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  Topic Review (Newest First)
09-18-2017 04:08 AM
Dmitry Verdasco
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)



How did we lose that?
09-18-2017 03:01 AM
B.kelly123
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Only watched the first three sets of NK-Gordon, and NK doesn't deserve to be thought of too badly after that one - it was just one of those red lining performances for a player in his best surface. Bit surprised that JT couldn't mount more of a challenge against Darius, but it might have just been a mental thing - Belgium feeling like the underdogs on some kind of inspiration comeback.

There's always next year ....
09-17-2017 11:26 PM
Le Vautour
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

*sigh* Well that was disappointing.

Saw some of the Kyrgios match and Goffin was playing very well, so I can at least understand that result. But what the fuck was that Jordan?
09-17-2017 06:03 PM
Kateoz
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Sack Hewitt.
09-17-2017 01:34 AM
Kateoz
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TalkonTennis View Post
I have to say I'm with Le Vautour on this one - I really do think that Kokkinakis would have struggled to beat Goffin in a best of five setting. Best of three, I think Thanasi can handle, but he hasn't won a single best of five match in his comeback to date and I do think his body is still not quite right.

That doesn't mean Hewitt gets off the hook for the really nasty move of naming Thanasi, having him pose for all the team photos, go to the dinner, then yank the rug out from under him on the morning of the draw for incredibly weak and vague reasons. Totally unfair on Kokk and also a really bad situation for Millman, who did deserve a DC guernsey at some point in his career but not in these circumstances.

John did play very well against Goffin, but those four blown break points at 4-4 in the second set turned the match. Not for the first time, the lack of a real cutting edge in Millman's game cost him against a Top 20 player - he's not as much of a pusher as Thompson can be, he can strike some lovely inside in forehands and backhand winners, but first strike tennis isn't his thing and you often need that to cause upsets.

Belgium have bet hard on Goffin because the doubles combo of Bemelmans and De Greef was shown up badly by Peers and Thompson - not that they really have a doubles player of note to choose.

Not having Thommo as the other singles player is strange...we'll see what happens if the fifth rubber is live...
I think we are all agreed on Hewitt's outrageously bad handling of this.

It is certainly true that Kokkinakis hasn't quite fired in five setters as yet on his comeback, but he notably does rise to this kind of occasions and this might well have been third time lucky. He has certainly pulled off the unexpected wins in the dc context before. But we will never know now I guess.

Whoever played, it was always going to be an upset if they won, particularly on clay which is Goffin's surface, and so the issue is who had the best chance of pulling off an upset.

Belgium losing the doubles so easily wasn't an absolute given I think - although they went down to Italy in the querters, the managed a big upset in last year's relegation round vs Brazil (Melo-Suares).

All the same, odds were always that Belgium were going to be largely dependent on Goffin - both Bemelmans and Darcis are challenger level players at best.

They each have won a total of 5 grand slam matches in the course of their fairly long careers. Darcis is 33 and his two (250) singles titles were won a decade ago. Bemelmans is 29, and his 250 doubles title was won back in 2012 and has only spent about half a year in the top 100 in the course of his career (most of it this year).

Admittedly our boys have an advantage in terms of access to slam wcs, but Millman, despite his injury plagued career is a year younger than Bemelmans and has 7 gs wins to his name, much younger Thommo 3, younger still Kokk 4 (despite his nearly two years out).

The real match up in terms of experience are obviously Peers, with his GS title and finalist experience, and in terms of ranking, Kyrgios, with 27 GS match wins vs 26 year old Goffin's 52.
09-17-2017 01:14 AM
Le Vautour
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kateoz View Post
PS Assume Hewitt is assuming it will be a deadrubber...if it turns out to be live (ie Kyrgios loses his match), maybe he will do a rethink.
From the Herald Sun article I saw (am on my phone at the moment and for some reason it won't copy the link) there was a part where it said something along the lines of Hewitt saying it was highly unlikely he would turn to Thompson, that John played really well yesterday, and that they have all been putting in the work and feeling good with their bodies...

