Why men's tennis is behind women's. [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Why men's tennis is behind women's.

CanadianBoy18
02-01-2004, 01:17 AM
This is not bashing men's tennis, it is merely stating the truth which most would agree with. I like watching men's tennis, the level is obviously higher, especially this year at the AO, the women looked like juniors. But what is missing from the men's tour is someone who can dominate for a while. 'Anybody can win' does not seem to draw fans in. The top 15 has a reasonable chance of getting very far at the tourny or winningit. How fun is being a fan then. If you want to say 'I'm a tennis fan, not a player fan', fine, it sucks still because if you are JUST a tennis fan u wouldn't mind watching ta[e matches of a great match over and over and over. It is much more interesting when u kind of have a strong desire of a stronger player winning.
On the women's tour the Williams sisters and the Belgians have a lot of fans because they win and if u love a player u 'hate'(or dislike) their opponent. A Serena vs. Justine match, everyone looks forward to, because they are the top women, as well no one wouldn't mind Venus vs. Kim.

That is my opinion.
and I hope the winner in today's final goes victorious in at least one more slam.

What do u think?

Tennis Fool
02-01-2004, 01:21 AM
I think this is changing. The Fab 5 (Marat, Andre, Andy, JC and Roger) have been dominating the last year.

Havok
02-01-2004, 01:22 AM
Marat was dominating in 2003??? since when?

Tennis Fool
02-01-2004, 01:27 AM
I mean, put him into the mix of the last year AO 2003-AO 2004

Ma. Estefania
02-01-2004, 01:28 AM
Well, as you said CanadianBoy, this is an issue that has been discussed for a long time already...

Anyway I keep on with my answer, I think that men's tennis is no way behind women's one at least in quality.

I know rivalries would spice up things, get more attention, etc....but I don't know, I like it so far like it is, you know, anybody can win; though of course, as everyone I also would like my fave ones to dominate.

Shy
02-01-2004, 01:31 AM
Sport is about competition , not domination.

Havok
02-01-2004, 01:35 AM
ok my opinion:
tennis is the most popular sport in all the other sports played by women. now for the sports played by men, tennis is nowhere near the top of the list as the most popular/favorite sport. this is why we keep on hearing that women's tennis is more superior to men's tennis, when i'm sure it really isnt anyways

decemberlove
02-01-2004, 01:36 AM
mens tennis behind womens?

i think what makes mens tennis so exciting is the fact that anyone can win.

womens tennis gets so boring with the same people always in the final.

WyverN
02-01-2004, 01:46 AM
The men's game is certainly ahead of womens at the moment. The mens game was in a bit of a dark period in 2001/2002 but it is back in full swing with the new generation taking over.

Womens tennis? probably wouldnt be worth watching without Henin

Bubble
02-01-2004, 01:55 AM
Domination?

Meaning you prefer to watch blow-out one-sided semi-finals and finals rather than a closely contested ones? :rolleyes:

The men's AO has gotten off to a great start this year. If asked to quote a best match in the AO this year, majority of the best matches are from the men's side.

TheBoiledEgg
02-01-2004, 02:13 AM
"men's tennis is behind women's"
probably in Canada :tape:

you got to be kidding right :o

star
02-01-2004, 02:17 AM
There is no comparison between the women and the men. The men's product is simply better. There are some women who I like to see play, but I would never buy tickets to a small WTA tournament, but I would to a small ATP tournament.

CanadianBoy18
02-01-2004, 02:30 AM
I thought their would definitely be people agreeing with me, because who would like their fave winning one week and then going half a year without winning another event.



"men's tennis is behind women's"
probably in Canada :tape:

you got to be kidding right :o

There is no difference here in Canadian tennis. Both male and female tennis players suck. :lol: I gave the #4 junior player in Canada a couple years ago a run for his money, and trust me, he was nothing spectacular.
Tennis players in Russia are only successful because of the money that tennis has to offer. I know it's bad to say, nevertheless it is a fact, if Russia wasn't so backward and primitive, you wouldn't see many players coming out there. Here in Canada if you don't have an education you are nothing, in Russia they barely offer education :tape: . So it only makes sense that here in Canada people concentrate on their academics, and in Russia on their short tennis careers.

Deboogle!.
02-01-2004, 02:34 AM
I thought their would definitely be people agreeing with me, because who would like their fave winning one week and then going half a year without winning another event.



Most of us have more than one fave :)

I'm with the majority here... me's tennis behind women's tennis?? Not a chance.

Chloe le Bopper
02-01-2004, 02:38 AM
Please ignore his thoughts on Canada :rolleyes:

TennisLurker
02-01-2004, 02:44 AM
Men tennis is not behind women tennis.

tennisvideos
02-01-2004, 02:50 AM
The mens tour is far more exciting than the womens tour at the moment. And it's even more exciting because no one is dominating IMO. There are so many great players who can win the slams and that makes it very interesting and appealing.

