Ljubicic: "I would always be more worried about Roger" [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Ljubicic: "I would always be more worried about Roger"

nobama
06-08-2006, 12:38 AM
From his press conference after his QF match:

But Roger, it's Roger. I mean, he's just fantastic player. You never know what is gonna happen. You know more or less what you can expect from Rafael, but I would always be more worried about Roger.

mangoes
06-08-2006, 12:39 AM
An interview with Ivan Ljubicic
Wednesday, June 7, 2006


Q. This will be the fourth time you will be playing Nadal. Extremely close matches, all on hard court. How significnt do you think the clay is going to be in changing the conditions in which the two of you have played?

IVAN LJUBICIC: Well, I don't think there is any doubt that he is a big favorite. I don't think only in the semifinal, but also in the final. I think of four of us left, I think he's definitely the favorite one. Then Roger, then David, then it's me.

I think just by reaching semifinal, I did something incredible. Absolutely, it's going to be zero pressure on Friday for me. And I know that, as you said, we had the three very close matches, but they were all on the hard court. It's gonna be definitely more difficult to hit an ace on clay than on hard court. But also, I'm gonna have more balls to do something with. Because on the hard court, he is playing much more aggressive. That's what I think.

There's no tactic against Rafael. I think Roger showed us in Rome the way to give him trouble. He was pretty close. He had two matchpoints. As close as you can get, actually.

I think that the truth, it's something ‑‑ you cannot be too aggressive, you cannot be too defensive. But, you know, as I said, you know, there's no pressure. Of course I want to win it. Of course I'm gonna try all I have, all my weapons. And I don't want of course any long rallies. I'm going to try to be aggressive because that's, I think, the way I can hurt him.

Q. Looking at it from the distance, what do you think now from your match, Rafael and you in Madrid and Masters Series final when you had two sets and a break and you are at the end, you lose almost unbelievably.

IVAN LJUBICIC: Yeah.

Q. What do you think now about this match, and the way you play?

IVAN LJUBICIC: Well, I was two sets to love up. I had a break in the fifth, early break in the fifth, but I lost the serve right after. I don't think ‑‑ I think it's very difficult actually to compare two matches. First of all, he played at home. That's I think one of the reasons he won that match. He was really down after two sets, but the crowd get him up and he fight back. And then after, in the fourth and the fifth, he played fantastic tennis, of course.

But, I mean, we are here in Paris. It's clay. It's completely different. I don't think it's really wise to compare two matches. It's gonna be completely different match. I never played against Rafael on clay, and I'm really glad that that's in semis of Roland Garros, of course.

Q. You said a minute ago, you spoke of having zero pressure coming into this match. When was the last time you felt yourself in sort of an approximate circumstance?

IVAN LJUBICIC: You know, I remember, like, with my experience, every time I said like zero pressure, then you go too loose in a match. It's not like you don't try hard enough, but I don't want to be too loose. When I say 'zero pressure,' it means that he is the favorite. But I definitely want to win that match. I definitely know that I'm gonna have a chance, and if I take those chances, I'm gonna be danger opponent out there.

So, as I think everybody will agree, that what I said, I'm proud with the less favorite of four, to go in the final or to win the event. But, you know, I'm here for the reason. I am definitely not going to give up that easily the match.

Q. Do you know what the word "spoiler" means?

IVAN LJUBICIC: "Spoiler"?

Q. How a lot of fans are expecting Federer‑Nadal.

IVAN LJUBICIC: Yeah, well, that's natural. The last I don't know how many tournaments they play together, they always went to the final. It's absolutely normal. Rafael winning 57 or '8, whatever number is, matches on clay, that streak has to finish one day. I hope that's gonna be on Friday. He cannot win for ever and everybody knows that.

Q. If it's dry and the court is dry, how much can this court be like a hard court? I assume you'd rather play on that kind of court?

IVAN LJUBICIC: It was the first time for me on center court, actually. I only practiced once in my whole career on this court. I was getting ‑‑ I had a warm‑up in the morning. It looked actually pretty slow to me. But I thought it's gonna be little faster.

But actually I found a lot of clay on court. I played on Suzanne Lenglen two matches. It was slow because it was wet. It was really, really ‑‑ the clay was much darker than the one on center court. But there is a lot of clay out there. I don't know if that's the case of today's matches or it's always like that, but I don't find really the court fast. That's my feeling, maybe because of today or maybe they put more clay, but I don't think so. I mean, it would be very weird, you know.

So, I mean, of course I expect nice weather because I think the forecast is like that. But I don't really think that matters. I mean, it's not like if it's sunny I'm gonna win and if it's cloudy I'm gonna lose. That's not something that's gonna make difference.

Q. When you played Mathieu, there wasn't very much clay. The clay was blown out by the wind.

IVAN LJUBICIC: Yeah.

Q. Would you like that?

IVAN LJUBICIC: Well, I mean, anything that helps, it's good. No, but as I said, the court is not gonna make the difference. I think, you know, it's best‑of‑five. It's gonna be long one. I have to play perfect match to have a chance actually. So if there is little more clay or less clay, I mean, I don't think really that matters.

Q. That was a great smile at the end you let out there. That moment, that moment of enjoyment, what was that comparable with, would you say, in your career so far?

IVAN LJUBICIC: Well, it's fantastic feeling, I have to say. But it's also, I mean, if you see the players that I beat all the way through the semis, you have to expect that. You know, it would be actually biggest disappointment not to make semis with these players that I played against. It's a lot of pressure from the first round, you know. You play all the guys that you actually have to beat them, and big struggle against Monaco. And now that I'm finally gonna find myself in a position that, you know, that I belong, being No. 4 seed in semifinal, now I can really relax and concentrate absolutely only on my game.

So it was a smile of relief more than anything else.

Q. Your evolution as a player, because, I mean, the tennis fans, some of them are cheering for Nadal, some for Federer because he can make this Grand Slam impossible thing. Your evolution demonstrates that it is possible to play at first in hard courts but now also in clay because this is amazing. I mean, for me also. I don't know if it's work with Piatti or Italian influence or whatever.

IVAN LJUBICIC: I mean, yesterday or two days ago, I said that first time I played on something else than clay was when I was 15. I mean, all my life I'm playing on clay. Of course, with my serve and with my game, you would say he likes to play on something else. But I never ‑‑ I always liked to play on clay.

And, you know, in Monte‑Carlo earlier this year I played quarterfinal, was pretty good result. I had chances even to make semis. I was 5‑2 up against González. Then I had problems a little bit in Rome and Hamburg, but I think those early exits actually helped me to find my time to work on my body and my game, because it was a long period that I was playing so, so well, I didn't have a time to practice.

And this last month in Rome and Hamburg, I had enough time to practice. I worked really hard. And in Dusseldorf I started to work on my game. Everything was happening actually positively for me. Even after the loss against Ferrer, 6‑2, 6‑2, I know that I'm on the good way. I was saying that in interviews as well.

Now I'm here in semifinal in Roland Garros, and I have to say that of course when you lose 6‑2, 6‑Love in Hamburg to Acasuso, I was in doubt. I was not happy with the situation. My coach said, "Okay, this time I'm gonna take the responsibility and you're gonna be in good shape in Paris." I said okay. And that actually relaxed me.

It is surprise. Of course, it is surprise. But, you know, as I said before, if you see the players that I beat, you know, I think it was ‑‑ you could expect me to find myself in semifinal.

Q. It's been a long and winding road for you to get to this place from your home country to Italy, and then finally this breakthrough this year, the Davis Cup final, and now the semifinals here. Was there a point earlier in your career where you just were resigned that, "I'm not gonna be a top 10 or even a top 20 player, I'll just have a nice career and enjoy this"?

IVAN LJUBICIC: Well, I always wanted more. I mean, I never ‑‑ of course, during your career you have ups and downs and you have the moments that you don't believe that much in yourself like I do believe now, for example.

But there were periods like between 2001 and 2004, there were three years of really hard work. I was working, as always, very hard, but the results were just not happening. I was there between 30 and 50 for three years. The only thing in tennis that you don't want is to get used to that ranking and, you know, you don't really ‑‑ don't invest your time or work to do something more.

