount of Times Performed The Best of Ferrer, Berdych, Del Potro and Tsonga-
Ferrer 6
Berdych 4
Del Potro 3
Tsonga 2
To be the 5th best player in the world you must be the most consistent over the year and this proves that your point of Ferrer only being in the top 5 because of "Vulturing" is entirely wrong. As over the last year Ferrer has performed the best when it really mattered.
Re: The reality is that del Potro is easily the fifth best tennis player in the world
I think I would put DelPotro ahead of ferrer, tsonga and berdych. Because he has the game and temprament to win a slam and beat top 4. Delpo when on is a joy to watch, in Indian wells he showed what he can do and i believe he is geniune contender.
The other 3 you can argue for which is better or worse depending on your own individual criteria.
1. consistency = ferrer
2. beating federer = berdych
3. pushing top 4 guys but still losing = tsonga
I think I would put DelPotro ahead of ferrer, tsonga and berdych. Because he has the game and temprament to win a slam and beat top 4. Delpo when on is a joy to watch, in Indian wells he showed what he can do and i believe he is geniune contender.
The other 3 you can argue for which is better or worse depending on your own individual criteria.
1. consistency = ferrer
2. beating federer = berdych
3. pushing top 4 guys but still losing = tsonga
Re: The reality is that del Potro is easily the fifth best tennis player in the world
If you mean atm, then I honestly think he's the 3rd behind Djokovic and Nadal. And I'm not trolling. Murray is in a minor slump. He did win Miami, but didn't play anything special and got destroyed by Wawa in MC, plus Delpo beat him just few weeks ago. Ferrer is injured, he's out of the discussion. Federer hasn't shown anything this year. Only thing worth mentioning is his win over Tsonga in AO, but even there he wasn't that great. Of course, I expect Fed to pick up and play better rather soon, but ATM, judging by their performances after AO, Delpo is the 3rd best player in my eyes and the 3rd favorite for Madrid (as the next big tournament) and RG (as the next Slam). Doesn't mean that all won't change as soon as after Madrid or Rome, tho.
P.S. Before some Murray fan starts nagging me, I also took into consideration that we are now in the clay court season, hence Delpo gets little bonus points.
P.S.S. Him being the 3rd best player atm, doesn't mean he should be ranked #3.
If you mean atm, then I honestly think he's the 3rd behind Djokovic and Nadal. And I'm not trolling. Murray is in a minor slump. He did win Miami, but didn't play anything special and got destroyed by Wawa in MC, plus Delpo beat him just few weeks ago. Ferrer is injured, he's out of the discussion. Federer hasn't shown anything this year. Only thing worth mentioning is his win over Tsonga in AO, but even there he wasn't that great. Of course, I expect Fed to pick up and play better rather soon, but ATM, judging by their performances after AO, Delpo is the 3rd best player in my eyes and the 3rd favorite for Madrid (as the next big tournament) and RG (as the next Slam). Doesn't mean that all won't change as soon as after Madrid or Rome, tho.
P.S. Before some Murray fan starts nagging me, I also took into consideration that we are now in the clay court season, hence Delpo gets little bonus points.
P.S.S. Him being the 3rd best player atm, doesn't mean he should be ranked #3.
I mean in general. If a big tournament comes around, I believe Del Potro will always be at worst the fifth most likely man to win it/reach the final. On clay, he might (I emphasize the 'might') be ahead of Murray, but in general he definitely isn't. He most definitely is ahead of the rest of the field though.
He's not been quite top 4 since his return, but he's definitely the most immediate threat to them, at least a step above Berdych/Tsonga - and let's not even talk about Ferrer.
Re: The reality is that del Potro is easily the fifth best tennis player in the world
I find Wing Man Frank's and Matthew2408's posts convincing enough to conclude that Del Potro currently is not the fifth best tennis player in the world. In some cases rankings do lie, but those stats don't.
In 2012 Del Potro's h2h against top 5-8 was:
vs Ferrer 0-3
vs Berdych 2-1
vs Tsonga 2-1
The best case you can make is that JMDP is the 6th best tennis player in the world, and even that is quite debatable.