WyverN
02-01-2004, 03:07 AM
Please ignore his thoughts on Canada :rolleyes:

what about his thoughts on Russia?
I am not sure which ones are more idiotic

star
02-01-2004, 03:18 AM
Tennis players in Russia are only successful because of the money that tennis has to offer. I know it's bad to say, nevertheless it is a fact, if Russia wasn't so backward and primitive, you wouldn't see many players coming out there. Here in Canada if you don't have an education you are nothing, in Russia they barely offer education :tape: . So it only makes sense that here in Canada people concentrate on their academics, and in Russia on their short tennis careers.

:eek:

*~ The Leopard ~*
02-01-2004, 03:20 AM
I think men's tennis is intrinsically more exciting, more competitive, and of higher quality. It's great that anyone can be upset on a given day and that there are a lot of players with a chance of winning any given tournament.

There is a soap opera quality to the women's tour which I find appealing, lots of great and very distinct personalities. Some of the guys have great personalities, too, but they are less accessible to the public for some reason.

It'd be nice if we knew more about the personalities of the guys (not just obvious characters such as Safin and Agassi) . It'd also be nice if some of the other women could really challenge the Willies and the Belgians (at the AO Lindsay fluffed it yet again, against Justine, while Amelie - who looked like she just might be able to do it the way she was playing - never even got the chance because she got injured).

Leo
02-01-2004, 03:31 AM
Men's tennis doesn't need or want one person dominating. There are clearly 7 or 8 players right now who are above the rest and it'll be fun to see those guys battle it out for Major titles andf the #1 ranking over the next year.

Women's tennis is boring.

Case closed.

Chloe le Bopper
02-01-2004, 04:54 AM
what about his thoughts on Russia?
I am not sure which ones are more idiotic
Ignore both, of course. I just mean - please don't bash Canada in retaliation to his ridiculous comments ;)

CanadianBoy18
02-01-2004, 05:53 AM
oh please Rebecca.
Find one sentence where my statement was not true. Maybe you should study more about Russian history as well as the present situation.
I don't think Canada is the best, I mean we have a 30% or something like that obesity rate :lol:, but TheBoiledEgg raises Russia to illusionary levels. I usually comment on his great insight to the game and his knowledge of the game is to be respected, but not his occasional bias.
My 'idiotic' and 'ridiculous' comments are nothing from your empty blabber that goes in and out simultaneously.
I guess it's wrong to argue facts in a men's tennis forum whatever the case is.

star
02-01-2004, 06:08 AM
Argue facts then.

Look at the unforced error rate among the women.

Look at the lack of depth.

Look at the lack of variety in the games of most of the top players.

The women were better at putting together a show for the public, but that was only momentary. The men's game has now has the buzz and excitement that the women had a couple of years ago.

Fee
02-01-2004, 06:20 AM
The premise of this thread is entirely false. Men's tennis has been much more interesting for the past 12 months and men's tournaments regularly outsell women's tournaments. 2004 is going to be one of the best tennis seasons ever with Fed, JCF, Marat, Coria, Bandy, Hewitt, Flip, Andy, and others fighting with each other week after week, from the first round on. And what will the women offer us? The chance to see if Hantuchova ate a meal this week? If I want a soap opera, I can watch All My Children.

CanadianBoy18
02-01-2004, 06:27 AM
I wonder what the repsonse would be if I posted in Wta message board :lol:
Maybe I posted this too soon. The AO has truly been the men's event. The women's skills were not really shown off.
However, when Monica, Jennifer, Venus, Serena, Amelie, Anna, Lindsay, Kim and Justine play the same tournaments, it will easily surpass the men's. And this should happen soon.
Remember that Agassi is retiring soon, and this means women will get shown more often ;) .

Either way, the AO sucked FOR ME. Tennis is not the same with all the injuries.

tangerine_dream
02-01-2004, 06:28 AM
This is a joke, right? Men's tennis behind women's? :haha: Only if you prefer mediocre, error-prone, bore-fests over exicitng, compelling, competitive matches, if you ask me.

Men's tennis is in a transitional period right now. The Sampras-Agassi era is finally coming to an end and the new balls ("the Fab Five" as TF appropriately calls them :) ) are just starting to take over. 2003 was their breakout year where they dominated the slams and masters. Now that they've arrived and the WTA struggling to put the broken Williams' sisters back together again, the men will likely dominate tennis for years to come. :)

Chloe le Bopper
02-01-2004, 06:31 AM
I wonder what the repsonse would be if I posted in Wta message board :lol:
Maybe I posted this too soon. The AO has truly been the men's event. The women's skills were not really shown off.
However, when Monica, Jennifer, Venus, Serena, Amelie, Anna, Lindsay, Kim and Justine play the same tournaments, it will easily surpass the men's. And this should happen soon.
Remember that Agassi is retiring soon, and this means women will get shown more often ;) .

Either way, the AO sucked FOR ME. Tennis is not the same with all the injuries.
This has been written on a wta messageboard. What the poster got was a ton of responses from people who know absolutely nothing about mens tennis, talking about how the wta rules. Not only that, but they were sure to weigh in about how mens tennis is "all about serve", the players have "no personality", and a number of other glaring misconceptions.