But I always wanted to do something and, you know, I think with the start of working with Salvador Sosa in the winter of 2003, I think I made probably the best choice in my career. He helped me a lot not only physically but also his experience with the players in the past that he was working with, Bruguera and Corretja. I mean, fantastic players.

So it was a long way, yes, of course. But, you know, I always took step by step. You know, when I felt comfortable in one position, when I consolidate my game, then I wanted more. You know, I think that's the situation now.

As I said before, making almost every tournament, at least quarterfinal, except Rome and Hamburg this year, it's something that, you know ‑‑ it was a long way, but now I'm here and I definitely don't think it's gonna stop any soon.

Q. Do you have to believe you can beat Rafael to beat him? He has such an aura now, he's won all these matches.

IVAN LJUBICIC: I'm not impressed with that streak. I mean, it's fantastic results. But he was close of losing matches so many times that, as I said before, it has to happen one day. And I do believe that I can beat him, yes.

Q. Is that partly because you're more experienced and you've seen things happen?

IVAN LJUBICIC: Well, you know, when certain things happens to you when you're 27, and you know how to cope with those situations, sometimes better than when you're 18, 19, 20, you know. I just said that in my career, everything was coming slowly.

And now that I made the semis in Paris, you know, I know that ‑‑ what that means. When you do it when you're 18, 19, you're not necessarily know exactly what it means and you may fight all your life, actually, to repeat that.

But now, when you're 27, you know exactly what it means and you know exactly your potential. I know exactly what my game, it's about. I know that if I ‑‑ all what I have in my head, all the ideas how to play, I can beat anyone, and why not Rafael Nadal?

Q. Who would be more intimidating on clay, Roger or Rafa?

IVAN LJUBICIC: Nobody can intimidate me, I think. My ranking is good enough, I think.

Q. More difficult?

IVAN LJUBICIC: It's different. I mean, Rafa, it's more probably physical than about concentration because so many balls look so easy and you just find yourself not hitting the winners that I see all these guys.

But Roger, it's Roger. I mean, he's just fantastic player. You never know what is gonna happen. You know more or less what you can expect from Rafael, but I would always be more worried about Roger.

ezekiel
06-08-2006, 12:41 AM
I think he thinks he will catch Rafa sooner than Roger ;)

However I just saw this quote that raised my eyebrows

"I'm not impressed with that streak. He was close to losing many times. If I play my game, I know I can beat anyone. Why not Rafael Nadal? I definitely know I have my chances. He keeps winning on clay but he can't win for ever. I don't want any long rallies. I believe that' the way I can hurt him."

Pea
06-08-2006, 12:42 AM
Looks like people are picking sides in this whole Rogi/Rafa affair...........................:p

mangoes
06-08-2006, 12:43 AM
Looks like people are picking sides in this whole Rogi/Rafa affair...........................:p


Indeed :lol: :lol:................. I really like Ljubicic:hug:

NicoleH8Ballkids
06-08-2006, 12:43 AM
i hope nadal trashes him

oneandonlyhsn
06-08-2006, 12:45 AM
I think he thinks he will catch Rafa sooner than Roger ;)

However I just saw this quote that raised my eyebrows

Go Ljubo :yeah: believe in yourself

El Legenda
06-08-2006, 12:51 AM
was Ljubo suppose to say, i will not even try because i know i will lose?
hell no. Ivan is coming friday to win.

and yes you have to worry about Roger on Clay, Grass, Indoor, Hard
cant say same for Nadal

:wavey:

asotgod
06-08-2006, 01:09 AM
Isn't it funny that the majority of players seem to be picking Roger's side more than Nadal. It tells a lot about their perception of his game and of him. Matthieu said something about him being a middle-range player, Solderling said something also, even Hewitt said something earlier in the year about the matchup, among others. The players have spoken.

Billabong
06-08-2006, 01:12 AM
Ljubo:yeah:

nobama
06-08-2006, 01:13 AM
Isn't it funny that the majority of players seem to be picking Roger's side more than Nadal. It tells a lot about their perception of his game and of him. Matthieu said something about him being a middle-range player, Solderling said something also, even Hewitt said something earlier in the year about the matchup, among others. The players have spoken.Maybe Roger's one dimensional comment wasn't so far off after all. ;) But pretty soon they're going to have to put up or shut up.

asotgod
06-08-2006, 01:21 AM
Maybe Roger's one dimensional comment wasn't so far off after all. ;) But pretty soon they're going to have to put up or shut up.

There was nothing, IMO, wrong with the one-dimensional comment and I was happy he backed up his reason for saying that in that interview someone posted here when Roger was asked about the comment. Nadal's game is not layered but effective, and that is the truth. That's not a taint or a diss but actually testament to Nadal's mastery of whatever he does to confound opponents.

Secondly, even if Roger and Ljubo dont put up right now, they will put up later on. The kid's game is just too physical to last so long. Add to that the mental energy required to grind it out everyday, and you can tell the future may not be as bright as it seems. So, it makes sense for Nadal to make the best of this opportunity because I personally dont feel he will be remain a mystery for too long or that he will be able to last long.

Nobody in recent memory other than Guga has been able to win the French repeatedly, and in fact 3 times, and I think Guga had a layered game. He could really play from anywhere although he stood too far back on returns as well. So, let's see if Nadal will change that tide, although I highly doubt (to a large percentile) that such will happen.

Clara Bow
06-08-2006, 01:22 AM
The players have spoken.

And yet- the players who have spoken are losing to him. :) I think all acknowledge that Roger is a more well rounded player than Nadal, Rafa included. So I don't know why we are having such a "nah nah nah" attitude here sometimes. The pissing contests frankly sometimes give me a headache.

Mangoes- here is the full trancript.

http://www.rolandgarros.com/en_FR/news/interviews/2006-06-07/200606071149702339091.html

I love this

Q. Who would be more intimidating on clay, Roger or Rafa?

IVAN LJUBICIC: Nobody can intimidate me, I think. My ranking is good enough, I think.

chicky841
06-08-2006, 01:25 AM
:rolleyes: Be nice Ivan....

On that note as much as I like Ivan I hope Rafa gives him a little bit of a beating. (not enuf to be embarrassing but enuf)

mangoes
06-08-2006, 01:25 AM
Mangoes- here is the full trancript.

http://www.rolandgarros.com/en_FR/news/interviews/2006-06-07/200606071149702339091.html

I love this

Thank you :hug:

asotgod
06-08-2006, 01:28 AM
And yet- the players who have spoken are losing to him. :) I think all acknowledge that Roger is a more well rounded player than Nadal, Rafa included. So I don't know why we are having such a "nah nah nah" attitude here sometimes. The pissing contests frankly sometimes give me a headache.

If you read the entire Luby interview, he actually does give Nadal some props. Mangoes- here is the full trancript.

http://www.rolandgarros.com/en_FR/news/interviews/2006-06-07/200606071149702339091.html

Nobody is being pissy here. We are just reiterating what the players have said. And what exactly is wrong with that? Obviously, it seems as if players feel he is receiving more hype than he should because he has a good H2H against Roger, but players still dont think he has anything to be able to dominate like Roger. That's clear. Anyone with eyes can see that. Look, if Roger played the game like Nadal is playing right now, and vice-versa, I will still express my opinions about their games just like I just did. It has nothing to do with being a fan of Roger. If Roger played that far from the baseline and such a great defense-based game, I will say his chances of lasting long are slim. What's pissy about that. The players' interview repeatedly show that they dont hold Nadal in high esteem as they hold Roger, despite what he is doing. That's what it means when I say the players have spoken. QED.

oneandonlyhsn
06-08-2006, 01:32 AM
Secondly, even if Roger and Ljubo dont put up right now, they will put up later on. The kid's game is just too physical to last so long. Add to that the mental energy required to grind it out everyday, and you can tell the future may not be as bright as it seems. So, it makes sense for Nadal to make the best of this opportunity because I personally dont feel he will be remain a mystery for too long or that he will be able to last long.