I can defend him putting Millman up against Goffin on day 1, but having John in a live fifth rubber instead of Jordan is unnecessarily risky and could backfire horribly. Hopefully Nick gets past Goffin though so this will wind up being a non-issue...
09-17-2017 12:51 AM
TalkonTennis
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Quote:
For me personally I didn't actually expect John to win, so the fact that he pinched a set, kept Goffin out there for over three hours and really made him work for the win is a relatively good outcome in my book (ignoring the fact that he blew a lead, however that was a lead I wasn't expecting him to have anyway). I honestly don't think Kokkinakis would have done much better given that US Open result and his constant injury struggles.
Quote:
Oh come on. Odds are Kokk could have at least pushed it to five. And given he made the finals of a 250 the week before and really pushed Nishikori on clay, good odds he would have done better than that.
I have to say I'm with Le Vautour on this one - I really do think that Kokkinakis would have struggled to beat Goffin in a best of five setting. Best of three, I think Thanasi can handle, but he hasn't won a single best of five match in his comeback to date and I do think his body is still not quite right.

That doesn't mean Hewitt gets off the hook for the really nasty move of naming Thanasi, having him pose for all the team photos, go to the dinner, then yank the rug out from under him on the morning of the draw for incredibly weak and vague reasons. Totally unfair on Kokk and also a really bad situation for Millman, who did deserve a DC guernsey at some point in his career but not in these circumstances.

John did play very well against Goffin, but those four blown break points at 4-4 in the second set turned the match. Not for the first time, the lack of a real cutting edge in Millman's game cost him against a Top 20 player - he's not as much of a pusher as Thompson can be, he can strike some lovely inside in forehands and backhand winners, but first strike tennis isn't his thing and you often need that to cause upsets.

Belgium have bet hard on Goffin because the doubles combo of Bemelmans and De Greef was shown up badly by Peers and Thompson - not that they really have a doubles player of note to choose.

Not having Thommo as the other singles player is strange...we'll see what happens if the fifth rubber is live...
09-17-2017 12:24 AM
Kateoz
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

PS Assume Hewitt is assuming it will be a deadrubber...if it turns out to be live (ie Kyrgios loses his match), maybe he will do a rethink.
09-17-2017 12:21 AM
Kateoz
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Vautour View Post
Easy win for John and Jordan last night

In a more concerning development, Hewitt has apparently confirmed that Millman will be playing in the reverse singles, which seems like utter madness to me when you have a fit & fresh Thompson that is playing well
Glad they got the win, would have been the end if they hadn't!

But yes, playing Millman for the reverse singles would indeed be utter madness, what earth is going on in that team/Hewitt's alleged brain.

Thompson is the higher ranked player, the better player on clay and can hardly be feeling drained by that doubles match.

Really wish they'd stuck with Masur as captain...and if they manage to lose this, then Hewitt should definitely get the sack.
09-16-2017 11:17 PM
Le Vautour
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Easy win for John and Jordan last night

In a more concerning development, Hewitt has apparently confirmed that Millman will be playing in the reverse singles, which seems like utter madness to me when you have a fit & fresh Thompson that is playing well
09-16-2017 02:52 AM
Kateoz
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Vautour View Post
For me personally I didn't actually expect John to win, so the fact that he pinched a set, kept Goffin out there for over three hours and really made him work for the win is a relatively good outcome in my book (ignoring the fact that he blew a lead, however that was a lead I wasn't expecting him to have anyway). I honestly don't think Kokkinakis would have done much better given that US Open result and his constant injury struggles. But I agree that our only non-Kyrgios shot of beating Goffin would've been Thompson.

Personally, I still think we will win 4-1 (3-2 if Kyrgios' body really fails him). In saying that though, I fully expect Jordan to step in for the reverse singles against Darcis or Bemelmans. I can see the logic of resting Jordan on Day 1, replacing Thanasi, and kind of throwing John out there as a bit of a sacrificial lamb that will extend the rallies to tire Goffin for the match against Nick. That way Hewitt a) keeps Jordan fresher, b) gives John a long-deserved debut, and c) ensures Thanasi doesn't pick up yet another unnecessary injury.

But yes, fingers crossed tonight goes well. That will take a lot of pressure off Nick for Day 3
Oh come on. Odds are Kokk could have at least pushed it to five. And given he made the finals of a 250 the week before and really pushed Nishikori on clay, good odds he would have done better than that.

I'm not sure I get your comments - Thanasi can't play at all as he isn't in the team. The only way of giving John his debut this time around and keep Kokkinakis in would be if you kicked out Peers which would be an even dumber thing to do.

If you mean the sensible thing would have been to play Thanasi instead on day 1, use Jordan or Kokk for the doubles depending on which pairing works best with Peers and how bodies holding up for the doubles but then sub in Jordan for reverse singles on day 3 if necessary then I agree.