If you want the opinion of people who don't even watch mens tennis... then yes, go to wtaworld and ask ;)

JeLuliA88
02-01-2004, 06:38 AM
Well, it's always more exciting to watch a close contest than a complete one sided match....2003 have been quite competitive, and a year that has produced quite a few rivalries, which is quite good for men's tennis. None of the men really dominated the way that Henin-Hardenne and Clijsters did... each grand slam was won by a different player. i think 2004 will be even more competitive than last year with the likes of Nalbandian and Coria really challenging the top 4... especially with Coria becoming more of a force on clay and challenging Ferrero's domination on clay.

Lee
02-01-2004, 06:52 AM
A little fact here:

Scottsdale used to have men's and women's tournament in late Feb (women) and early March(men). As TMS Indian Wells expanded to a 2 weeks event, the tournament site here can't hold both men and women in the same week, guess which one was dumped. Yes, women's tournament is gone now.

oxy
02-01-2004, 01:00 PM
men's tennis is certainly not behind women's tennis...in men's tennis, we will probably see 4 different GS winners in a year(unlike 4xserena or 3xjustine), probably see 2 different finalists in all 4 GS in a year (unlike williams final or belgian final), more upsets by unseeded player (karlovic over hewitt), lesser 6-0, 6-1 scorelines, more winners less unforced errors n many more other reasons....in other words...men's tennis is better!!!

Conchon
02-01-2004, 01:10 PM
Domination reduces competition, thus reducing the level of entertainment on the men's tour. The WTA is much too predictable. Before, it was the Williams sisters. Now, the Belgians. And more often than not, with the same winners.

Experimentee
02-01-2004, 01:41 PM
At the moment, for this tournament, i think mens tennis was better because all the top players were playing well and not getting upset, and then finally meeting each other in the QF or SF. That produced great matches like Safin-Roddick, Safin-Agassi, Nalbandian-Federer, etc.
So I like it when about 4 or 5 players dominate, then get to the latter stages and play each other, developing rivalries, not when a surprise semifinalist comes up and gets thrashed by the favourite, like what happened with Zuluaga and Schnyder.

But what happened at this tournament was an exception, normally in the WTA its the top players going through to play each other and on the ATP the top players dont survive the early rounds. I think mens tennis would be more exciting if the top players played each other more often, and a certain degree of domination has to occur for that to happen.
But having said that I enjoy both mens and womens tennis and wouldnt say either one is above the other, they both have their strong points and weak points.

Ace Tracker
02-01-2004, 06:32 PM
the premise that women's tennis is more popular than men's is a flawed one that gained strenght on the insane writings of General Messages of WTA World board... I am not even going to start discussing about the difference in quality of the product being offered, which is beyond any argumentative doubt and is really not the point raised by Canadianboy18, but let's try to see tennis under the US TV lenses... Apparently, the WTA offers a more attractive product timelenght-wise, matches are shorter, clothing sexier and most importantly, there is an almost assured American presence in the latter rounds... but as the USTA and ATP came to know ever so painstakingly, celebrating a particular player and his/her personality and nationality over the game itself, represents an easy and fast cash-out that lasts only while that player's career continues... men's tennis was in a critical situation when the USTA realized too late that the Agassi-Sampras axle was not gonna last forever...

Remember that we are talking here only about the US experience, and to further enhance the importance of an American presence in the finals for TV viewership, please notice that a Venus-Serena Grand Slam finals averages twice as much ratings as an all Belgian one... considering that the venues are the same and the product (an all-Williams or an all-Belgian) very similar, one can easily assess the heavy promotion the WTA makes on personality in detriment of the game itself... that a board like WTA World thrives with so many more members is not proof that women's tennis is more popular than men's... it's become more and more evident that what separates the core fan base of both Tours is the loyalty to the game as opposed to names... WTA World is permeated with die-hard fans that idolize their favourites to the point of calling them Goddess, Queen and other surnames you won't find among their male peers... roughly 80% of the WTA World posters are casual fans that were drawn to the game because of a particular player... Casual fans make for sometimes entertaining cyber arguments, an online terror-like loyalty to their favs, and a temporary boost in TV ratings, but they are not expected to stick around once their favs retire or do not deliver the titles or results... that's the dilemma the WTA is facing right now, the constant absence of the Williams sisters, Capriati, Seles and Davenport is starting to hurt American TV ratings...

The ATP also suffers from the same problem, but its product is fundamentally better or of higher quality, which allowed it to maintain the core of the die-hard game fans... These fans are the ones crowding the ATP tournaments and are the ones who will watch a match on TV even if it is scheduled for 2:00 AM... It is revealing that the most attended WTA tournaments are the ones that are hosted jointly with the ATP...It's been already said by another poster that ATP tournaments usually outsells its WTA counterparts... Hard core tennis fans also have a higher income and education average, making them an extremelly attractive market for advertising; that's why the ATP has usually an easier time attracting sponsors... Once you have this hard core tennis fans database built, it's easier to attract the casual fans to the game with advertising and other marketing ploys...