Ditto, I remember when people used to say how hard Hewitt's game was to his body. IMO Rafa's game is even harder on him, I hope he taks precautionary measures as his presence is good for tennis

Clara Bow
06-08-2006, 01:33 AM
What's pissy about that.

Pissing contest does not equal pissy. ;) Pissing contest is where each camp tries to continualy prove how much better they are than the other camp.

I was not saying you were "Pissy"- now I will wash my mouth out with soap.

Johnny Groove
06-08-2006, 01:34 AM
Soderling said Nadal could be beaten. Result? Rafa ****
Mathieu said Nadal could be beaten. Result? banana choking episode and Rafa win
Hewitt said Nadal could be beaten. Result? LOSS!!!
And how many times has federer said things like "o, i think im close to him, i was close, i had 2 match points in Rome and i choked terribly, i think i can beat him, i think he's one dimensional, his uncle is coaching him from the stands, he picks his ass too much, his pants make him look gay."

All this wild speculation, flaming insults, misinterpretation, and bathroom gossip should all be solved on Sunday, with the final. And, the final will be great, but the stuff on here will be awesome :drool:

ezekiel
06-08-2006, 01:36 AM
People say Rafa is one dimensional and incomplete but they really should not be boasting and mentioning that cause if he was a complete player at age 20 mind you , I think half the players would retire cause he would be winning everything

megadeth
06-08-2006, 01:38 AM
There was nothing, IMO, wrong with the one-dimensional comment and I was happy he backed up his reason for saying that in that interview someone posted here when Roger was asked about the comment. Nadal's game is not layered but effective, and that is the truth. That's not a taint or a diss but actually testament to Nadal's mastery of whatever he does to confound opponents.

Secondly, even if Roger and Ljubo dont put up right now, they will put up later on. The kid's game is just too physical to last so long. Add to that the mental energy required to grind it out everyday, and you can tell the future may not be as bright as it seems. So, it makes sense for Nadal to make the best of this opportunity because I personally dont feel he will be remain a mystery for too long or that he will be able to last long.

.


you are so right. just like roddick, players are gradually figuring out rafa...

back when everyone got intimidated by A-Rod, i think the same will happen to rafa unless he burns out sooner than when he becomes figured out...

oneandonlyhsn
06-08-2006, 01:38 AM
Soderling said Nadal could be beaten. Result? Rafa ****
Mathieu said Nadal could be beaten. Result? banana choking episode and Rafa win
Hewitt said Nadal could be beaten. Result? LOSS!!!
And how many times has federer said things like "o, i think im close to him, i was close, i had 2 match points in Rome and i choked terribly, i think i can beat him, i think he's one dimensional, his uncle is coaching him from the stands, he picks his ass too much, his pants make him look gay."

All this wild speculation, flaming insults, misinterpretation, and bathroom gossip should all be solved on Sunday, with the final. And, the final will be great, but the stuff on here will be awesome :drool:

You made those up silly, but still true he does pick his ass too much. I bet his hands are pretty smelly after the match :p

Merton
06-08-2006, 01:39 AM
Once again, this is an excellent press conference from Ivan. He speaks his mind without thinking about "political correctness" or the value that the information he reveals may have for his opponent.

Johnny Groove
06-08-2006, 01:40 AM
You made those up silly

:lol: yeah, but its still funny, and it would be hilarious if feds said that, no?

Merton
06-08-2006, 01:42 AM
you are so right. just like roddick, players are gradually figuring out rafa...

back when everyone got intimidated by A-Rod, i think the same will happen to rafa unless he burns out sooner than when he becomes figured out...

Wishful thinking.

chicky841
06-08-2006, 01:42 AM
You made those up silly, but still true he does pick his ass too much. I bet his hands are pretty smelly after the match :p

oh ew :lol:

oneandonlyhsn
06-08-2006, 01:42 AM
:lol: yeah, but its still funny, and it would be hilarious if feds said that, no?

:lol: I believe MTF will crash on that day, Roger will turn from an S&M addict to Rafa's bitch literally

Merton
06-08-2006, 01:49 AM
Nobody is being pissy here. We are just reiterating what the players have said. And what exactly is wrong with that? Obviously, it seems as if players feel he is receiving more hype than he should because he has a good H2H against Roger, but players still dont think he has anything to be able to dominate like Roger. That's clear. Anyone with eyes can see that. Look, if Roger played the game like Nadal is playing right now, and vice-versa, I will still express my opinions about their games just like I just did. It has nothing to do with being a fan of Roger. If Roger played that far from the baseline and such a great defense-based game, I will say his chances of lasting long are slim. What's pissy about that. The players' interview repeatedly show that they dont hold Nadal in high esteem as they hold Roger, despite what he is doing. That's what it means when I say the players have spoken. QED.

A typical logical phallacy, generalizing from a sample to the population of players, without any evidence. By the way, that QED at the end of the statement hurts my eyes. The part that i made bold should read "Ljubicic interview shows that he does not hold Nadal in such a high esteem as he holds Roger" The fact that he earlier says that Nadal is the top favourite to win it all contradicts your allegation that he does not hold Nadal in high esteem.

asotgod
06-08-2006, 01:52 AM
Pissing contest does not equal pissy. ;) Pissing contest is where each camp tries to continualy prove how much better they are than the other camp.

I was not saying you were "Pissy"- now I will wash my mouth out with soap.

It's all good Clara Bow. I actually am happy Nadal is around because Roger is being forced to improve, especially mentally. Add to that the fact that tennis has given the media something to talk about, MTF has quite a lot to quarrel about, these alone make things interesting and gives more awareness to the sport.

One other thing is that as much as we argue about these two guys, the funny thing is that they both know what they are and I dont think they will lose sleep over so many things we do lose sleep over. Although it's a competition, it's still just a game and there is more to life other than tennis. So, we may as well make the best of the time and the opportunity this era brings.

Johnny Groove
06-08-2006, 01:53 AM
:lol: I believe MTF will crash on that day, Roger will turn from an S&M addict to Rafa's bitch literally

if he loses again, maybe feds should get some juice!

http://www.rngp.org/images/rabbit%20jpgs/bunny%20prick.JPG

oneandonlyhsn
06-08-2006, 01:54 AM
if he loses again, maybe feds should get some juice!

http://www.rngp.org/images/rabbit%20jpgs/bunny%20prick.JPG

I think Rafa will gladly serve him some juice :devil:

Johnny Groove
06-08-2006, 01:54 AM
It's all good Clara Bow. I actually am happy Nadal is around because Roger is being forced to improve, especially mentally. Add to that the fact that tennis has given the media something to talk about, MTF has quite a lot to quarrel about, these alone make things interesting and gives more awareness to the sport.

One other thing is that as much as we argue about these two guys, the funny thing is that they both know what they are and I dont think they will lose sleep over so many things we do lose sleep over. Although it's a competition, it's still just a game and there is more to life other than tennis. So, we may as well make the best of the time and the opportunity this era brings.

:worship: great post. objective and unbiased

Johnny Groove
06-08-2006, 01:56 AM
I think Rafa will gladly serve him some juice :devil:

the only juice that Nadal needs is banana juice. unchokable :yeah:

asotgod
06-08-2006, 01:58 AM
Soderling said Nadal could be beaten. Result? Rafa ****
Mathieu said Nadal could be beaten. Result? banana choking episode and Rafa win
Hewitt said Nadal could be beaten. Result? LOSS!!!
And how many times has federer said things like "o, i think im close to him, i was close, i had 2 match points in Rome and i choked terribly, i think i can beat him, i think he's one dimensional, his uncle is coaching him from the stands, he picks his ass too much, his pants make him look gay."

All this wild speculation, flaming insults, misinterpretation, and bathroom gossip should all be solved on Sunday, with the final. And, the final will be great, but the stuff on here will be awesome :drool:


You can count as many players who said that and have been beaten by Nadal. However, IMO, he is no threat to Roger until he can perform half as well on the other surfaces and retool his game just to meet that. Obviously he is the favorite on Sunday against anybody, but that's why the matches are played, and the scores are not phoned in.