I feel for Millman, he should have been selected instead of Groth and/or Hewitt several DC's ago, but this one really wan't the obvious time to put him in, unless Kokk really is in much worse form than we've seen of late. Can't help feeling its just a case of Hewitt feeling guilty and thinking this tie will indeed be 4-1 regardless, so share the love around.

I'm rather less confident of that, particularly given that Darcis took Nick to five sets. And concerned at the hit to Kokkinakis' morale on his comeback trail given that we will pretty much definitely need him for the final if we make it that far.
09-16-2017 01:50 AM
Le Vautour
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kateoz View Post
Sorry but a loss, particularly against an injured player when you really did have your chances is NOT a solid debut. Though in fairness, down to Hewitt not Millman, really should have gone for Thompson or Kokk for the singles.

I don't think we can depend on Nick to pull it off on day 3, pretty uneven from what I saw.

Australia is in trouble, and really really shouldn't be against injured Goffin.

Let's hope the doubles goes smoothly.
For me personally I didn't actually expect John to win, so the fact that he pinched a set, kept Goffin out there for over three hours and really made him work for the win is a relatively good outcome in my book (ignoring the fact that he blew a lead, however that was a lead I wasn't expecting him to have anyway). I honestly don't think Kokkinakis would have done much better given that US Open result and his constant injury struggles. But I agree that our only non-Kyrgios shot of beating Goffin would've been Thompson.

Personally, I still think we will win 4-1 (3-2 if Kyrgios' body really fails him). In saying that though, I fully expect Jordan to step in for the reverse singles against Darcis or Bemelmans. I can see the logic of resting Jordan on Day 1, replacing Thanasi, and kind of throwing John out there as a bit of a sacrificial lamb that will extend the rallies to tire Goffin for the match against Nick. That way Hewitt a) keeps Jordan fresher, b) gives John a long-deserved debut, and c) ensures Thanasi doesn't pick up yet another unnecessary injury.

But yes, fingers crossed tonight goes well. That will take a lot of pressure off Nick for Day 3
09-16-2017 12:37 AM
Kateoz
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Vautour View Post
4 set loss for John from a set and a break up and after also having his chances particularly late in the second set (if he had taken that set I reckon we probably would've been up 2-0, as I don't think an Goffin would've managed to come from 2 sets down with that knee issue). Still though, he kept an injured Goffin out there for 3 and a half hours, so hopefully that has some effect come Day 3. Solid debut

I didn't watch Nick's match, but judging from the score and what I've read it seems like he came through this time. Well done

As usual the doubles will be quite important here, but we really should win it imo. Fingers crossed...
Sorry but a loss, particularly against an injured player when you really did have your chances is NOT a solid debut. Though in fairness, down to Hewitt not Millman, really should have gone for Thompson or Kokk for the singles.

I don't think we can depend on Nick to pull it off on day 3, pretty uneven from what I saw.

Australia is in trouble, and really really shouldn't be against injured Goffin.

Let's hope the doubles goes smoothly.
09-16-2017 12:29 AM
Le Vautour
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

4 set loss for John from a set and a break up and after also having his chances particularly late in the second set (if he had taken that set I reckon we probably would've been up 2-0, as I don't think an Goffin would've managed to come from 2 sets down with that knee issue). Still though, he kept an injured Goffin out there for 3 and a half hours, so hopefully that has some effect come Day 3. Solid debut

I didn't watch Nick's match, but judging from the score and what I've read it seems like he came through this time. Well done

As usual the doubles will be quite important here, but we really should win it imo. Fingers crossed...
09-15-2017 09:42 AM
Kateoz
Re: The Everything Davis Cup Thread (News, Articles, Live Scores)

PS

Millman's record at tour level on clay: 0-3. Defeated Kavcic, ranked 75, Aix ch in 2015.
Thompson: 3-4. Best result on clay:Best result on clay: defeated Paire, ranked 45.
Kokkinakis: 2-5. Best result on clay - RG r3, defeated by Djokovic.

On the face of it putting Millman up against Goffin is madness, typical Hewitt misjudgment. If Kokkinakis isn't up to it, or didn't jell as a team with Peers, Jordan would surely be the better bet against Goffin, and if he's needed for the doubles, sub Millman in if necessary for the last rubber.

But let's hope the DC atmosphere works its magic and John pulls it off nonetheless.
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