It's also important to remember that this so-called men's tennis popularity struggle is a phenomenon of extreme geographical limitations... It is basically North-American (but Mexican) in its nature, and maybe Belgian, for obvious reasons... Men's tennis is thriving everywhere else... Mary Carrilo said during the Agassi-Paradorn match-up that roughly 60% of Thailand was watching this game... Guga has made tennis the third most popular sport in Brazil... the same can be said about Lapentti in Ecuador... how about the popularity that Hewitt and Mark enjoy in Australia? or *gasp* :eek: Tim in England during Wimbledon? that men's tennis has become world-wide popular has not escaped the ATP's management eyes, who have held the final Tennis Master Series Championships in new emerging markets like Portugal and China, always to sell-out crowds (as opposed to L.A.)... that they are now being hosted for consecutive times in Houston, demonstrate that the ATP feels confident enough to start marketing its product in the US more strongly...

Ma. Estefania
02-01-2004, 08:34 PM
Tennis players in Russia are only successful because of the money that tennis has to offer. I know it's bad to say, nevertheless it is a fact, if Russia wasn't so backward and primitive, you wouldn't see many players coming out there. Here in Canada if you don't have an education you are nothing, in Russia they barely offer education :tape: . So it only makes sense that here in Canada people concentrate on their academics, and in Russia on their short tennis careers.

Ok, fool :rolleyes:

At least at another countries (called "Russia" by you this time) they have top players, who really fight for getting better, and not staying behind; they have advanced basing on their efforts, things aren't easy for them. I think that players from countries that aren't that rich have even more desire and maybe more probabilities of reaching the top place, because they have fought since the beginning of their careers. Ex: Argentina.

While on the richest countries, (ok, there are great exceptions too, ex: Roger, etc. ) the tennis players have almost done, you know, they have more opportunites of travelling to compete since being very young, etc....and with the time, they lose their interest on the sport. By example: England....since Henman, there's no other "prospect" for Wimbledon. :o

tangerine_dream
02-02-2004, 05:16 PM
McEnroe excited about current crop of top men's players

02.03.2004

Tennis great John McEnroe believes the crop of young players in the sport is ready to bring about new rivalries unheralded in the game.

McEnroe, who is remembered for his epic matches with Bjorn Borg and Jimmy Connors, said the sport was on an "upswing" with the clutch of athletes now playing.

New Australian Open champion Roger Federer has McEnroe, who was in Christchurch last night for an exhibition match against Australian Pat Cash, excited about the future of the game, and with more than half-a-dozen true challengers for grand slam titles, the rivalries on court will develop.

"It's a good time for tennis," McEnroe said. "Federer may be the greatest talent I've ever seen step on a tennis court. I see him winning a lot of majors."

He said there was a group of players peaking and playing their best tennis now.

"You could say Federer is the most talented, you could say [Andy] Roddick has the most powerful serve and you could say [Marat] Safin is the best looking ... along with very powerful," McEnroe said.

"Lleyton [Hewitt] is really trying to fight back and [Juan Carlos] Ferrero is tougher, even on the slower court. Then there's Andre [Agassi], and as long as he keeps playing, he brings out the best in these other guys.

"It's great for the sport."

But he warned the game must be marketed for more than just the on-court action.

"I think there is a real opportunity to show our sport in a much better light.

"A one-on-one sport relies on personality, individuality and rivalries," he said. "I'm hoping the Federer v Roddick [rivalry] grows and Safin stays in the mix. That's important."

Cash agreed the men's game was riding a wave of success, with the sport's "young guns" stepping up to the mark.

"It's a fantastic situation we have in the men's game at the moment.

"At the beginning of the Australian Open I would have picked half-a-dozen players to win the tournament.

"It just goes to show how much depth there is now, even compared to a couple of years ago."

Cash, who like McEnroe has turned to television commentary, said tennis fans were spoiled with the likes of Federer gracing the court.

"Federer is one heck of a player. He's got it physically and he's got one of the great eyes in hand-eye co-ordination that I've seen.

"We're very spoiled. We've seen one great go away in Pete Sampras and now we've got another player of very similar style come in."

Cash and McEnroe play on the seniors tour and still meet on occasions on court.

McEnroe said that while the modern game was enjoying a purple patch, he was grateful he played in an era that included Bjorg, Connors, Pete Sampras, Ivan Lendl and Boris Becker.

"I feel like it was the greatest time to come into our sport. It seemed to be exploding around the world," he said.

"There was a cast of characters and personality that made it all the more exciting to try to jump in and try to make my own mark.

"I wouldn't take it back."

Both will play another exhibition match in Auckland tonight before McEnroe heads back to the US and Cash home to Australia.

amethyst
02-02-2004, 05:29 PM
What´s the matter with McEnroe and Cash? Are they ill or have they been brainwashed? ;) I have never heard them admit that tennis can be exciting although themselves have left.