Look Blaze, no one hates Nadal. There is no reason to. I dont know him personally and could care less what he does with his life, as long he is happy. However, from a game-sighting perspective, I think he needs to make some changes to be able to last long and create more concerns on other surfaces for Roger, and I think that's being expressed in the players' comments as well. Does it seem likely that such changes may make his game better? Maybe or maybe not. That may mean changing his winning formula which is to grind down his opponents. But even if he doesn't change this, his body will. That's life. That's not a taint on the kid. Anyone can see this. So, if he wins on Sunday, then fine. All credit to him. If he doesn't, all credit to whoever wins as well.

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:01 AM
People say Rafa is one dimensional and incomplete but they really should not be boasting and mentioning that cause if he was a complete player at age 20 mind you , I think half the players would retire cause he would be winning everything

If Nadal was a complete player, I bet you he will have the same problem Roger does right now. Too much of everything is bad. When you have too many weapons at your disposal, it may actually be hard knowing which to implement. Coupled with that is the possibility for arrogance, then slothfulness sets in, and you cannot reach your potential because many things come easy to you. Such is life. One cannot have it both ways. The better one's combination of both sides, the higher the chances of realising one's potential.

Johnny Groove
06-08-2006, 02:02 AM
You can count as many players who said that and have been beaten by Nadal. However, IMO, he is no threat to Roger until he can perform half as well on the other surfaces and retool his game just to meet that.

Didnt he beat Feds in Dubai, on hard? and in 2004 in Miami, at 17?

Obviously he is the favorite on Sunday against anybody, but that's why the matches are played, and the scores are not phoned in.

Look Blaze, no one hates Nadal. There is no reason to. I dont know him personally and could care less what he does with his life, as long he is happy. However, from a game-sighting perspective, I think he needs to make some changes to be able to last long and create more concerns on other surfaces for Roger, and I think that's being expressed in the players' comments as well. Does it seem likely that such changes may make his game better? Maybe or maybe not. That may mean changing his winning formula which is to grind down his opponents. But even if he doesn't change this, his body will. That's life. That's not a taint on the kid. Anyone can see this. So, if he wins on Sunday, then fine. All credit to him. If he doesn't, all credit to whoever wins as well.

Ive said, many times that im concerned of nadal's playing style and how he might get burned out unless he changes his game. About the hating, i have to disagree. Ive seen some horrible posts from "Fedtards" about Rafa.

playhard
06-08-2006, 02:03 AM
It's all good Clara Bow. I actually am happy Nadal is around because Roger is being forced to improve, especially mentally.


I copied from a famous writter on Sport Illustrated and pasted in my blog:

http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-_etdeKw9c6gDTC88cUOTfA--?cq=1&p=146

you can come and read it. It's worth a visit. Same idea with asotgod.

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:06 AM
A typical logical phallacy, generalizing from a sample to the population of players, without any evidence. By the way, that QED at the end of the statement hurts my eyes. The part that i made bold should read "Ljubicic interview shows that he does not hold Nadal in such a high esteem as he holds Roger" The fact that he earlier says that Nadal is the top favourite to win it all contradicts your allegation that he does not hold Nadal in high esteem.


There is nothing to correct when I said the players' interview. It is normal for the #1 player in the world to be held in higher esteem than other players. Such is life. Add to that the feeling the lockers' room that Roger is easy to get along and you can see why even when they lose to him, they still praise him. That does not mean Nadal doesn't get along with people in the locker room. I bet he does. Even Nadal praises Roger and holds him in higher esteem. If Nadal does dominate the way Roger is or finds a way of overtaking Roger in the rankings, he will be held in higher esteem. End of discussion.

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:14 AM
Didnt he beat Feds in Dubai, on hard? and in 2004 in Miami, at 17?.

He definitely did beat Fed at Dubai. But I think everyone, including Fed, will be more concerned if it was say a hardcourt master series final or a hardcourt grand slam final. This is because those have been Roger's turf for quite sometime, and may signify that Nadal is breaking his monopoly there. But so far, that has not been the case. If that becomes the case, I will definitely give props to Nadal because it would have been earned. So, let's wait and see. Is that fair enough?

[/QUOTE]About the hating, i have to disagree. Ive seen some horrible posts from "Fedtards" about Rafa.[/QUOTE]

I dont think any Federer fan hates Nadal. It is normal to be concerned when a guy comes out of nowhere and repeatedly beats a dominant #1. This definitely causes a lot of adrenalin rush, which sometimes leads to both positive and negative criticisms of Nadal. If Nadal was Federer's whipping boy, I bet many Fed fans will like him as well. It is human and you know that. In addition, just like some Roger fans, I personally dont like Nadal's playing style. I like guys who play with a lot of finesse and make things look easy. However, just like other Roger fans, I respect whatever Nadal has and will achieve. It's just that you shouldn't expect any Roger fan to be all to happy when Roger loses to Nadal, especially the way the last 3 matches have been. It's human. We all do that.

Merton
06-08-2006, 02:23 AM
There is nothing to correct when I said the players' interview. It is normal for the #1 player in the world to be held in higher esteem than other players. Such is life. Add to that the feeling the lockers' room that Roger is easy to get along and you can see why even when they lose to him, they still praise him. That does not mean Nadal doesn't get along with people in the locker room. I bet he does. Even Nadal praises Roger and holds him in higher esteem. If Nadal does dominate the way Roger is or finds a way of overtaking Roger in the rankings, he will be held in higher esteem. End of discussion.

If it is a relative statement, i.e. "players hold Roger in higher esteem than they hold Rafa" i agree, but there is circumstantial evidence, not conclusive evidence. By the way, this is not the same as "players do not hold Rafa in high esteem". The second statement does not make any sense. By the way, it is not necessarily true that a player with higher ranking/accomplishments will be held in higher esteem. I have the suspicion that Moya for example is held in much higher esteem than his ranking.

Johnny Groove
06-08-2006, 02:24 AM
He definitely did beat Fed at Dubai. But I think everyone, including Fed, will be more concerned if it was say a hardcourt master series final or a hardcourt grand slam final. This is because those have been Roger's turf for quite sometime, and may signify that Nadal is breaking his monopoly there. But so far, that has not been the case. If that becomes the case, I will definitely give props to Nadal because it would have been earned. So, let's wait and see. Is that fair enough?

yes, fair enough, hopefully they play more times on hard in the US summer :)


I dont think any Federer fan hates Nadal. It is normal to be concerned when a guy comes out of nowhere and repeatedly beats a dominant #1. This definitely causes a lot of adrenalin rush, which sometimes leads to both positive and negative criticisms of Nadal. If Nadal was Federer's whipping boy, I bet many Fed fans will like him as well. It is human and you know that. In addition, just like some Roger fans, I personally dont like Nadal's playing style. I like guys who play with a lot of finesse and make things look easy. However, just like other Roger fans, I respect whatever Nadal has and will achieve. It's just that you shouldn't expect any Roger fan to be all to happy when Roger loses to Nadal, especially the way the last 3 matches have been. It's human. We all do that.

we all have preferences, and we all know it is indeed human nature to not like someone that beats one's player or team.

nobama
06-08-2006, 02:24 AM
Didnt he beat Feds in Dubai, on hard? and in 2004 in Miami, at 17?



Ive said, many times that im concerned of nadal's playing style and how he might get burned out unless he changes his game. About the hating, i have to disagree. Ive seen some horrible posts from "Fedtards" about Rafa.And there have been plenty negative posts from "Rafatards about Roger. It's not like this is just one sided.

silverwhite
06-08-2006, 02:28 AM
Isn't it funny that the majority of players seem to be picking Roger's side more than Nadal. It tells a lot about their perception of his game and of him. Matthieu said something about him being a middle-range player, Solderling said something also, even Hewitt said something earlier in the year about the matchup, among others. The players have spoken.

PHM was talking about himself...

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:28 AM
If it is a relative statement, i.e. "players hold Roger in higher esteem than they hold Rafa" i agree, but there is circumstantial evidence, not conclusive evidence. By the way, this is not the same as "players do not hold Rafa in high esteem". The second statement does not make any sense. By the way, it is not necessarily true that a player with higher ranking/accomplishments will be held in higher esteem. I have the suspicion that Moya for example is held in much higher esteem than his ranking.


