Maimi 2nd round: Pavel def. Hewitt 6-4, 7-5 [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Maimi 2nd round: Pavel def. Hewitt 6-4, 7-5

Leo
03-28-2004, 06:59 PM
:eek:

Hewitt started out the year in excellent form, losing just one match in his first three tournaments to a smoking Roger Federer. But now he is struggling with his form, it seems. In Indian Wells it was Chela early on, and now Pavel (who did play very well today, btw, with tons of winners). And remember he lost early in his last two Masters Series events in the U.S. in 2003. Hewitt used to play tremendously well in the states, so what's happened to change that? And what does he need to do to step it up in the major events, because his success in them the past year has been minimal?

Leo
03-28-2004, 07:06 PM
Looking at the stats, the key to the match was break point conversinos (well, duh) and also 2nd serve percentages. Pavel won 54% of his second serve points while Hewitt was only at 29%. And since Hewitt was only getting 56% of his first serves in, the second serve points became a major problem for him. Hewitt needs a real coach, I think, to help him with that serve. And fast.

naiwen
03-28-2004, 07:15 PM
3rd round?

Havok
03-28-2004, 07:25 PM
Hewitt started the year off well, beating a bunch of inferior players;) I think Lleyton needs a serious reality check and needs to get his game back to where it was, he seems to have lost it :scared:

Deboogle!.
03-28-2004, 07:43 PM
Ferrero's an inferior player??

star
03-28-2004, 07:48 PM
Also Henman. :)

Havok
03-28-2004, 07:50 PM
he owns henman so:yawn: and ok i'll give him Ferrero

Billabong
03-28-2004, 07:58 PM
Lleyton :sad:!

Yonge
03-28-2004, 08:17 PM
I like both of these players, but I'm happier for Andrei than I am sad for Lleyton.

:yeah: Andrei!!!

Grafiati
03-28-2004, 08:49 PM
GREAT job Pavel! I knew he could come back and play well after injry!

Frooty_Bazooty
03-28-2004, 08:54 PM
shame Lleyton lost but Andrei really cool so I dont mind too much. Good luck agasint Melzer(hopefully) in the next round Andrei :yeah:

WyveN
03-28-2004, 09:02 PM
WOW!!!!!!!!!
ABSOLUTELY INCREDIBLE........UPSET OF THE YEAR SO FAR!

Deboogle!.
03-28-2004, 09:07 PM
I sense a bit of sarcasm there, Wyver? ;)

Leo
03-28-2004, 09:07 PM
WOW!!!!!!!!!
ABSOLUTELY INCREDIBLE........UPSET OF THE YEAR SO FAR!

Can I slap you? Multiple times? :devil:

WyveN
03-28-2004, 09:16 PM
:eek:

Hewitt started out the year in excellent form, losing just one match in his first three tournaments to a smoking Roger Federer. But now he is struggling with his form, it seems.

His struggling with his form in big tournaments.


In Indian Wells it was Chela early on, and now Pavel (who did play very well today, btw, with tons of winners).


Pavel has virtually beaten everyone except Federer this year, I expected him to win this one.


And remember he lost early in his last two Masters Series events in the U.S. in 2003. Hewitt used to play tremendously well in the states, so what's happened to change that? And what does he need to do to step it up in the major events, because his success in them the past year has been minimal?

I know you will still disagree with me but the reason Hewitt is struggling is because no one underestimates him anymore. I watched some tapes of him from back in 2001/2002 and I don't see a drop in the level of Hewitt's play, in fact he is now more aggressive so arguably even better.

Surely the fact that he is doing well in small tournaments but struggling in the big ones suggests that this is not a slump!

So why is he losing?
1) Back 2 years ago the players were certainly not taking advantage of Hewitt's weaknesses that more and more seem to have figured out now that Hewitt has been on the tour a bit longer. That is a relatively weak serve and a backhand that goes crosscourt 90% of the time.

2) When a Wimbledon champion loses in the first round to a qualifier........that is HUGE. The invincibility of the champ is gone and a lot of guys think "If Ivo can do it, why can't I?".

3) With Hewitt's type of game you need to be at 100%, it is simply not a gamestyle where you can be off your game by even a fraction and still be up there with the top guys. This is why Hewitt is a terrific Davis Cup player, the format of only 2 matches + all the hype means he is really motivated and usually produces his peak tennis, this is far harder to produce over 2 weeks in a slam or even in a masters series.

WyveN
03-28-2004, 09:17 PM
Can I slap you? Multiple times? :devil:

It was just a joke, I do await the day when early Hewitt losses don't lead to a new thread in GM but probably wont happen this year ;)

J. Corwin
03-28-2004, 09:30 PM
Good points WyveN and I agree.

Everytime I see Hewitt I pretty much know where his shots are going, especially with his backhand. It's probably even 95%+ crosscourt. And when his opponent goes down the line with his backhand, Hewitt will run and hit his forehand crosscourt. It's the same with Agassi's style, but Agassi tends to be more aggressive with his groundstrokes and actually goes down the line more with his own backhand. Agassi also is a lot more aggressive on his returns instead of merely putting it back in play a la Hewitt.

Tennis Fool
03-28-2004, 09:39 PM
So why is he losing?
1) Back 2 years ago the players were certainly not taking advantage of Hewitt's weaknesses that more and more seem to have figured out now that Hewitt has been on the tour a bit longer. That is a relatively weak serve and a backhand that goes crosscourt 90% of the time.

2) When a Wimbledon champion loses in the first round to a qualifier........that is HUGE. The invincibility of the champ is gone and a lot of guys think "If Ivo can do it, why can't I?".