Re: The reality is that del Potro is easily the fifth best tennis player in the world
The are a few problems with this opinion:
1. Ferrer is over 2200 points ahead of Del Potro in the rankings.
2. Ferrer bitch-slapped Del Potro at Wimbledon and grass is Ferrer's worst surface.
3. Ferrer leads their head 2 head by some margin.
1. Ferrer is over 2200 points ahead of Del Potro in the rankings.
2. Ferrer bitch-slapped Del Potro at Wimbledon and grass is Ferrer's worst surface.
3. Ferrer leads their head 2 head by some margin.
How can you be the fifth best player when the first four don't fear you in any way? Conversely, all of them know how good Del Potro is and that he can compete on even terms with them when peaking - Federer and Djokovic are even on record, on different occasions, saying that facing Del Potro is the same as facing another one of the top 4 from a mental point of view.
Unlike Tsonga and Berdych, Del Potro doesn't need to take any extra risks, when healthy for a prolonged period/in form, he can match any of the top 4 from the baseline and go toe to toe with them.
Well, Lenders, here's where your arguments begin. Your definition of a better player isn't the definition some other posters use. The answer is obviously Delpo. I would always pick him to beat a top guy or win a Slam ahead of Ferrer. And I agree, to me Delpo is a better player, but I totally understand people who say otherwise.
I can't. Is Ferrer fully fit/healthy more often than Del Potro? Unfortunately yes. Is he a better player? Absolutely not. Taking it as a given that the best four players are Djokovic, Nadal, Federer and Murray, there's not a single one of them who would not choose to face Ferrer over JMDP in a heartbeat if a big match were on the line.
Well, it can't be literally everyone because he would need some wins to have a ranking in the first place. But he could stay in the top 100 by 'vulturing' challengers, and meet the 'big 4' in R1.
As to the second part, let's say he's a 'Gulbis' type. He has no real motivation to play tennis, unless it's against the top 4, where he plays out of his mind. But he'll always lack the commitment to do any better. Is he the fifth best player in the world?
In that case, he'd be the fifth best player in the world when taking tennis seriously. Of course it's hard to get any sympathy while showing such lack of commitment. But yes, it'd not be outrageous to claim that such player at his best was the fifth best player in the world, although not consistently of course.
Re: The reality is that del Potro is easily the fifth best tennis player in the world
Federer went on record saying Delpo would have been #1 in 2010 had he not been injured. The most he's ever said about Ferrer is that he has the best return in the world (a few years ago I think). I believe that shows how highly the big 4 think of Delpo.
Federer went on record saying Delpo would have been #1 in 2010 had he not been injured. The most he's ever said about Ferrer is that he has the best return in the world (a few years ago I think). I believe that shows how highly the big 4 think of Delpo.
Pretty much every one of the top players have given tremendous praised to Del Potro, not just the top 4. Djokovic claimed that facing Del Potro was like one of the top 4 from a mental point of view before their RG 2011 match, while Tsonga said Del Potro was on a higher level than him despite being ranked lower prior to their match in Marseille last year and that he'd have been top 3 if he had remained healthy.
Re: The reality is that del Potro is easily the fifth best tennis player in the world
the problem is that too many guys have expected so much from DP and he hasn't delivered. yes DP is capable of beating Nole, Fed and Rafa here and there but he hasn't won anything 'big' for a long time and he is too inconsistent.
Ferrer is an overachiever but good for him. Pics will never win a major but he 'works hard for his money'
Re: The reality is that del Potro is easily the fifth best tennis player in the world
Ferrer is not a better player than Delpo and to say so is ridiculous. Delpo is a major champion and a WTF finalist. Of course he hasn't done much since 2009 - he was off all of 2010 and then 2011 was his comeback year and he still did very well. 2012 was a very solid year with the AO, FO, and USO QF and beating Djokovic once and Federer twice.
Ferrer is not a better player than Delpo and to say so is ridiculous. Delpo is a major champion and a WTF finalist. Of course he hasn't done much since 2009 - he was off all of 2010 and then 2011 was his comeback year and he still did very well. 2012 was a very solid year with the AO, FO, and USO QF and beating Djokovic once and Federer twice.
so Djokovic has 4 Cincy finals too doesnt that count?Ferrer owns Delpo cant get any easier for you to understand than that.......Ferrer wins 9/10 against Delpo.........and Ferrer also has WTF in 2007 I think.......not that finals matter at all.........
Re: The reality is that del Potro is easily the fifth best tennis player in the world
I never brought up Cincinnati.....
Ferrer is a bad matchup for Delpo, doesn't mean he's a better player.
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