You just answered yourself with the description of Moya. Roger is both #1 and is loved by the players. That explains why he is held in much higher esteem. Add to that the feeling among players that Roger is probably the most talented player to play the game and the believe that he has more tools at his disposal than anyone, yet is not as high and mighty as many other #1 have been, then you see why he is loved.

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:31 AM
PHM was talking about himself...

No, he was talking about Nadal, unless I read this wrongly.

Q. What would you say to a player asking you what has to be done to beat Nadal on clay, which would give an indication for your own game for the future?

PAUL HENRI MATHIEU: First of all, not to be overimpressed by him. You have to show him that you are there on the court to beat him. That's No. 1. He's very, very good on clay, but I don't think it's impossible to beat him. It's difficult, but it's not impossible.

For a middle range player, it seems that his level is so high that it's impossible, but he can be beaten.

silverwhite
06-08-2006, 02:34 AM
For a middle range player, it seems that his level is so high that it's impossible, but he can be beaten.

Erm. Isn't he talking about himself here? :scratch:

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:34 AM
yes, fair enough, hopefully they play more times on hard in the US summer :)

Alright then. Looking forward to a great summer. Hoping other big name players like Safin, Hewitt, Roddick, Nalbandian, Ljubicic, etc can step us as well to make the going tough for the top 2. It may make for better or more entertaining tennis.

RickDaStick
06-08-2006, 02:34 AM
No, he was talking about Nadal, unless I read this wrongly.

Q. What would you say to a player asking you what has to be done to beat Nadal on clay, which would give an indication for your own game for the future?

PAUL HENRI MATHIEU: First of all, not to be overimpressed by him. You have to show him that you are there on the court to beat him. That's No. 1. He's very, very good on clay, but I don't think it's impossible to beat him. It's difficult, but it's not impossible.

For a middle range player, it seems that his level is so high that it's impossible, but he can be beaten.

Yea you are just reading that wrongly he is saying for middle range players that Nadals level seems so high that he cant be beaten but that is not true.

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:35 AM
Erm. Isn't he talking about himself here? :scratch:


No he is talking about Nadal. He is saying that for a middle range player, Nadal definitely keeps his intensity high. At least that's what his statement means literally, unless we have a wrong translation or something.

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:37 AM
Yea you are just reading that wrongly he is saying for middle range players that Nadals level seems so high that he cant be beaten but that is not true.


It could be read both ways, you know. I can see how it maybe the way you guys read it. It just seems as if it could have meant both our thoughts on it. ;)

silverwhite
06-08-2006, 02:37 AM
No he is talking about Nadal. He is saying that for a middle range player, Nadal definitely keeps his intensity high. At least that's what his statement means literally, unless we have a wrong translation or something.

See IvanLjubicic's post.

Johnny Groove
06-08-2006, 02:37 AM
Alright then. Looking forward to a great summer. Hoping other big name players like Safin, Hewitt, Roddick, Nalbandian, Ljubicic, etc can step us as well to make the going tough for the top 2. It may make for better or more entertaining tennis.

yes, Marat, Lleyton, and Andy need to play well :sad:

silverwhite
06-08-2006, 02:38 AM
It could be read both ways, you know. I can see how it maybe the way you guys read it. It just seems as if it could have meant both our thoughts on it. ;)

Who in his right mind would say that Nadal is a middle-range player? :confused:

Johnny Groove
06-08-2006, 02:38 AM
Who in his right mind would say that Nadal is a middle-range player? :confused:

PHM!:silly:

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:39 AM
See IvanLjubicic's post.

Just did. Thanks :)

thrust
06-08-2006, 02:40 AM
One dimensional or not Rafa has a winning record against just about every top player, including the "great one". I do think Ivan, if he satys calm, has a good chance against Nadal. He has a very strong game and,as he says, no real pressure on him to win. Nadal, however, is expected to win against Ivan which could affect his performance. It should be a very interesting match.

nobama
06-08-2006, 02:51 AM
You just answered yourself with the description of Moya. Roger is both #1 and is loved by the players. That explains why he is held in much higher esteem. Add to that the feeling among players that Roger is probably the most talented player to play the game and the believe that he has more tools at his disposal than anyone, yet is not as high and mighty as many other #1 have been, then you see why he is loved.I believe it was Ljubicic that said after the Miami final if he had to lose to someone he'd rather it be Roger. Roger said in Indian Wells that he and his girlfriend hang out with Ivan and his girlfriend (guess Roger didn't know she was his wife :lol: ). So maybe they are friends off court?

asotgod
06-08-2006, 02:58 AM
I believe it was Ljubicic that said after the Miami final if he had to lose to someone he'd rather it be Roger. Roger said in Indian Wells that he and his girlfriend hang out with Ivan and his girlfriend (guess Roger didn't know she was his wife :lol: ). So maybe they are friends off court?

Just my thoughts exactly. Thanks :)

El Legenda
06-08-2006, 03:00 AM
I believe it was Ljubicic that said after the Miami final if he had to lose to someone he'd rather it be Roger. Roger said in Indian Wells that he and his girlfriend hang out with Ivan and his girlfriend (guess Roger didn't know she was his wife :lol: ). So maybe they are friends off court?

they also call each other after big wins, they must be :inlove: :lol:

oneandonlyhsn
06-08-2006, 03:02 AM
they also call each other after big wins, they must be :inlove: :lol:

:lol: Roger sure gets plenty of action, 1st Roddick, then Nadal and now Ljubicic. He cant stop himself :devil:

Bagelicious
06-08-2006, 03:12 AM
:lol: Roger sure gets plenty of action, 1st Roddick, then Nadal and now Ljubicic. He cant stop himself :devil:

Poor Mirka! No wonder she's getting frazzled! Roger's too much too handle. :haha:

Metis
06-08-2006, 03:14 AM
If we imagine that Roger did not exist then Rafa would be the No1. I doubt that the other players would have more respect for him. In every aspect of life the person with the highest achievements is always envied and sometimes criticized without reason by people who do not want to admit his/her superiority over them (especially when that person is modest and humble-it hurts when you cannot find negative aspects about someone better than you). ;)

They cannot say negative things about Roger because they would be ridiculed by everybody given Roger's undisputable "god of tennis" status (which is well earned of course).

asotgod
06-08-2006, 03:18 AM
In every aspect of life the person with the highest achievements is always envied and sometimes criticized without reason by people who do not want to admit his/her superiority over them (especially when that person is modest and humble-it hurts when you cannot find negative aspects about someone better than you). ;)

They cannot say negative things about Roger because they would be ridiculed by everybody given Roger's undisputable "god of tennis" status (which is well earned of course).

I completely agree. :worship:

nobama
06-08-2006, 03:32 AM
they also call each other after big wins, they must be :inlove: :lol: :awww: Honestly Ljubicic is such a hard guy not to like. He seems like the kind of guy anyone could get along with. :)

El Legenda
06-08-2006, 03:36 AM
:awww: Honestly Ljubicic is such a hard guy not to like. He seems like the kind of guy anyone could get along with. :)

well if you read MTF Ljubicic is most hated player on the tour,

but if you listen to what the players and broadcasters say, he is of one best guys on tour to be around. he can talk to anyone on tour, he speaks english, croatian, italian , spanish and little french. and with ability to do that, thats why he is the vice-president of players council

Scotso
06-08-2006, 03:43 AM
Isn't it funny that the majority of players seem to be picking Roger's side more than Nadal. It tells a lot about their perception of his game and of him. Matthieu said something about him being a middle-range player, Solderling said something also, even Hewitt said something earlier in the year about the matchup, among others. The players have spoken.

Am I wrong, or did Nadal beat Soderling, Mathieu, and Hewitt here? That speaks, as well.

Ljubicic also said Nadal is the favorite for the title.