3) With Hewitt's type of game you need to be at 100%, it is simply not a gamestyle where you can be off your game by even a fraction and still be up there with the top guys. This is why Hewitt is a terrific Davis Cup player, the format of only 2 matches + all the hype means he is really motivated and usually produces his peak tennis, this is far harder to produce over 2 weeks in a slam or even in a masters series.

So you're saying that Hewitt is the Martina Hingis of the ATP tour, LOL.

I still think it's because of conditioning.

WyveN
03-28-2004, 09:43 PM
No more like the Courier of this generation.

Tennis Fool
03-28-2004, 09:48 PM
LOL, Courier is one of my all-timers, but I don't remember how his game was conquered. I'm assuming he didn't get worse, but others got better? Sounds a bit like McEnroe...

Tennis Fool
03-28-2004, 09:51 PM
This is a good question: If 1995 Pete were playing now, would his game be conquered? I think so, Hewitt, Federer and Safin, and even maybe the Pavels and Younes would give him a run for his money regularly.

TennisLurker
03-28-2004, 10:28 PM
Good points WyveN and I agree.

Everytime I see Hewitt I pretty much know where his shots are going, especially with his backhand. It's probably even 95%+ crosscourt. And when his opponent goes down the line with his backhand, Hewitt will run and hit his forehand crosscourt. It's the same with Agassi's style, but Agassi tends to be more aggressive with his groundstrokes and actually goes down the line more with his own backhand. Agassi also is a lot more aggressive on his returns instead of merely putting it back in play a la Hewitt.

I think Hewitt plays more like michael chang, and I believe hewitt returns serve better than Agassi, he doesnt get aced as much as Agassi, he gets more balls back.

WyveN
03-28-2004, 10:46 PM
I think Hewitt plays more like michael chang, and I believe hewitt returns serve better than Agassi, he doesnt get aced as much as Agassi, he gets more balls back.

returns serve better then Agassi at 33?

TennisLurker
03-28-2004, 10:51 PM
returns serve better then Agassi at 33?

Sorry, I dont understand your point.

I believe nowadays hewitt returns serve better than Agassi, if that is what you mean.

WyveN
03-28-2004, 10:56 PM
ok, that is probably true but in earlier years Agassi returned serve far better then Hewitt is now.
Even now it is arguable. Yes Hewitt gets more balls into play but Agassi is more frequent at blasting a cold winner right off the return of serve.

J. Corwin
03-28-2004, 10:58 PM
Hewitt gets more balls back, but Agassi punishes you more with the return. IMO.

TennisLurker
03-28-2004, 11:10 PM
I believe that nowadays the serves are so big that you cant be as agressive as in the past, Federer or Henman are considered great returners now and they are not very agressive with their returns (I know Henman sometimes rushes to the net behind his return, but his return is just a deep slice), they just get a lot of balls back, they chop the ball back.
I believe a guy who gets a lot of balls back, like hewitt , henman or federer, has a better chance of beating a guy like roddick than a guy who tries to be agressive with his return the few times he gets his racquet on his opponent's serve.

COMA
03-28-2004, 11:10 PM
LLeyton :eek:
Men's tennis is surprising, isn't it?

TennisLurker
03-28-2004, 11:14 PM
For example, in his match against Federer, agassi had a lot of breakpoints on Federer's serve, and Federer couldnt get his first serve in. (winning that game would have allowed agassi to serve for match)
But Andre, instead of trying to get the second serve in play, he tried to hit winners of Federer's second serve, and he netted his return of federer's second serve three times.

I believe sometimes it is just better to get the ball in play.

Action Jackson
03-28-2004, 11:21 PM
I would think Hewitt is more like Michael Chang than Agassi in the way they play, and now as Wyver said the players aren't as scared of him as before. It will be interesting to see how he compensates once he loses some of his speed.

TennisLurker
03-28-2004, 11:28 PM
Chang was 26 years old when he lost his speed, but that was due to overtraining, not age IMO.
He thought (Ive lost 3 grand slam finals, to muster, to becker and to sampras, Ive to do something if I want to be number 1) so he believed that getting stronger would solve his problems.

That didnt solve his problem, because of overtraining he lost his speed, and in half a year he went from being a guy who had been in the top 5 for half a decade to someone ranked out of the top 20.

denim
03-28-2004, 11:43 PM
Hewiitt went off the boil a while before his wimbledon 2003 exit to karlovic in 1st round, he used to have huge belief in himself, a drive to turn match around and when he started losing matches to lesser players, they realised he's beatable and dont show him as much respect now when they play him.

Hewitt definetely has to go back to the drawing board if hes gonna win another slam.

He depends on heart and desire to turn a match around and that hasnt been working for a long time now.

Chloe le Bopper
03-29-2004, 12:26 AM
he owns henman so:yawn: and ok i'll give him Ferrero
Him beating Ferrero wasn't exactly a big surprise. For one thing, Ferrero had been taken to a third set tie by 2 or 3 of his opponents leading up to the final... which left one wondering how he was playing out there. For another thing, check their head to head. Ferrero always loses to Hewitt in these small, unimportant tournaments ;) (alright, and the Masters Cup). Seriously though, a lot of their matches have been very close. The head to head is 5-3 Hewitt, but there is absolutely no ownage going on there. Hewitt wins more of the matches because he's a better competitor than the Plonker ;)

Denise
03-29-2004, 01:18 AM
well done Pavel!! u saved the week... :lol:

Yonge
03-29-2004, 01:21 AM
GREAT job Pavel! I knew he could come back and play well after injry!

Welcome to MTF, Grafiati.

Alan
03-29-2004, 01:31 PM
he owns henman so:yawn: and ok i'll give him Ferrero

Ferrero an inferior player? that kinda bothers me... lleyton lost to ferrero at the USO last year... that makes me feel much better now...

GO PAVEL! :D