*~ The Leopard ~*
02-03-2004, 12:06 AM
What do people here make of the claim that 60% of the "work" at Wimbledon in recent years was done by the women - measured in balls hit presumbly, and based on the fact that the women have longer rallies?

It sounds like an impressive statistic, if it can be backed up, but it might also suggest that women's tennis is more boring with all the rallies that go back and forth forever until an UE eventuates.

However, I find it hard to believe that it's true because anyone who has actually been to a big tournament knows that men's 5-set matches are typically almost twice as long as women's 3-set matches, and I can't believe that the men are wasting so much time between points that they produce only, say, 25 shots in the time in which the women produce 60 shots.

AgassiFan
02-03-2004, 04:27 AM
This is not bashing men's tennis, it is merely stating the truth which most would agree with.

Bullsh*t. Most people I know LOVE men's tennis at least as much as WTA. I am bored to tears watching women's tennis-- and I do mostly because I find Serena, Jenifer and Justine strangely f*ckable.

I like watching men's tennis, the level is obviously higher, especially this year at the AO, the women looked like juniors.

Now you're talking!

But what is missing from the men's tour is someone who can dominate for a while. 'Anybody can win' does not seem to draw fans in

That's because most people are CASUAL tennis fans who want to have a HERO they can fullfill their fantasies VICARIOUSLY through. When there is parity, than there isn't a "winner" they can attach themselves to. Obviously.

The same problem plagues the NFL (of course it's not a huge problem because footballl is much more popular)--- people don't like that different teams win the Superbowl-- they want to see DYNASTIES.

Again.....in the last 4 years not only did fans of Men's tennis get a chance to enjoy Pete and Andre, but also Rafter, Guga, Marat, Leyton and the emergence of Federer, Ferrero, Andy and Nbhaldian/

Enjoy while it lasts because in 10 years you'll have 6'5'' robots play Serveball all day long.

AgassiFan
02-03-2004, 04:35 AM
Domination reduces competition, thus reducing the level of entertainment on the men's tour. The WTA is much too predictable. Before, it was the Williams sisters
When I was a kid (I'll be 20), I remember women's scores and it was pitiful: you had Monica Seles, Arantha Sanchez and Steffi Graff literally winning 6-0, 6-1-type mathes all the way to the semis/finals.

I enjoyed Steffi and Monica go at it, of course, but those routes on the way to the FINAL were BOOOOORRRRRRIIIIIIINNNNNNGGGGGGGG.

AgassiFan
02-03-2004, 05:03 AM
Tennis players in Russia are only successful because of the money that tennis has to offer. I know it's bad to say, nevertheless it is a fact, if Russia wasn't so backward and primitive, you wouldn't see many players coming out there. Here in Canada if you don't have an education you are nothing, in Russia they barely offer education
Hey, moron, what the hell are you blathering on about, huh?!

I am from Russia and what you're saying here is utter, worthless GARBAGE.

I am not college-educated and English is my THIRD language.....and yet you consider me primitive? Talk about ignorance and victim of isolationism.....Wow. Just wow.

Russia may be a relatively poor country......but it's remarkably literate and culturally second to none. None. You know those dumbass Klitchco brothers? They are world-class boxers and boxers are stupid, right? Well, they EACH speak 4 languages and are writing their dissertations on their free time in TWO different fields.....

Why do Russians love tennis and all resorts and soccer stadiums have adjacent tennis courts, clay, grass and hard surface? Because it's a BEAUTIFUL, GRACEFUL and yet athletically CHALLENGING (as opposed to chess or golf) game, that's why......NOT because we are a primitive money-grubbing people.

El Bastardo!

PS: I hope this CanadianBoy doesn't represent the level of discourse on this site, because if he does, I am OUTTA here.

William Hunt
02-03-2004, 05:03 AM
I think what makes mens tennis so exciting is the fact that anyone can win.

womens tennis gets so boring with the same people always in the final.

Exactly. It would be so much better for female tennis if more players would win tournaments. This dominance of a couple of players is really bad for the sport. Although I am a huge WTA fan I will be the first to admit that ATP tennis is much more competitive and more interesting than tha WTA events.

*~ The Leopard ~*
02-03-2004, 05:03 AM
I've gotta say, though, that it's a huge relief having a big powerful, non-American with a great personality, who was missing from the mix back there for a while, getting to another grand slam final. Men's tennis wasn't the same without Marat. The mix is now just GREAT.

I actually think that there's a lot to like about women's tennis as well, but it does need one or two sensational players with amazing personalities to grab it by the throat and challenge Juju and Kimmie (and Serena and Venus when Serena is back and Venus has shaken off the rust). If only the wonderfully articulate and charming Amelie Mauresmo had a just a little bit more success on the court, and if only Maria Sharapova could be brought on a little bit more quickly.

Action Jackson
02-03-2004, 06:00 AM
Apart from Klitschko brothers being Ukrainian, the comment about Russia being a primitive country was absolutely ridiculous.

joske
02-03-2004, 03:07 PM
Sport is about competition , not domination.

Doesn't domination attract more competition (like a challenge to beat the dominating players or become as good as they are)? Just my opinion :)

+ all sports need some players that are simply better than all (or better: most) players because I think players like that draw attention to the sport which means drawing in fans that support the game
Also very important: sport celebrities can be idols for youngsters, bc their success can be a motivation for kids to pick up the sport and that means there is more potential talent in tennis clubs etc, eventho the REAL talents will still be a rare thing...
I love seeing young kids being really motivated to become the best in a sport... they showed amateur video recording of Kim Clijsters' dad on tv some time ago where they asked her what she wanted to be when she grew up and she said "I wanna play tennis".. when they asked "And who do you wanna beat?" she soberly replied "Everyone" (if I'm not mistaking you can watch a short clip of that video on her official website..)

Well, the girl wasn't far off back then.. and note that she was only like 6 years old and had never held a racket in her life.. so cute :)

Gandalf
02-03-2004, 04:46 PM
One thing that men's tennis has over women's tennis right now is that the top men players believe that they can beat each other, while in the WTA there are a lot of mental dominances going on. And also the constant injuries make the WTA boring...

I think that the WTA was on top ot the ATP in '98-'00, but in the last year, when the New Balls finally started playing well at the Slams, the ATP has gotten in front.

Crazy_Fool
02-03-2004, 05:23 PM
Only problem in mens tennis is there is no rivalries right now but thats because all the players have just developed. If everyone is fit and healthy in womens tennis then all that happens is the Williams and Belgians in the semi of every single slam(and alot of the other tournaments) that they play. I dont find that interesting.

star
02-03-2004, 05:36 PM
One thing that men's tennis has over women's tennis right now is that the top men players believe that they can beat each other, while in the WTA there are a lot of mental dominances going on. And also the constant injuries make the WTA boring...

I think that the WTA was on top ot the ATP in '98-'00, but in the last year, when the New Balls finally started playing well at the Slams, the ATP has gotten in front.

and 98-00 was a time in women's tennis when there wasn't absolute dominance. There was a lot of excitement about who would be the winner.

Men's tennis languished in the Sampras years.

TennisLurker
02-03-2004, 05:49 PM
women tennis in 1998 1999 2000 was great, you had Martina, Davenport, the william sisters, even Kournikova with some good results, and you also had Steffi, Novotna, Arantxa and Pierce winning grandslams, and Seles, Conchita with good results.

It was a great time.

Chloe le Bopper
02-03-2004, 07:13 PM
Hey, moron, what the hell are you blathering on about, huh?!

I am from Russia and what you're saying here is utter, worthless GARBAGE.

I am not college-educated and English is my THIRD language.....and yet you consider me primitive? Talk about ignorance and victim of isolationism.....Wow. Just wow.

Russia may be a relatively poor country......but it's remarkably literate and culturally second to none. None. You know those dumbass Klitchco brothers? They are world-class boxers and boxers are stupid, right? Well, they EACH speak 4 languages and are writing their dissertations on their free time in TWO different fields.....

Why do Russians love tennis and all resorts and soccer stadiums have adjacent tennis courts, clay, grass and hard surface? Because it's a BEAUTIFUL, GRACEFUL and yet athletically CHALLENGING (as opposed to chess or golf) game, that's why......NOT because we are a primitive money-grubbing people.

El Bastardo!

PS: I hope this CanadianBoy doesn't represent the level of discourse on this site, because if he does, I am OUTTA here.
If you had noticed how many people agreed with his comments (that, is NOBODY), you would be able to deduct wether or not his comments were the norm for this site :)

Pironkov
02-03-2004, 07:15 PM
I don't think *anybody can win events* in women's tennis...

decemberlove
02-03-2004, 07:53 PM
I wonder what the repsonse would be if I posted in Wta message board :lol:
Maybe I posted this too soon. The AO has truly been the men's event. The women's skills were not really shown off.
However, when Monica, Jennifer, Venus, Serena, Amelie, Anna, Lindsay, Kim and Justine play the same tournaments, it will easily surpass the men's. And this should happen soon.
Remember that Agassi is retiring soon, and this means women will get shown more often ;) .

Either way, the AO sucked FOR ME. Tennis is not the same with all the injuries.

and heres the problem...

anna is my favorite player, but the girl is a fucking headcase. she will prolly never live up to her potential.

monica, jennifer, and lindsay arent getting any younger.

amelie, unfortunately, has bad luck.

that leaves us with kimmie, justine, serena, and venus. who knows if serena will ever be the same? and who knows if kimmie will ever be able to swallow her nerves in a slam final against justine? who knows if venus will ever beat her lil sis in a slam final?

its too predictable, too boring right now.

joske
02-03-2004, 08:03 PM
anna is my favorite player, but the girl is a fucking headcase. she will prolly never live up to her potential.

(...)

and who knows if kimmie will ever be able to swallow her nerves in a slam final against justine?

Wait, hang on, stop the train, which Anna are you referring to here?

Oh and I truly hope that Kim will beat the living snot out of Justine in a Slam final one day...
That little monster is such a visul turn-off for anyone human *except for husband Pierre-Yves... but then again he survives feeding on his own fingernails so I guess we can exclude him from the category 'human' right?* :rolleyes: Really, that critter has to be taught a lesson soon, and I hope Kim is the woman to do it! ;)

:lol: Yeh I know, as a Belgian I'm supposed to be proud of this once-in-a-century phenomenon, but Kim is SOOOO much nicer than Justine.. :)

sigmagirl91
02-03-2004, 08:06 PM
The point of this thread, and CanadianBoy's uninformed and misguided arguments, are what now? And the crowd said, POINTLESS!!!!!!!! CanadianBoy you are waaaaaaaaaay off base here. No way is women's tennis better than men's tennis right now. Maybe back in the late 90s, but not now.

joske
02-03-2004, 08:20 PM
Hmmmm you know I think no one can say which is better, WTA or ATP.. simply because both are very different, which makes them almost impossible to compare.. I guess it all depends on what you like about tennis as well, I mean ATP tennis has certain aspects that are very cool, but it's the same in WTA tennis (a lot of things I like in that too)
I think the discussion hereis indeed kina pointless :rolleyes:

decemberlove
02-03-2004, 09:04 PM
Wait, hang on, stop the train, which Anna are you referring to here?


kournikova.

i assumed thats who he was talking about from other posts of his.

*~ The Leopard ~*
02-03-2004, 11:52 PM
Poor li'l Juju. I think she's sort of cute in a tomboyish way. Not beautiful like Anna K or Dani, for example, but cute.

Chloe le Bopper
02-03-2004, 11:56 PM
Wait, hang on, stop the train, which Anna are you referring to here?

Oh and I truly hope that Kim will beat the living snot out of Justine in a Slam final one day...
That little monster is such a visul turn-off for anyone human *except for husband Pierre-Yves... but then again he survives feeding on his own fingernails so I guess we can exclude him from the category 'human' right?* :rolleyes: Really, that critter has to be taught a lesson soon, and I hope Kim is the woman to do it! ;)

:lol: Yeh I know, as a Belgian I'm supposed to be proud of this once-in-a-century phenomenon, but Kim is SOOOO much nicer than Justine.. :)
She can be nice all she wants. It's not going to win her any Grand Slam finals.

I suppose that's hard to swallow for a bitter fan like yourself, even though you'd never admit it ;)

Just stick to the "we support the nice one, and we'd rather love a nice player than somebody like Justine who wins Slams!". You're not a alone, there is a forum here full of you... and you're all full of shit ;)

*~ The Leopard ~*
02-03-2004, 11:57 PM
Speaking of which, so many of the WTA players with tremendous charisma are just not delivering. My own favourite, Amelie, is an example to some extent, even though she's managed to get to # 3, which I'm very glad about. But something always seems to go wrong when she has a chance to establish herself as one of the true elite with the Williams sisters and the Belgians.

But Daniela is a better example. She has plenty of talent and charisma, but didn't seem to be able to do anything right last year.

The less said about Anna K the better.

Still, we do have a lot of interesting and fine players among the women. We just need more of them to deliver their best and do so consistently.

Chloe le Bopper
02-03-2004, 11:59 PM
Poor li'l Juju. I think she's sort of cute in a tomboyish way. Not beautiful like Anna K or Dani, for example, but cute.
I just think she's average. Which is fine. She's not a model, she's a tennis player. Some people just realize they have dick all to knock her for, so they stick with the basics: "the hand" and "she's ugly". Thanks for weighing in with those intelligent insights, people! It never gets dull. Not even after the 1700th time it's been said, or the THIRD slam that Justine has won :)

*~ The Leopard ~*
02-04-2004, 12:05 AM
Exactly, Rebecca. Let's face it, some of those beautiful women like Anna K do capture our imaginations (well the imaginations of some of us) because of their sheer beauty, but that's not what tennis is about. As you say, they are not models. I think Juju looks fine, but what gives her a degree of charisma is the beauty of her shots combined with determination and tenacity. What really bumped her up from being a player that I like to being a player that I support enthusiatically was her tremendous tenacity at the USO last year.

star
02-04-2004, 12:20 AM
But even when the women with "charisma" (and I guess that is in the eye of the beholder) are delivering, the product they deliver just isn't as good as what the men have to offer, imo.

There was a period in the men's game where the returners were lagging the servers, and that made for some not so interesting tennis. The women at that time were able to deliver complicated rallies, so they had a game that was in some ways more interesting than the men's game.

Now however, the top women are in some sort of slam fest and the women's game is littered with errors of the worst sort. The men's game is better because of the high quality of play through out the top 50 players. Even if there is a shellacking of one player, usually the tennis is still interesting. The men hit harder, are more accurate, and have a greater variety in their games.

star
02-04-2004, 12:22 AM
That little monster is such a visul turn-off for anyone human *except for husband Pierre-Yves... but then again he survives feeding on his own fingernails so I guess we can exclude him from the category 'human' right?* :rolleyes: Really, that critter has to be taught a lesson soon, and I hope Kim is the woman to do it! ;)



:eek:



And that even though Kim is my favorite player in the current top 5.

star
02-04-2004, 12:25 AM
Hey, moron, what the hell are you blathering on about, huh?!

I am from Russia and what you're saying here is utter, worthless GARBAGE.

I am not college-educated and English is my THIRD language.....and yet you consider me primitive? Talk about ignorance and victim of isolationism.....Wow. Just wow.

Russia may be a relatively poor country......but it's remarkably literate and culturally second to none. None. You know those dumbass Klitchco brothers? They are world-class boxers and boxers are stupid, right? Well, they EACH speak 4 languages and are writing their dissertations on their free time in TWO different fields.....

Why do Russians love tennis and all resorts and soccer stadiums have adjacent tennis courts, clay, grass and hard surface? Because it's a BEAUTIFUL, GRACEFUL and yet athletically CHALLENGING (as opposed to chess or golf) game, that's why......NOT because we are a primitive money-grubbing people.

El Bastardo!

PS: I hope this CanadianBoy doesn't represent the level of discourse on this site, because if he does, I am OUTTA here.

Thank you!!!!! :worship:

I so wanted someone from Russia to respond.

And I think this guy sort of struggled in from WTA World.

AgassiFan
02-04-2004, 01:57 AM
And I think this guy sort of struggled in from WTA World

WTA fanatics (especially Williams Sisters tooring racial conflict merchants) singlehandedly ruined ESPN.com tennis board.

It's a scary place over there.

joske
02-04-2004, 04:22 PM
:eek:



And that even though Kim is my favorite player in the current top 5.

:lol: Oh I'm sorry I was still a tad emotional because she beat Kim again.. wasn't my intention of offending anyone or anything :) oh and I'm not a cruel person or anything I'm quite nice :)

joske
02-04-2004, 04:24 PM
Just stick to the "we support the nice one, and we'd rather love a nice player than somebody like Justine who wins Slams!". You're not a alone, there is a forum here full of you... and you're all full of shit ;)

:lol: thanks for understanding sweety ;)

Oh and LOL @ your signature.. I'd never noticed that before, it's nice :)

Sjengster
09-13-2006, 03:12 AM
*bump*

Hmmm....

Just Cause
09-13-2006, 03:16 AM
*bump*

Hmmm....
I dont understand?.....Why?

Sjengster
09-13-2006, 03:17 AM
Just reading the thread starter's initial post makes you realise the extent of the 180 degree turn that's occurred in the last three years.

oz_boz
09-13-2006, 12:57 PM
Fun to read. I was thinking the same about the WTA, people seemed to think it was boring during the Williams era and now they complain about the lack of consistent top players. Oh well.

DrJules
09-13-2006, 01:22 PM
This is not bashing men's tennis, it is merely stating the truth which most would agree with. I like watching men's tennis, the level is obviously higher, especially this year at the AO, the women looked like juniors. But what is missing from the men's tour is someone who can dominate for a while. 'Anybody can win' does not seem to draw fans in. The top 15 has a reasonable chance of getting very far at the tourny or winningit. How fun is being a fan then. If you want to say 'I'm a tennis fan, not a player fan', fine, it sucks still because if you are JUST a tennis fan u wouldn't mind watching ta[e matches of a great match over and over and over. It is much more interesting when u kind of have a strong desire of a stronger player winning.
On the women's tour the Williams sisters and the Belgians have a lot of fans because they win and if u love a player u 'hate'(or dislike) their opponent. A Serena vs. Justine match, everyone looks forward to, because they are the top women, as well no one wouldn't mind Venus vs. Kim.

That is my opinion.
and I hope the winner in today's final goes victorious in at least one more slam.

What do u think?

Then they complain that somebody dominates :lol: :lol: :lol:

bokehlicious
09-13-2006, 01:45 PM
Then they complain that somebody dominates :lol: :lol: :lol:

:lol: :lol: First they complained about the lack of leader(s) and then they complain that the domination is boring. Human beings are funny at times :)

Ryan
09-13-2006, 05:33 PM
From the MTF ruins.

There's a thread over at WTA World lamenting the fact that women's tennis is dying now while the men's has become more popular. I think they were basing this on the ratings (the men's were higher than the women's).


Nope. At least, I wasn't basing my statements on ratings. Mens tennis is FAR better quality than women's nowadays, and pretty much since the original post in this thread was made. I still prefer women's tennis to a certain extent because of some of the players and the fact that there ARE good matches on the WTA tour. But, I have no problem admitting that the sheer quality of play by the men is much better - I found myself watching more mens tennis this Open than womens, even people I usually don't like watching (Federer, Agassi, Safin).