El Legenda
06-08-2006, 03:46 AM
Ivan said
Nadal is fav
followed by Roger, David and himself

but people choose what they want to hear

Scotso
06-08-2006, 03:50 AM
And yet- the players who have spoken are losing to him. :) I think all acknowledge that Roger is a more well rounded player than Nadal, Rafa included.

Exactly. That's why Roger is #1. But Nadal is also #2, and players need to respect that, as well. These players that say he isn't all that are still all losing to him.... so you have to question their motives.

tangerine_dream
06-08-2006, 04:03 AM
Boy, a lot of Fedtards have suddenly crawled out from under their dark holes to side with Ljubiclown in his match vs Rafa. :devil: I thought they wanted a Rafa-Roger showdown? :p

Scotso
06-08-2006, 04:06 AM
Boy, a lot of Fedtards have suddenly crawled out from under their dark holes to side with Ljubiclown in his match vs Rafa. :devil: I thought they wanted a Rafa-Roger showdown? :p

They've been saying that... but they definitely want Nadal to be limping and suffering from extreme exhaustion.

asotgod
06-08-2006, 04:07 AM
Boy, a lot of Fedtards have suddenly crawled out from under their dark holes to side with Ljubiclown in his match vs Rafa. :devil: I thought they wanted a Rafa-Roger showdown? :p

Dont think so tangy. Personally, I want the Rafa-Roger showdown. You've got to beat the best to be called the best. Right? No one is taking sides with Ljubo. I like Ljubo's game. It's like Roger's somewhat and I like his demeanor. It's classy. There you have it. :)

Scotso
06-08-2006, 04:11 AM
Dont think so tangy. Personally, I want the Rafa-Roger showdown. You've got to beat the best to be called the best. Right? No one is taking sides with Ljubo. I like Ljubo's game. It's like Roger's somewhat and I like his demeanor. It's classy. There you have it. :)

So does that mean if Roger finishes his career at like 5-25 against Nadal, people won't claim he's a better player than Nadal? :p

nobama
06-08-2006, 04:12 AM
Boy, a lot of Fedtards have suddenly crawled out from under their dark holes to side with Ljubiclown in his match vs Rafa. :devil: I thought they wanted a Rafa-Roger showdown? :pIs that the only thing you're good at...name calling?

nobama
06-08-2006, 04:13 AM
Dont think so tangy. Personally, I want the Rafa-Roger showdown. You've got to beat the best to be called the best.I assume you mean on clay?

asotgod
06-08-2006, 04:16 AM
So does that mean if Roger finishes his career at like 5-25 against Nadal, people won't claim he's a better player than Nadal? :p


The better player is based on achievements I guess. But I dont know how much the H2H will weigh in unless their achievements are pretty similar or about equal ;)

asotgod
06-08-2006, 04:17 AM
I assume you mean on clay?

I meant clay, mirkaland. No need to fear. :)

bokehlicious
06-08-2006, 08:09 AM
Isn't it funny that the majority of players seem to be picking Roger's side more than Nadal.

Yesterday on French TV, former French players Forget, Pioline and Leconte clearly admitted that they cheer for Roger to win this FO.

mandoura
06-08-2006, 08:27 AM
well if you read MTF Ljubicic is most hated player on the tour,

but if you listen to what the players and broadcasters say, he is of one best guys on tour to be around. he can talk to anyone on tour, he speaks english, croatian, italian , spanish and little french. and with ability to do that, thats why he is the vice-president of players council

I have to admit, Ljubo and Hewitt were the only 2 guys I didn't like on the ATP tour. Not anymore. When I listen to or read their interviews, I like them. Maybe I don't like them as much on the court as off of it. Yet again, I just love Ljubo's backhand and Hewitt's heart to fight. :)

oz_boz
06-08-2006, 08:40 AM
Isn't it funny that the majority of players seem to be picking Roger's side more than Nadal. It tells a lot about their perception of his game and of him. Matthieu said something about him being a middle-range player, Söderling said something also, even Hewitt said something earlier in the year about the matchup, among others. The players have spoken.

Maybe they want Roger to get the better of Nadal since they prefer Federer's game. I think it was Roche (might be wrong here) who says that Fed plays the way tennis should be played, and many agree with him, including Rafa.

I however think that IF Nadal doesn't burn out, we are watching a change of guards. Nadal may not be well-rounded or his game appealing to watch, but for me he really looks better than Federer on slow courts, thanks to his greater power and superb defense. I wouldn't bet that Roger will figure him out.

Allez
06-08-2006, 08:52 AM
Ljubicic is growing on moa. He seems like a nice guy. I was pissed off with his "I'm the world no. 2 player", but overall he seems like a good guy.
However I agree with Mirkaland, it's time for all these players to either put up or shut up.

almouchie
06-08-2006, 08:54 AM
i like ivan he is different
more a player & person that fans can relate to
he comes from a different background & struggled but made it
he always says thing u wouldnt expect other player to say
he is more normal & less calculates (like federer)
I wasnt too happy thou with him saying he wasnt impressived with rafa's record
I mean how can u not be impressed with 58 wins
He is confident & will go on the court thniking he has a chance to win

Guybrush
06-08-2006, 09:02 AM
and yes you have to worry about Roger on Clay, Grass, Indoor, Hard cant say same for Nadal

So true! Fedex is a tennis god, Rafa just a clay god.

connectolove
06-08-2006, 09:24 AM
So many people putting Rafa down! Rafa never goes out and says that he has the tools to defeat anybody, he suts up and does it. I hope he trashes everyone in RG!

scoobs
06-08-2006, 09:39 AM
Well we're down to the final 4 - and putting up is about all that's left to do in this tournament.

It'll all be over in 4 days and either Roger, Rafa, Ivan or David will be the champion.

The time for talking is done now.

bokehlicious
06-08-2006, 10:00 AM
So many people putting Rafa down! Rafa never goes out and says that he has the tools to defeat anybody, he suts up and does it. I hope he trashes everyone in RG!


How the hell can people be so cruel with a prefect nice guy like Rafa ? :sobbing: :sobbing: :rolleyes:

Castafiore
06-08-2006, 10:08 AM
Ljubicic has the right to his opinion.

Frankly, I think that his comment about not being impressed about that clay court streak is a bit on the ridiculous side of things but hey, if he feels that way...why not.

These top players are human like the rest of us. No need to put them on a pedestal and then compare how high up the pedestal of player 1 is vs the one of player 2. What's the point, guys?

Hey my guy is more liked than your guy...this ex-players wants my guy to win... :rolleyes: ...what is this? Kindergarten?...What's the point at the end of it all?
All that matters is who wins the matches, no?

bokehlicious
06-08-2006, 10:19 AM
Hey my guy is more liked than your guy...this ex-players wants my guy to win... :rolleyes: ...what is this? Kindergarten?...What's the point at the end of it all?
All that matters is who wins the matches, no?

Don't be sore honey, that's just players statements, nobody argued they were right, just their opinions, not that a big deal. ;) Btw, I let 'kindergarten' to vr.com :wavey:

Castafiore
06-08-2006, 10:23 AM
No need to be so bloody condescending, JMPower. There's no need for that.


sorry if I sound a bit pissed off...it's because many threads in GM are pissing me off...it's utterly silly, I know.
What people consider as 'fun' in MTF these days just looks like going from one stupid argument to the next to me without adding anything interesting in the process.

TheMightyFed
06-08-2006, 10:30 AM
Seems Rafa is a bit to pro players what the pusher or the human backboard is to you in your local club. Nobody manages to beat him and doesn't understand because his game is ugly and heterodox. It gets on everybody's nerves because they find this game very defensive and very secure. The guys who get beaten evacuate their frustration by insisting on the weakness: the style, like in your club when you say "The guy doesn't bend his knees" or "doesn't rotate his body". On tour, about Rafa you cannot say that, but what better style reference is there than Roger ?

There is one difference though, very often the pusher of your club is a bit cocky while Rafa is genuinely nice and humble.

Deivid23
06-08-2006, 10:37 AM
they also call each other after big wins, they must be :inlove: :lol:

Reading this post, it looks like Ljubicic is winning a lot of titles ;)

Deivid23
06-08-2006, 10:41 AM
And concerning the topic, I see no reason to jump on him, he´s entitled to have his opinion :shrug:

Deivid23
06-08-2006, 10:43 AM
The only thing is a bit stupid is when he says he is not impressed by Nadal´s number of consecutive wins on clay bc he was close to lose many times :lol: I remember just 3 times out of those 58 when he was close to lose. Anyway had Ivan achieved anything similar, I´m sure he wouldn´t think alike ;)

adee-gee
06-08-2006, 10:45 AM
Oh man. Is this the funniest post ever in terms of stupidity?

Theoretically, all of Nadal's opponents are in control of their destiny. If you don't make 50 ufes, then you win. Easier said than done.

Why is it that everyone is coming out and attacking this kid ? Roger has dominated for years, receiving nothing but kind wishes and compliments from his opponents. We're talking about a guy that's absolutely ruthless on court, yet is admired and respected by his adversaries.

Nadal's game is a joke, everyone's coming out of the woodworks and smacking this kid around for playing garbage tennis. Just keep retrieving the ball and shouting "Vamos!", one of these days Nadal is gonna take a fall and never get up from it.

Enjoy it while you have it. What garbage to watch. Period. Brutto.

We have guys like

Andre Agassi
Marat Safin
Rod Laver
and plenty of others, let's not include all of Nadal's opponents whom also have received their fair share of abuse from Roger, yet when push comes to shove are willing to concede that Mr. Federer is superior.

One thing remains constant ....

" He's only beating Roger because of the lefty thing "
" He's not in control blah blah, Roger choked "
" Roger is the best, he'll figure him out "

If Roger makes the Final and beats Nadal on Sunday, Nadal's career is over. End of story. He can't play for shit on hard courts or grass, if Roger takes away the only thing you have ... retire and save your body.
:cuckoo: :retard:

JCF
06-08-2006, 10:57 AM
I hope Nadal beats him down proper. Whatever he thinks about the streak, Ljubicic will never come close to a streak like that on any surface ever.

I actually think that him being ranked so high is not impressive seeing as that he is such a one dimensional player (even more so than Nadal, actually). Its just fortunate that there are alot of injuries to more talented players (ie Coria, Hewitt, Safin).

Monteque
06-08-2006, 01:07 PM
Soderling said Nadal could be beaten. Result? Rafa ****
Mathieu said Nadal could be beaten. Result? banana choking episode and Rafa win
Hewitt said Nadal could be beaten. Result? LOSS!!!
And how many times has federer said things like "o, i think im close to him, i was close, i had 2 match points in Rome and i choked terribly, i think i can beat him, i think he's one dimensional, his uncle is coaching him from the stands, he picks his ass too much, his pants make him look gay."

All this wild speculation, flaming insults, misinterpretation, and bathroom gossip should all be solved on Sunday, with the final. And, the final will be great, but the stuff on here will be awesome :drool:

I join grieved w/ you that all Yankees looks like a slice of cake for Fed. It is surely hard times for you :hug:

Monteque
06-08-2006, 01:08 PM
**double**

Guybrush
06-08-2006, 01:22 PM
I actually think that him being ranked so high is not impressive seeing as that he is such a one dimensional player
:cuckoo: :cuckoo: :cuckoo:

fooclate
06-08-2006, 02:35 PM
There is reason to be worried abt roger federer! he is after all ROGER FEDERER! He's not JUST a player like everyone else on the tour. He is FEDERER! But he's still human. He might seem invincible but who knows what can change in the coming semifinal. But i bet my chances that Federer is the MAN.

fooclate
06-08-2006, 02:40 PM
Federer or Nadal?

fooclate
06-08-2006, 02:44 PM
So many people putting Rafa down! Rafa never goes out and says that he has the tools to defeat anybody, he suts up and does it. I hope he trashes everyone in RG!
i dont think rafa is the kind of guy to trash everyone!! Hes seems more like a gentleman, an enthusiastic one! VAMOS RAFA

tangerine_dream
06-08-2006, 03:45 PM
Ljubicic has the right to his opinion.
Frankly, I think that his comment about not being impressed about that clay court streak is a bit on the ridiculous side of things but hey, if he feels that way...why not.
I don't think the Federer fans would be saying what a nice guy Ivan is if he had been just as dismissive of Roger's streaks (anybody who says that Roger's or Rafa's streaks aren't impressive is :cuckoo: ) After all, they didn't handle Tommy Haas' comments very well.

I join grieved w/ you that all Yankees looks like a slice of cake for Fed. It is surely hard times for you :hug:
Am I reading this right? Did you just call Rafael a *yankee*?

And concerning the topic, I see no reason to jump on him, he´s entitled to have his opinion :shrug:
Said he who promptly jumped on PMac for stating his own (MTF unpopular) opinion.

NYCtennisfan
06-08-2006, 05:06 PM
I thought Ivan's comment about Nadal being more aggressive on hardcourts was interesting. Nadal does mix it up more on the hardcourts, hitting bigger serves, and his FH DTL is a big weapon on faster surfaces.

Just like in all professions, people have their preferred methods about how to accomplish things. Many of the players that have commented have said they admire the artistry and shotmaking of Federer's game i.e. Safin, Agassi, etc. There is an inherent bias towards attacking/shotmaking/aggressive/big weapons in tennis that goes all the way back to juniors and junior circuit coaches. Players like Nadal and Hewitt don't fit that mold, so they are easier to dismiss.

Everyone is entitled to their opinions of what style they prefer just like in everyday life, but it is impossible to discount Nadal's success. Very few players since the 2000 season have accumlated 4500+ ranking points. He may not have a beautiful game, he may not hit winners from everywhere, but he also doesn't lose very often. If players are going to make all these comments about Nadal, they better start beating him.

Tom_Bombadil
06-08-2006, 05:13 PM
You read the title of this post and you jump to the conclusion the guy who made the post must be a little biased against Nadal. Why? Simply because he 'chooses' the wrong sentence.

Ljubo clearly stated Nadal was the clear favourite between the 4 who were at the semifinals.

Then he's asked and for sure he makes a pretty fair statement. Roger is more dangerous because he's number one. But he wasn't talking about RG.

Horatio Caine
06-08-2006, 05:15 PM
Ljubo had a piss-easy draw...Bilbo's grandma would have spanked most of his opposition :rolleyes:

Can't wait for Nadal to stamp him into the clay :bounce: :devil:

adee-gee
06-08-2006, 05:53 PM
Ljubo had a piss-easy draw...Bilbo's grandma would have spanked most of his opposition :rolleyes:

Can't wait for Nadal to stamp him into the clay :bounce: :devil:
:haha:

Bilbo's grandma would spank anyone though, she's the best :worship:

jh21
06-08-2006, 06:22 PM
head to head does not matter. in all sports you're measured by how many championships you've won, period.

right now comparing rafa to roger is like comparing kuerten and sampras. i mean you got one player who was great on one surface and the other player a freakin legend.

granted rafa is still really young and has a chance to be great(dont get me wrong), but at this moment making a comparison is just foolish. talk to me about how great rafa is after he's won as many slams as federer has.

jenanun
06-08-2006, 07:43 PM
:haha:

what has ljubicic got to worried about roger???

he is always going to lose anyway...

Deivid23
06-08-2006, 08:00 PM
Said he who promptly jumped on PMac for stating his own (MTF unpopular) opinion.

Can´t u read honey? I jumped on him bc of his ridiculous dismissal at Nadal´s chances last year, he should know better the players before talking bullshit and you should also learn to understand what u´ve just read before writing nonsense :retard:

DrJules
06-08-2006, 08:48 PM
Didnt he beat Feds in Dubai, on hard? and in 2004 in Miami, at 17?


Rafael's easiest win over Roger was his first in 2004 and his most difficult was his last in 2006. Each match on a clay court has been getting closer. Roger has won more points in 2 of the last 3 defeats.

It could be going the way of the Roger-Lleyton rivalry. Lleyton did well in their early encounters then Roger gradually won more and more.

jenanun
06-08-2006, 10:11 PM
Rafael's easiest win over Roger was his first in 2004 and his most difficult was his last in 2006. Each match on a clay court has been getting closer. Roger has won more points in 2 of the last 3 defeats.

It could be going the way of the Roger-Lleyton rivalry. Lleyton did well in their early encounters then Roger gradually won more and more.

tennis is not like football, its doesnt matter how many points you won...

its about whether you can win the important one....e.g. bp, sp, mp.....

so between them, its not only about tennis

but also the mental test......

stebs
06-08-2006, 10:31 PM
tennis is not like football, its doesnt matter how many points you won...

its about whether you can win the important one....e.g. bp, sp, mp.....

so between them, its not only about tennis

but also the mental test......
I don't think you quite understand the point DrJules was making. I think (s)he means not that the amount of points won is important in terms of being counted as a win. It most certainly isn't but you can't honestl say that a win is always the same so long as it's a win. The fact that Roger had MP's against Rafa in Rome and won more overall points is very important as it shows that Roger can be every bit as good as Rafa on clay.

stebs
06-08-2006, 10:36 PM
It could be going the way of the Roger-Lleyton rivalry. Lleyton did well in their early encounters then Roger gradually won more and more.

Although I have no doubt about the fact that regardless of the result of a possible RG final Roger will beat Rafa in the next year I think there are two main differences between the two rivalries.

Firstly I don't think Roger will ever dominate Rafa like he dominate's Lleyton. I think Rafa is better than Roger on clay, Roger can still win a match or two but overall Rafa is better. This is not true of Lleyton on any surface and for this reason I think Rafa will always keep up in the H-2-H because the pair are likely to meet more on clay than any other surface as Roger can beat everyone bar Rafa on clay but there are sveral players who can take out Rafa on a hard court.

The second point is that Lleyton began winning matches against Roger before Roger was number.1 and a contender for best player of all time and a 7 time GS champion. Roger improved overall an awful lot while at the same time totally reversing that H-2-H. I am not sure if Roger has hit his peak yet but if he hasn't he certainly can't rise much more than he already has. This shows that as Rafa can keep in touch and more now it is possible to assume that Rafa will always be able to keep in touch and make life tough for Roger even if the H-2-H is reversed to some extent.

Geniey2g
06-08-2006, 10:36 PM
How the hell does this even make sense??: I'm not impressed with that streak. I mean, it's fantastic results. But he was close of losing matches so many times that, as I said before

?

The fact that he was so close to losing some of those matches makes it even more impressive, doesn't it?? Silly Luby *shakes head* Really hope Rafa beats him tomorrow.

croat123
06-08-2006, 10:45 PM
he said that nadal is the top favorite to win the event, but that he is more worried about playing roger than nadal. that's because you always know what you are up against when u play nadal but roger can even go a level higher when needed (altho he ironically fails to do that against nadal but is able to against anyone else).

do we really need 8 pages to understand this :o

croat123
06-08-2006, 10:46 PM
How the hell does this even make sense??: I'm not impressed with that streak. I mean, it's fantastic results. But he was close of losing matches so many times that, as I said before

?

The fact that he was so close to losing some of those matches makes it even more impressive, doesn't it?? Silly Luby *shakes head* Really hope Rafa beats him tomorrow.
he said the streak was fantasic, but that he believes he can end it

wtf is he supposed to say:
"oh yeah, rafa's streak, it's amazing, no way in hell i can stop it"

rofe
06-08-2006, 10:57 PM
he said the streak was fantasic, but that he believes he can end it

wtf is he supposed to say:
"oh yeah, rafa's streak, it's amazing, no way in hell i can stop it"

That is basically what he said. Some people have a way of twisting a player's words to suit their own premise.

He has to be pumped before he goes into a match like that because it is one of the most difficult (if not the most difficult) matches he is likely to encouter on clay.

Geniey2g
06-08-2006, 11:09 PM
he said the streak was fantasic, but that he believes he can end it

wtf is he supposed to say:
"oh yeah, rafa's streak, it's amazing, no way in hell i can stop it"
"He said the streak was fantastic"

But yet he's not impressed.


Anyway...

oneandonlyhsn
06-08-2006, 11:14 PM
he said that nadal is the top favorite to win the event, but that he is more worried about playing roger than nadal. that's because you always know what you are up against when u play nadal but roger can even go a level higher when needed (altho he ironically fails to do that against nadal but is able to against anyone else).

do we really need 8 pages to understand this :o

On MTF yes, common sense is as common as seeing toothfairies

jenanun
06-08-2006, 11:26 PM
The fact that Roger had MP's against Rafa in Rome and won more overall points is very important as it shows that Roger can be every bit as good as Rafa on clay.

so you are saying federer is better than nadal on clay...
ok, lets say it is... coz he won more point. fair enough....

so how come he couldnt beat nadal? even on hard?

its about mental strength, which is important in all sports game....
its one of nadal's best weapon....

obviously federer is weaker than nadal in this area...

which means, good tennis alone is just not quite enough.... when you are playing against nadal

scoobs
06-08-2006, 11:57 PM
Roger has the game and the weapons to beat Rafa on clay. We know this from Rome.

The area that is in question is his mental strength in the really tight situations when he wants it very badly.

Basically his five set record is not that hot for a world #1 (9-10), he's never won a fifth set tiebreaker in his career (0-2) though irrelevant for Roland, and he has faltered on big moments against Safin (AO 05), Nalbandian (Masters Cup 05) and Nadal (Rome 06).

Roger can get himself into a winning position against Rafa but will be be able to close it out?

oneandonlyhsn
06-09-2006, 12:05 AM
so you are saying federer is better than nadal on clay...
ok, lets say it is... coz he won more point. fair enough....

so how come he couldnt beat nadal? even on hard?

its about mental strength, which is important in all sports game....
its one of nadal's best weapon....

obviously federer is weaker than nadal in this area...

which means, good tennis alone is just not quite enough.... when you are playing against nadal

:lol: From what I read from Stebs, she didnt say that Fed is better than Rafa just merely that he has shown that he is as good as him in the Rome final. I dont think that equates better, unless my English comprehension sucks

Apemant
06-09-2006, 11:06 AM
I don't think you quite understand the point DrJules was making. I think (s)he means not that the amount of points won is important in terms of being counted as a win. It most certainly isn't but you can't honestl say that a win is always the same so long as it's a win. The fact that Roger had MP's against Rafa in Rome and won more overall points is very important as it shows that Roger can be every bit as good as Rafa on clay.

BTW, did people comment your signature? Did anyone ask what it meant? ;)

Monteque
06-09-2006, 11:51 AM
Am I reading this right? Did you just call Rafael a *yankee*?




No. I pointed out to all Yankees that Fed hammered, not including the spaniard. And somebody (imo) got pissed because of that. :devil:

Guybrush
06-09-2006, 12:32 PM
BTW, did people comment your signature? Did anyone ask what it meant? ;)

It's all clear. A possible non-calendar Grand Slam ;)

Apemant
06-09-2006, 01:59 PM
It's all clear. A possible non-calendar Grand Slam ;)

:devil:

Apemant
06-09-2006, 02:05 PM
"He said the streak was fantastic"

But yet he's not impressed.


Anyway...


By 'impressed' I suppose he meant 'intimidated'. You know, when you are 'impressed' with someone, so you can't even play well because you think all the time 'sheesh, I'm playing with a guy who didn't lose a match on this surface for more than a freaking year!!'.

That's how you should read his 'not impressed' statement. That the streak won't affect this match just because of its awesomeness.

Geniey2g
06-09-2006, 02:28 PM
By 'impressed' I suppose he meant 'intimidated'. You know, when you are 'impressed' with someone, so you can't even play well because you think all the time 'sheesh, I'm playing with a guy who didn't lose a match on this surface for more than a freaking year!!'.

That's how you should read his 'not impressed' statement. That the streak won't affect this match just because of its awesomeness.
If that's the case, I'll put it down to either: A- A bad translation or B- Luby's command of English is not 100%; i.e. his words can easily be mis-interpreted. So just calm down, croat 123 :rolleyes: