Shanghai organizers not happy with Agassi [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Shanghai organizers not happy with Agassi

ToanNguyen
11-15-2005, 01:48 PM
Agassi's record in Shanghai is now 0-4. He lost in the first round of an ATP tournament here in 2001 and withdrew from the 2002 Masters Cup, blaming a hip injury, after two losses.

Wang Liqun, deputy director of the organizing committee, told a news conference Tuesday that Agassi should have notified tournament officials before quitting.

"He doesn't want to make any personal comments on Andre Agassi's decision, however he certainly is not appreciative of what he did, and particularly because he actually made the sudden announcement without notifying anyone," an interpreter said of Wang's comments.

Qin Weichang, director of the organizing committee, agreed.

"Frankly, he's extremely popular in Shanghai, particularly among female fans. We, therefore, have already conveyed in talks with the ATP, asking them to convey to Andre Agassi that he needs to probably return this kind of favor, react to this kind of strong passion from the audience and show his professionalism here."

David Higdon, ATP senior vice president, Communications, said Agassi had been an "exemplary" ambassador for tennis.

"He's in obvious pain. We wish he could have hung around, but that was not possible," he said.



I like Agassi but I think the organizers have a point. Just by courtesy, he should have informed the organizers first.

artlinkletter
11-15-2005, 01:50 PM
I just read his post match interview and he was asked several times whether he would continue to play and he said no. So was that the first time anyone knew that he would withdraw?

R.Federer
11-15-2005, 01:51 PM
So the problem is that instead of telling the organizer, he announed it to media first?

ToanNguyen
11-15-2005, 01:57 PM
I believe so. I guess that is why the organizers are upset and I think they have a right to do so. I suppose Agassi just decide then and there but I doubt it. He should have inform them first though.

TheBoiledEgg
11-15-2005, 02:09 PM
Masters Cup organisers have slammed Andre Agassi after his withdrawal from the Shanghai tournament.



The former world number one pulled out with an ankle injury following his defeat to Nicolay Davydenko on Monday.

Agassi joins top-five players Andy Roddick, Marat Safin and Lleyton Hewitt on the sidelines.

"I don't appreciate what Agassi is doing. He made the announcement without telling anyone," said organising committee deputy director Wang Liqun.

"In 2000, when Agassi came for the Heineken Open, he took an early exit in the first round.

"Two years later in the Masters Cup, after two defeats, he cited a hip injury and took off. This year it happened again." Agassi hurt ankle ligaments playing racquetball four weeks ago and did not appear to be fit against Davydenko.

amierin
11-15-2005, 02:29 PM
Agassi gets away with his high handed behavior in the States because the ATP/USTA covers for him. The milquetoast response by the ATP rep in this case proves my point.

OTOH there were rumors for days about another pull out which was why Puerta was Shanghai to begin with. Most people thought it was Agassi but it was Nadal. Nadal however seems to have worked with tournament organizers going so far as to see a doctor there as well as his own and the ATP doctor. When the opinions concurred he gave in. The organizers know they lost one of their main draws but Nadal left a good feeling in his departure. Agassi doesn't care what the tournament organizers think and it shows.

Neely
11-15-2005, 02:33 PM
Sure, I can understand the organizers. They have a right to be not happy.

dylan24
11-15-2005, 02:40 PM
agassi should have not played at all

TheMightyFed
11-15-2005, 02:44 PM
Not very pro from Agassi. Don't show up if you can't play... plus the cultural aspect, you don't make a Chinese "lose face" like that, especially if they spend millions building a nice venue for you...
Without Federer this Masters Cup would really be a disaster...

naiwen
11-15-2005, 02:55 PM
Yup, the organizers have the right to know first. I don't want to say Agassi is selfish, but he can't just play and quit after loss.

If Agassi and Nadal were not 100% fit, they should have stayed home like Roddick. I understand that nobody wants to get injured, but their withdrawals could ruin this event and decrease the alternates' chances (since it's a RR tournament).

wcr
11-15-2005, 03:03 PM
Does anyone here know how long the YEC will be held in Shanghai?

It's a pity that Agassi didn't follow protocol for pulling out of the event. I did not see his match and do not know if his injury was affecting his play. If it was, and the press were asking him about it during a post match interview, then his announcement that he wouldn't play on would seem to be more spontaneous than a slight against tournament officials. So many hurt feelings!

The tournament organizers who expect 100% from players at the end of the season are not paying attention to what the current schedule is doing to the athletes. Their investment in their tournament is their risk. If you're going to put up that kind of moola, you better understand your risk and not whine about it when the situation plays itself out.

artlinkletter
11-15-2005, 03:04 PM
Next year its at Shanghai as well. Not sure about 2007.

sweetiepiedoll
11-15-2005, 03:06 PM
I think that during Agassi's extended vacation he should reconsider whether he should play anymore. I really think that he should give retirement some serious thought because it doesn't seem like he cares for playing anymore. He suffers from ankle injuries and he has to have some medicine injected into his back just to relieve his back pain - to me that is a little bit too much. If he decides to play next year, I hope wins either the RG, Wimbly or the two TMS titles he doesn't have (Hamburg, Monte-Carlo??). Otherwise, I would be sad to see him go, but sometimes retirement is inevitable.

amierin
11-15-2005, 03:06 PM
Does anyone here know how long the YEC will be held in Shanghai?

It's a pity that Agassi didn't follow protocol for pulling out of the event. I did not see his match and do not know if his injury was affecting his play. If it was, and the press were asking him about it during a post match interview, then his announcement that he wouldn't play on would seem to be more spontaneous than a slight against tournament officials. So many hurt feelings!

The tournament organizers who expect 100% from players at the end of the season are not paying attention to what the current schedule is doing to the athletes. Their investment in their tournament is their risk. If you're going to put up that kind of moola, you better understand your risk and not whine about it when the situation plays itself out.

As someone above mentioned Agassi's actions caused the organizer to "lose face", something that is very important in Asian culture. Ugly Americanism has reared its head again.

TheMightyFed
11-15-2005, 03:08 PM
The tournament organizers who expect 100% from players at the end of the season are not paying attention to what the current schedule is doing to the athletes. Their investment in their tournament is their risk. If you're going to put up that kind of moola, you better understand your risk and not whine about it when the situation plays itself out.
The funky stuff is that despite all this mess there is no one guy who can say : "OK let's be serious, next year indoor season will start earlier or we cut one tournament, or we impose limited number or exhibitions or small tournies for top players" , or whatever. Nobody can do something about that. This is pure bureaucraty and the stupidest display in sport since last US F1 Grand Prix...

revolution
11-15-2005, 03:11 PM
Agassi really was crocked, you could tell watching it he wasn't in a condition to play, so he was right to withdraw, although Shanghai have a right to be aggrieved.

peteslamz
11-15-2005, 03:12 PM
Does anyone here know how long the YEC will be held in Shanghai?


The YEC in Shanghai will be until 2007

wcr
11-15-2005, 03:14 PM
As someone above mentioned Agassi's actions caused the organizer to "lose face", something that is very important in Asian culture. Ugly Americanism has reared its head again.

You are assuming that Agassi fully understands what it means to "lose face" in Asian culture. How do you know this to be true? Is there a training course offered by the ATP that teaches all the athletes exactly how they are to conduct themselves in each of the foreign countries they visit? I have noticed plenty of foreign athletes travelling in the United States who are not well schooled in American culture and think nothing of insulting the citizens of that country when they visit.

These are athletes, not trained diplomats. The officials in Shanghai know they are not paying Colin Powell to play tennis.

ToanNguyen
11-15-2005, 03:16 PM
The tournament organizers who expect 100% from players at the end of the season are not paying attention to what the current schedule is doing to the athletes. Their investment in their tournament is their risk. If you're going to put up that kind of moola, you better understand your risk and not whine about it when the situation plays itself out.

I don't think the organizers are whining about the fact that Agassi pulling out. They are not happy about it for sure. But it's how he did it. He should have informed them first that he will be pulling out because of injuries. Not just announced to the press first. It's courtesy. I think his publicist should have known that. It's just bad manners in my opinion.
It's true that it's a gamble on the organizers but Agassi should be more professional. It's the right thing to do.
Just think that they are not that upset with Nadal but with Agassi. That shows that Agassi must have pissed them off in other ways than simply just withdraw.

wcr
11-15-2005, 03:20 PM
Agassi really was crocked, you could tell watching it he wasn't in a condition to play, so he was right to withdraw, although Shanghai have a right to be aggrieved.

What I'm curious about is Agassi's post match interview. If he'd gone straight into the press room and when asked about his condition, answered honestly without thinking about the chain-of-command and who should know first. I am certain he was disappointed about his match and physical condition. Perhaps he should have sucked-it-up, dodged the question in the post match interview, notified the tournament officials, and, then, held another press conference before leaving Shanghai (I presume he's gone).

After all the hullabaloo, he's probably already apologized, not to mentioned, learned his lesson about "saving face." It's unlikely he'll ever play there again and that alone should make the tournament officials very happy.

TheMightyFed
11-15-2005, 03:26 PM
The officials in Shanghai know they are not paying Colin Powell to play tennis.
Maybe he would have beaten Coria on this surface... :devil:

NYCtennisfan
11-15-2005, 03:44 PM
You can see why the organizers would be upset, but there is nothing that can be done if he is indeed injured like he says. This probably also has a lot to do with all the other players pulling out and the frustration just boiling over.

ToanNguyen
11-15-2005, 03:45 PM
Another article about Agassi. Same thing but I like the comment about the Mercedes car. :) :) :worship: :worship: Classic.
Shanghai - Disappointed Chinese organisers have laid down the law to the ATP after ankle and foot injury pullouts from Andre Agassi and Rafael Nadal transformed the end-of-season elite extravaganza into a sorry spectacle.

'We feel like we bought a Mercedes-Benz only to find 60 per cent of the auto parts are no longer the original ones we paid for,' thundered Wang Liqun, deputy director of the organising committee.

'I certainly hope the ATP will turn this situation around to make it better and in this way to be responsible for the public,' he said as the subject of ticket refunds was raised.

'We certainly would like to have this branded product. If so, the public will be happy.'

With local government footing much of the bill for a minimum three-year run for what is touted as a battle among the year's tennis best, the ATP's reputation - and Chinese 'face' - is on the line.

Only Roger Federer remains in the field as a global name, with the rest of the players less than well-known among the general public.

'We feel sorry for our endorsers, media and fans. It's kind of difficult for us to explain to them,' said Wang. 'The product was supposed to be a quality one.

'Therefore, we expected the delivery right there. In other words, we expected this product to be perfect or to be good.

With Chinese prestige in the balance, he added: 'Right now, the product itself leaves a lot to be desired.'

With bills from what was reported as a 200-million-dollar stadium project still coming in, officials are keen to insure that a public relations disaster on this scale is never repeated at the Qi Zhong arena.

Castafiore
11-15-2005, 03:47 PM
Well, nice to see that the other players (other than Roger) still in this tournament are treated as 'chopped liver' :rolleyes:

buddyholly
11-15-2005, 03:50 PM
If Agassi was somewhat injured before the tourney, but did not want to let the fans down, then I would not criticise him for not pulling out earlier.
As for the slight to the organisers, that could just be a misunderstanding, rather than rudeness.

TheMightyFed
11-15-2005, 03:51 PM
This is the kind of wake-up call that ATP and tennis world needed to move their ass... what a shame...

PaulieM
11-15-2005, 03:54 PM
Well, nice to see that the other players (other than Roger) still in this tournament are treated as 'chopped liver' :rolleyes:
i don't see how saying that they are less known by the chinese public is treating them like crap :shrug: i'm sure the tournament is glad that they have somebody to play, but it's a fact that this isn't what they had expected, and it could very well hurt them financially. as good as those guys are, it's not the same as having all the top 5 players there etc. :shrug:

lau
11-15-2005, 03:55 PM
Another article about Agassi. Same thing but I like the comment about the Mercedes car. :) :) :worship: :worship: Classic.
Would you please give us the link to that article (or the news agency)? :)

EDIT: Don´t worry, I found it... :D http://sport.monstersandcritics.com/tennis/article_1062184.php/Masters_Cup_needs_image_repair_after_players_exodu s and dpa - Deutsche Presse-Agentur

TheMightyFed
11-15-2005, 03:57 PM
Do you think in his mind the fake Mercedes spare parts were coming from China ? :devil:

ToanNguyen
11-15-2005, 04:03 PM
:haha: :haha: :bigclap: Do you think in his mind the fake Mercedes spare parts were coming from China ? :devil:

That's the good one.
But I think he meant the parts are used. Not 100% functioning anymore.

case
11-15-2005, 04:14 PM
Agassi not knowing the correct way to withdraw? Or not understanding that the organizers would be upset on hearing the news second hand? I can't believe someone who spent most of his life traveling the world, would be clueless that their might be negative cultural issues involved, too. I'm not Chinese and I would see it as an insult too!

I might buy that with a younger player, but not Agassi. He knows by now tournament protocal.
I used to like Agassi, but now he is turning into someone who only seems to be showing up for his ego. I watched the match and watched his foot (since dumb ESPN showed it AGAIN) last night and never saw him have trouble with his ankle. He did, however, look like garbage out there.

I rarely get to see tennis here in the US, and this can't help networks in wanting to show more of it. He and the ATP are hurting their own business.
Im mad about the whole year.

LeeHesh
11-15-2005, 04:38 PM
As someone above mentioned Agassi's actions caused the organizer to "lose face", something that is very important in Asian culture. Ugly Americanism has reared its head again.

Ahh...ugly patronishing multiculturalism--based on the superficial knowledge of cultural stereotypes--rears its head again. :)

mangoes
11-15-2005, 04:45 PM
As someone above mentioned Agassi's actions caused the organizer to "lose face", something that is very important in Asian culture. Ugly Americanism has reared its head again.


Why attribute this to Americanism? I just don't understand why people like to jump on Americans so quickly. When Hewitt acts like an a$$, should I attribute it to Australianism? When Grojean and Nadal had that long interruption during the French Open, and Grojean seemed to not do anything to stop it, should I attribute it to the Frenchism? NO...........Because that isn't the country or culture, that's the individual's choice.

PamV
11-15-2005, 04:55 PM
I like Agassi but I think the organizers have a point. Just by courtesy, he should have informed the organizers first.

What difference would it have made if he told the organizers first? That wouldn't have changed anything.

Margy
11-15-2005, 05:04 PM
Agassi not knowing the correct way to withdraw? Or not understanding that the organizers would be upset on hearing the news second hand? I can't believe someone who spent most of his life traveling the world, would be clueless that their might be negative cultural issues involved, too. I'm not Chinese and I would see it as an insult too!

I might buy that with a younger player, but not Agassi. He knows by now tournament protocal.
I totally agree. Agassi has been around long enough to know how things should be done. He has been referred to as "the elder statesman" on the tour and is usually quite eloquent and political in his comments.
However, the whole situation there as far as timing of his decision while the tournament officials were still reeling from Nadal's announcement and scurrying to get Puerta into gear makes it more likely that this blow-up is just a result of hectic circumstances. Agassi may have been in the interview (scheduled or impromptu?) before he had a chance to connect with the proper tournament official and felt he was doing the right thing in making the announcement as soon as he made his decision to withdraw so that the next alternate had as much notice as possible to be prepared. Not being there personally to see how the whole thing developed and knowing how Agassi is usually a good ambassador for the sport, I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt here. It's unfortunate for the event, but I think the overreaction is due to this being the latest of too many complications/setbacks for what everyone had hoped would be a great season ending event and obviously has turned into a major dissapointment for all.

Socket
11-15-2005, 05:05 PM
Shanghai - Disappointed Chinese organisers have laid down the law to the ATP after ankle and foot injury pullouts from Andre Agassi and Rafael Nadal transformed the end-of-season elite extravaganza into a sorry spectacle.

'We feel like we bought a Mercedes-Benz only to find 60 per cent of the auto parts are no longer the original ones we paid for,' thundered Wang Liqun, deputy director of the organising committee.

'I certainly hope the ATP will turn this situation around to make it better and in this way to be responsible for the public,' he said as the subject of ticket refunds was raised.

'We certainly would like to have this branded product. If so, the public will be happy.'
Gee, I wonder if Nalbandian & Co. are wishing they're playing in Houston right now after reading that comment.

tangerine_dream
11-15-2005, 05:13 PM
I watched the match and watched his foot (since dumb ESPN showed it AGAIN) last night and never saw him have trouble with his ankle.
Ridiculous. Just because you can't see a player's injury on your TV does not mean it doesn't exist.

I don't see Federer having much problems with his ankle either but I don't doubt that he's probably hurting right about now and is getting therapy for it every night.

Baseline
11-15-2005, 05:14 PM
IMO some of the withdrawals were influenced more by the type of surface than injuries. Agassi's record on Teraflex is poor. If MC were on a fast hard court instead of the fastest carpet used on the tour, Agassi wouldn't have looked like a poor player in the Davydenko match. Perhaps he's trying to save face too? Nadal has struggled with injuries for months now, but they do not always prevent him from entering and winning tournaments.

Even if players want to improve on Teraflex there aren't many opportunities. The only tour events on it are in France and Russia during the fall indoor carpet season (Lyon, Paris MS, St. Pete, Kremlin Cup) and two of these events overlap. Since Teraflex is made by French company Gerflor I guess it makes sense to see the surface used mainly in France. Why Russia though? And why for MC? IMO it was an extremely poor choice of surface for Master's Cup if the goal is to attract and retain the top players who often skip the Paris MS entirely and rarely play the fall carpet events. If the goal is to reward the player in best form during the season leading up to the Master's Cup then Teraflex is an excellent choice.

ToanNguyen
11-15-2005, 05:20 PM
What difference would it have made if he told the organizers first? That wouldn't have changed anything.
It doesn't make any difference but it's the courtesy, as I have said before. Otherwise, it's just rude.
But hey, that's life. Everyone is different. Some think of others and some don't.
I still like Agassi alot though. Just a little bit disappointed, that's all.

wcr
11-15-2005, 05:24 PM
Embattled tournament director Brad Drewett, who competed in the first men's professional event held in China nearly two and a half decades ago, put down the misfortune to simple bad luck.

'Both Raf and Andre being injured in one day is extraordinary. In many ways it's the perfect storm (http://sport.monstersandcritics.com/tennis/article_1062184.php/Masters_Cup_needs_image_repair_after_players_exodu s#) -- or the imperfect storm. It's just incredibly unfortunate.'

The former player cited the pure physical exertion of the modern game as part of the problem. He called for 'vigorous debate' on ways to halt the worrying trend.

With calls going out for months on shortening the season, that option seems unlikely due to the 'Balkanisation' of the games - ATP, ITF and dozens of sanctioned tournaments all have their own agendas.

'The nature of the sport -- one-on-one battle, there are going to be injuries,' said Drewett. 'However, we do need to look at addressing some of the issues in terms of schedule.

'I don't think it's as simple as saying if the season was shorter, if the guys played less, that these injuries wouldn't occur.'



Yes Brad, let's have a "vigorous debate on ways to halt the worrying trend." What have you got in mind? Cancelling your own event? Or, perhaps cancelling the European indoor season and moving the Shanghai YEC up to the end of September?

The athletes need more than a 2 week break at year end. This losing face situation is not really about Agassi, it's about the tournament officials who, full well knowing about the problems of over sceduling the top athletes, promised the locals they could deliver a "Mercedes Benz" event. The egg they are wearing on their face wasn't placed there by Agassi.

*Ljubica*
11-15-2005, 05:24 PM
What difference would it have made if he told the organizers first? That wouldn't have changed anything.

No difference to his withdrawal - just a case of good manners, courtesy and respect to his "hosts" in Shanghai.

Socket
11-15-2005, 05:30 PM
Agassi is in a lose-lose situation. He gets hell from the press if he doesn't 'fess up in his post-match interview that he's withdrawing, since the interview is the basis of their articles, and he gets hell from the tournament officials if he doesn't tell them first. Typically, a player's manager or agent will handle informing officials and the ATP of a withdrawal, so let's assume that there was an inadvertent delay in that and not a deliberate attempt by Agassi to insult the event's organizers, much less one based in cultural differences.

ToanNguyen
11-15-2005, 05:32 PM
No difference to his withdrawal - just a case of good manners, courtesy and respect to his "hosts" in Shanghai.
Second that.

Neely
11-15-2005, 05:33 PM
Ridiculous. Just because you can't see a player's injury on your TV does not mean it doesn't exist.
Very true what you're saying, Tangy! :yeah: But we always have lots of experts here who can tell you by watching on TV and who see whether a player fakes an injury or not, if a player is really injured or if he takes a strategic/gamesmanship injury timeout or if the break is for real :rolleyes: ;)

Lee
11-15-2005, 05:35 PM
No difference to his withdrawal - just a case of good manners, courtesy and respect to his "hosts" in Shanghai.

I second that but you can't expect someone with bad manners, etc understand the difference ;)

Lee
11-15-2005, 05:40 PM
For those arguing that Agassi was put in the press conference right after the match, thus he didn't have time to inform the tournament, then I have this question. Didn't he check with tournament doctor or trainer before he make the decision?

If he had time to check with doctor or trainer, I can't see why he didn't have time to inform the tournament. And if he didn't and just said he's pulling out, then it's a very unrespectful behaviour from him.

case
11-15-2005, 05:52 PM
Very true what you're saying, Tangy! :yeah: But we always have lots of experts here who can tell you by watching on TV and who see whether a player fakes an injury or not, if a player is really injured or if he takes a strategic/gamesmanship injury timeout or if the break is for real :rolleyes: ;)


What I said was that I saw no evidence of him having trouble with his ankle. And for that matter, if Gilbert or McEnroe saw him limping, wincing, rubbing, holding, calling the trainer, crying, screaming, hobbling, or crawling on his knees, they didn't mention it.

I DID NOT MENTION FAKING AN INJURY-
YOU DID! :eek:

Lee
11-15-2005, 05:54 PM
What I said was that I saw no evidence of him having trouble with his ankle. And for that matter, if Gilbert or McEnroe saw him limping, wincing, rubbing, holding, calling the trainer, crying, screaming, hobbling, or crawling on his knees, they didn't mention it.

I DID NOT MENTION FAKING AN INJURY-
YOU DID! :eek:

When I watched the match last night (ESPN2 showed it again), PMac already talked about Agassi was going to pull out after he was broken in 2nd set. And I was wondering what's going on there?

kiro
11-15-2005, 05:55 PM
Well, I was at the after match press conference of Agassi.
Yes, he went to the press room directly from the match. Immediately after he lost the match.
He just sat down and started to complain a lot about his body and his ankle. And then he said he wouldn't continue playing. Everybody was surprised. They made confirmation with him for several times, as you can see.

About the match vs Davydenko. Everyone who watched the match could see that Agassi was not playing for win, let's say, from the mid of the 2nd set, he's kind of tanking the whole match off. Davydenko also said that "It seemed he just wanted it ends quickly".
Well, if he really was hurt and felt that he's not gonna continue, why not ask for trainer, and just withdraw during the match? No need to finish a match by tanking those points. And why not go to see the tournament doctor, the ATP or the organizers before pull out?

And the organizers, I do think they have their points. And, I'd say, not only because of Agassi's withdrawn.

You know that Hilton Hotel is the tournament's official hotel. The organizers arranged rooms for all the players in the hotel. (They've always been good to Agassi. In 2002, Agassi's room was even better than Hewitt's, though Hewitt was the top seed.)
This year, they arranged everything for Agassi too. But in the last minute, the day before Agassi's arrival at Shanghai, he told the organizers that he was not going to stay in Hilton Hotel, and appointed another hotel.
It was embarassing, but the organizers managed to arrange it for him. So, with all the other players and relatives staying in Hilton Hotel, Agassi stayed in the hotel he asked for.
And when Agassi committed to come to Shanghai, the organizers and some sponsors like Adidas, Head, they arranged some activities, which Agassi agreed to present. They have everything settled. But Agassi just broke his promise after his defeat, saying "No I won't do it any more" and left. Now the organizers have to deal with the anger from those big sponsors.

They've really spent a lot of effort to make Agassi satisfied. But what did they get from Agassi? And this is not the first time.

Lee
11-15-2005, 06:01 PM
They've really spent a lot of effort to make Agassi satisfied. But what did they get from Agassi? And this is not the first time.

I agree with you Kiro but

as you said, this is not the first time and the organiser should know his track record and should have enough warnings to the sponsors. :shrug:

I only want to laugh whenever people say Agassi is a nice guy. :p

kiro
11-15-2005, 06:06 PM
I agree with you Kiro but

as you said, this is not the first time and the organiser should know his track record and should have enough warnings to the sponsors. :shrug:

I only want to laugh whenever people say Agassi is a nice guy. :p

The driver, who droved for him at TMC 2002, once said that Agassi never said a single word of thanks to him.
IMO Agassi always pretends to be a nice guy in front of the media.
Everytime he's facing the camera, he gives a big smile and blows kisses. But without the spotlight, he's cold as ice.

uNIVERSE mAN
11-15-2005, 06:17 PM
He's blowing kisses to his sponsors.

DrJules
11-15-2005, 06:23 PM
Agassi says that his injury occurred a few weeks ago. He probably should not have played and told the organisers of his condition before he even played. By playing unfit it now means his replacement carries forward 1 defeat from the first match and has a much lower chance of qualifying for the semi-final.

ToanNguyen
11-15-2005, 06:27 PM
And when Agassi committed to come to Shanghai, the organizers and some sponsors like Adidas, Head, they arranged some activities, which Agassi agreed to present. They have everything settled. But Agassi just broke his promise after his defeat, saying "No I won't do it any more" and left. Now the organizers have to deal with the anger from those big sponsors.

If this is true then I really feel that Agassi should have stayed and be at those activities. I am sure that it won't aggravate his injuries further. But he should be committed to his responsibility.
I truely feel bad for the organizers. They must be fuming if they went through all the trouble and get nothing in return.

tennis elbow
11-15-2005, 06:44 PM
The athletes need more than a 2 week break at year end. This losing face situation is not really about Agassi, it's about the tournament officials who, full well knowing about the problems of over sceduling the top athletes, promised the locals they could deliver a "Mercedes Benz" event. The egg they are wearing on their face wasn't placed there by Agassi.

I'm all for a better planned tour schedule, but somehow some players who complain about heavy playing remind me of people who go to "all-you-can-eat" buffets, splurge more that they can handle and then blame their heartburn on the food... a limited schedule will actually hurt lower ranked players, who need the prize money they gather in smaller venues to make ends meet. A lot of top billing stars will spend their vacation time playing exhibitions and charities anyway...

amierin
11-15-2005, 06:45 PM
Well, I was at the after match press conference of Agassi.
Yes, he went to the press room directly from the match. Immediately after he lost the match.
He just sat down and started to complain a lot about his body and his ankle. And then he said he wouldn't continue playing. Everybody was surprised. They made confirmation with him for several times, as you can see.

About the match vs Davydenko. Everyone who watched the match could see that Agassi was not playing for win, let's say, from the mid of the 2nd set, he's kind of tanking the whole match off. Davydenko also said that "It seemed he just wanted it ends quickly".
Well, if he really was hurt and felt that he's not gonna continue, why not ask for trainer, and just withdraw during the match? No need to finish a match by tanking those points. And why not go to see the tournament doctor, the ATP or the organizers before pull out?

And the organizers, I do think they have their points. And, I'd say, not only because of Agassi's withdrawn.

You know that Hilton Hotel is the tournament's official hotel. The organizers arranged rooms for all the players in the hotel. (They've always been good to Agassi. In 2002, Agassi's room was even better than Hewitt's, though Hewitt was the top seed.)
This year, they arranged everything for Agassi too. But in the last minute, the day before Agassi's arrival at Shanghai, he told the organizers that he was not going to stay in Hilton Hotel, and appointed another hotel.
It was embarassing, but the organizers managed to arrange it for him. So, with all the other players and relatives staying in Hilton Hotel, Agassi stayed in the hotel he asked for.
And when Agassi committed to come to Shanghai, the organizers and some sponsors like Adidas, Head, they arranged some activities, which Agassi agreed to present. They have everything settled. But Agassi just broke his promise after his defeat, saying "No I won't do it any more" and left. Now the organizers have to deal with the anger from those big sponsors.

They've really spent a lot of effort to make Agassi satisfied. But what did they get from Agassi? And this is not the first time.

I guess with Andre image is everything.

Phunkadelicious
11-15-2005, 06:46 PM
I only want to laugh whenever people say Agassi is a nice guy. :p
:ras: :lol:

Lee
11-15-2005, 06:51 PM
:ras: :lol:

:ras: Thanks for the very intelligent response.

Skyward
11-15-2005, 06:52 PM
The story is very simple. Davydenko and Agassi decided to fix the match and shared the profit. :D

Phunkadelicious
11-15-2005, 06:54 PM
:ras: Thanks for the very intelligent response.
well i'd try to argue with you but i really can't. the only Agassi I know is the agassi that is presented to the media :shrug: i happen to like that guy, but for all i know agassi could be a complete jerk in private. a lot of people seem to think so. yeah he makes some decisions that are questionable, but i think a lot of people do. i am can't really prove that he is a nice guy, so i figured a cute :ras: would be the most apt description for my feelings :)

Lee
11-15-2005, 06:58 PM
well i'd try to argue with you but i really can't. the only Agassi I know is the agassi that is presented to the media :shrug: i happen to like that guy, but for all i know agassi could be a complete jerk in private. a lot of people seem to think so. yeah he makes some decisions that are questionable, but i think a lot of people do. i am can't really prove that he is a nice guy, so i figured a cute :ras: would be the most apt description for my feelings :)

;) don't take it too seriously ;)

Phunkadelicious
11-15-2005, 07:00 PM
;) don't take it too seriously ;)
i thought i was bein pretty open-minded and light hearted :)

TheBoiledEgg
11-15-2005, 07:32 PM
I agree with you Kiro but

as you said, this is not the first time and the organiser should know his track record and should have enough warnings to the sponsors. :shrug:

I only want to laugh whenever people say Agassi is a nice guy. :p

anyone remember when he was getting his ass spanked by Ferrero at Roland Garros, and a few drops of rain fell, he just went to his chair and packed his bags and walked off without the umpire even stopping play.
needless to say EVERY other court contined play :rolleyes: :o

Anyone else would have been DISQ right then
he seems to think the world revolves around him.:rolleyes:

wcr
11-15-2005, 07:37 PM
I'm all for a better planned tour schedule, but somehow some players who complain about heavy playing remind me of people who go to "all-you-can-eat" buffets, splurge more that they can handle and then blame their heartburn on the food... a limited schedule will actually hurt lower ranked players, who need the prize money they gather in smaller venues to make ends meet. A lot of top billing stars will spend their vacation time playing exhibitions and charities anyway...

I'm not sure the "all-you-can-eat" buffet analogy works on this tournament, this year. Other than Roddick who played an exhibition match and hurt his back, the other no-shows had legitimate issues. Safin is not suffering from an overtactive schedule.

A better planned schedule means demanding less from the top guys to play the bigger events. Demanding too much from them, to give the lower ranked guys a shot at more points, seems unfair to me.

How about this ...

After the USO, play the YEC (men and women) at the end of September when tennis enthusiasm is still riding high. After that, schedule Davis and Fed Cup events. Throw in some Tier I/II/III events for the lower ranked players and some exhibition matches for those who want them and call it a year. Of course, Madrid and Paris won't be happy to lower their tournaments to Tier I but they are turning out to be those events with the top guns pulling out anyway.

While the Shanghai organizers have worked hard to accommodate the players; all tournaments do this to lesser and greater degrees. I'm very hard pressed to feel sorry for tournament organizers who know the condition of these top athletes at year end and they cry about not having a "Mercedes Benz" event.

Just because the ATP/WTA can't figure out a better solution for their athletes, it doesn't mean we can't. Discussing options is a much better use of time than complaining about what's not working. C'mon folks.

DhammaTiger
11-15-2005, 07:39 PM
IMO some of the withdrawals were influenced more by the type of surface than injuries. Agassi's record on Teraflex is poor. If MC were on a fast hard court instead of the fastest carpet used on the tour, Agassi wouldn't have looked like a poor player in the Davydenko match. Perhaps he's trying to save face too? Nadal has struggled with injuries for months now, but they do not always prevent him from entering and winning tournaments.

Even if players want to improve on Teraflex there aren't many opportunities. The only tour events on it are in France and Russia during the fall indoor carpet season (Lyon, Paris MS, St. Pete, Kremlin Cup) and two of these events overlap. Since Teraflex is made by French company Gerflor I guess it makes sense to see the surface used mainly in France. Why Russia though? And why for MC? IMO it was an extremely poor choice of surface for Master's Cup if the goal is to attract and retain the top players who often skip the Paris MS entirely and rarely play the fall carpet events. If the goal is to reward the player in best form during the season leading up to the Master's Cup then Teraflex is an excellent choice.
I think, that Gerflor signed a sponsorship deal with the ATP. I read that on their website sometime ago but maybe I made a mistake.

DhammaTiger
11-15-2005, 07:43 PM
Check this link,It confirms that Gerflor is a partner of ATP, like Mercedes Benz,Indesit, Penn, Lotto etc:http://www.atptennis.com/en/aboutatp/default_partners.asp

DhammaTiger
11-15-2005, 07:51 PM
Well said Rosie. No matter how high one has become in one's profession, or in life in general, that doesn't exempt one from having good manners and courtesy to others. In this case to one's hosts.

Kip
11-15-2005, 07:57 PM
Agassi gets away with his high handed behavior in the States because the ATP/USTA covers for him. The milquetoast response by the ATP rep in this case proves my point.

OTOH there were rumors for days about another pull out which was why Puerta was Shanghai to begin with. Most people thought it was Agassi but it was Nadal. Nadal however seems to have worked with tournament organizers going so far as to see a doctor there as well as his own and the ATP doctor. When the opinions concurred he gave in. The organizers know they lost one of their main draws but Nadal left a good feeling in his departure. Agassi doesn't care what the tournament organizers think and it shows.

True.

He is nearly untouchable as far as
the ATP/USTA is concerned.

I'm sure it wouldn't have taken much
to notify them 1st before speaking.

And given the fact of how they were
dropping like flies it's only logical they'd
have gotten more guys as a precaution.

djul
11-15-2005, 08:52 PM
blablablaaaaaa
whatever he has done, you would have been blaming him for it anyway, if he had walked over before the masters cup, you probably would have said that once again he was faking and that he didn't care and he should retire and blablablaaaaaaaaaaaa uh

Frank Winkler
11-15-2005, 09:03 PM
Agassi the old. Just like old times. Except now the north american media is totally with him.

tennischick
11-15-2005, 11:01 PM
anyone remember when he was getting his ass spanked by Ferrero at Roland Garros, and a few drops of rain fell, he just went to his chair and packed his bags and walked off without the umpire even stopping play.
needless to say EVERY other court contined play :rolleyes: :o

Anyone else would have been DISQ right then
he seems to think the world revolves around him.:rolleyes:
you know i love Agassi but i too remember this moment. it was incredible to me that not the Chair, not the linesmen, not the Tournament Director -- nobody told him to get his ass back onto the court. and i must admit that i did see shades of this same attitude when he got an atrocious call in the second set against Davydenko. he started tanking immediately and was outta there. not his best moment. i wonder how the so-much-more professional Steffi puts up with his tantrums. love is indeed blind. thank goodness. ;)

Aphex
11-15-2005, 11:19 PM
:lol: This year Stockholm Open had a TV spot of Agassi saying f**k you to Thomas Johansson after ToJo winning a rally in the 04 final. Funny thing is they started to air this after he withdraw and the catch phrase was "who is going to get his ass spanked in this years final?". After the 04 final he also said some nasty things to a TV reporter who wanted him to say some words live after his loss. I guess Agassi has showed his real face in Sweden. :haha:
Agassi really is the present day Connors.

TenHound
11-16-2005, 02:23 AM
The chinese should get a grip on their damn egos. If it had been Wimby the tournament officials would have had one of their top guys around when a top player had a problem, so this issue about how AA pulled out wouldn't have been a problem. They're acting like the players are prostitutes who got them all hot & bothered & walked off after taking their bucks :(

All this crap about building the stadium for this is garbage as well. They built it for the olympics & to show the world how hot shit they are. Maybe the world doesn't give a damn, particularly in a year in which the players are in a power struggle w/the ATP Tour. Directors. A couple of yrs. ago NYC Sucked Rotten Eggs 'cuz of the rain...sometimes tournaments go down the toilet for any number of reasons...Players were right to pull out this yr, 'cuz it's the only way to get Season Length pushed to top of the agenda, and the Chinese need to quickly figure out that the world is bigger than themselves & their ridiculous vanity.

Chinese are just whining so they can demand a refund. There are no guarantees when you host a tournament, and a nation getting involved rather local organizers just makes them look like first rate ignorant fools. Players are Not Machines, and the chinese took the risk of hosting the tournament, so they should quickly grow up & eat it.

That said, the players are at fault for demanding maximum bucks for the event, which means that locale will shift as soon as anyone one place knows how to host it properly - does anyone remember what a Disaster Houston was the first yr....if the chinese are unhappy, they should speak to Mattress Mac about his experiences the first year, not to mention the infuriated non-Am. players who got treated like crap by him. Secondly, seeking to maxmimize bucks means chances are it will be held a long way from anywhere, 'cuz they'll pay more than Paris, NYC & Houston, which properly should host it on a rotating basis...so it'll be a long trek to play. If they don't want to travel so much, they make less.

Solve this by settling for less money in exchange for a Well-run tournament in a permanent site, closer to home for most of players. And make Year Ends' the 1st wk of October, w/player allowed to play exhibitions afterward, but Required to not play 2 consecutive months.

lau
11-16-2005, 02:27 AM
Shanghai organizers are not happy with Agassi and they have a good reason for it. He didn´t behave as he should. Period.

TenHound
11-16-2005, 02:35 AM
@WCR, superb post. Agreed. Of course, it goes w/out saying that anything we say is worthless. PMac said during broadcast the Tournament Directors/ATP have no interest in changing anything. My concern is that as Top Players increasingly play less, they'll "stake out their territory", so that they'll rarely compete w/each other. Ok, Canada is Rafa's, Cincy is Rogers, and so on. AR will take the rinky dink ones leading up to NYC 'cuz he's proven he can't handle top competition, so he'll split those w/Hewitt & AA...You know that small events won't attract more than a passing top player, but if Masters start attracting only a few of Top players, the quality would tank.

blosson
11-16-2005, 02:46 AM
Tenhound, you shoud replace the word 'Chinese' with 'EVENT organisers' in your post 73 as it's not appropriate and fair to generalise that the whole Chinese community is this or that as you did. Thanks!

Mimi
11-16-2005, 02:53 AM
the little nadal is more mature and responsible than the old grandpa agassi :rolleyes: , at least he attended to all his off court duties

TenHound
11-16-2005, 02:58 AM
Absolutely, blossson. Thanks for the correction.

However it is complicated, as people are speaking of Chinese losing face, rather than event organizers this that and the other. Further, it's my understanding that the Chinese politics involved in this are Extremely Byzantine, if that's the appropriate term, w/National guys, local ones (in govts.) & those directly involved in the event, plus I believe some of the organizers are Westerners who came over to produce it. So, it's a mess. I obviously didn't mean to imply the entirety of the billion plus chinese people, but responsibility is far more diffuse than in Houston, where it was Mattress Mac who royally screwed things up the first yr & was soley responsible. And fixed things up considerably the next time around.

But even that is ironic, 'cuz RF in particular was said to be most offended by how small the Houston stadium was. So now he got the stadium at staggering expense, and then all these egos demand their payoff....And he's not even a prima dona.......Top of the Line Sports has gotten as insane as most everything else these days it seems......

megadeth
11-16-2005, 02:59 AM
because in agassi's own way, he's still a brat.

i'm a fan of the guy tennis-wise, but when it comes to his childish tantrums, i just can't stand it...

TenHound
11-16-2005, 03:01 AM
Give Nadal a decade on Tour and a pile of Major Titles, and we'll see. AA is an all time demanding tyrannical Narcissist, of that there is no question...but he's also made more for tennis than probably anyone in history...ah..the tradeoffs...

Experimentee
11-16-2005, 03:16 AM
I dont think theres anything wrong with what he did. He may have made the decision right before the press conference, and didn't have time to tell the organisers before the media asked him those questions. Obviously he is legitimately injured. At least he actually flew in to Shanghai and made every effort to play in the first place, and only pulled out when he'd given it a go and failed.

soraya
11-16-2005, 06:50 AM
What I said was that I saw no evidence of him having trouble with his ankle. And for that matter, if Gilbert or McEnroe saw him limping, wincing, rubbing, holding, calling the trainer, crying, screaming, hobbling, or crawling on his knees, they didn't mention it.

I DID NOT MENTION FAKING AN INJURY-
YOU DID! :eek:

what Gilbert and Pmac were hypothesizing about an injury on AA's back or shoulder during the match. On another note, by the way AA was performing you could tell that he wanted to leave that court ASAP. I've seen this kind of behavior from AA through the years and I consider them as disrespectful and puerile. No class whatsoever!

soraya
11-16-2005, 06:52 AM
Give Nadal a decade on Tour and a pile of Major Titles, and we'll see. AA is an all time demanding tyrannical Narcissist, of that there is no question...but he's also made more for tennis than probably anyone in history...ah..the tradeoffs...

what did he exactly made for tennis? on the contrary, it is tennis that made him somebody and a millionaire if anything.

yomike
11-16-2005, 09:59 AM
He chickened how convinient:rolleyes:
_______________________

G O
11-16-2005, 10:01 AM
Does anyone here know how long the YEC will be held in Shanghai?

It's a pity that Agassi didn't follow protocol for pulling out of the event. I did not see his match and do not know if his injury was affecting his play. If it was, and the press were asking him about it during a post match interview, then his announcement that he wouldn't play on would seem to be more spontaneous than a slight against tournament officials. So many hurt feelings!

The tournament organizers who expect 100% from players at the end of the season are not paying attention to what the current schedule is doing to the athletes. Their investment in their tournament is their risk. If you're going to put up that kind of moola, you better understand your risk and not whine about it when the situation plays itself out.


They could always use qi zhong for pingpong.

This is all slapping them in the face isn't it. I think it's great. :devil: And it's only going to get worse. The chinese better push for an AMS quick or all that moola go bi bi. :lol:

G O
11-16-2005, 10:04 AM
the little nadal is more mature and responsible than the old grandpa agassi :rolleyes: , at least he attended to all his off court duties


:retard: :smash: :retard: :smash: :retard: :smash: :retard: :retard: :smash: :smash: :dog:

nobama
11-16-2005, 11:07 AM
Well, I was at the after match press conference of Agassi.
Yes, he went to the press room directly from the match. Immediately after he lost the match.
He just sat down and started to complain a lot about his body and his ankle. And then he said he wouldn't continue playing. Everybody was surprised. They made confirmation with him for several times, as you can see.

About the match vs Davydenko. Everyone who watched the match could see that Agassi was not playing for win, let's say, from the mid of the 2nd set, he's kind of tanking the whole match off. Davydenko also said that "It seemed he just wanted it ends quickly".
Well, if he really was hurt and felt that he's not gonna continue, why not ask for trainer, and just withdraw during the match? No need to finish a match by tanking those points. And why not go to see the tournament doctor, the ATP or the organizers before pull out?

And the organizers, I do think they have their points. And, I'd say, not only because of Agassi's withdrawn.

You know that Hilton Hotel is the tournament's official hotel. The organizers arranged rooms for all the players in the hotel. (They've always been good to Agassi. In 2002, Agassi's room was even better than Hewitt's, though Hewitt was the top seed.)
This year, they arranged everything for Agassi too. But in the last minute, the day before Agassi's arrival at Shanghai, he told the organizers that he was not going to stay in Hilton Hotel, and appointed another hotel.
It was embarassing, but the organizers managed to arrange it for him. So, with all the other players and relatives staying in Hilton Hotel, Agassi stayed in the hotel he asked for.
And when Agassi committed to come to Shanghai, the organizers and some sponsors like Adidas, Head, they arranged some activities, which Agassi agreed to present. They have everything settled. But Agassi just broke his promise after his defeat, saying "No I won't do it any more" and left. Now the organizers have to deal with the anger from those big sponsors.

They've really spent a lot of effort to make Agassi satisfied. But what did they get from Agassi? And this is not the first time.If all this is really true, then he is a jerk. Shouldn't have gone in the first place if he wasn't committed to it.

amierin
11-16-2005, 11:46 AM
what Gilbert and Pmac were hypothesizing about an injury on AA's back or shoulder during the match. On another note, by the way AA was performing you could tell that he wanted to leave that court ASAP. I've seen this kind of behavior from AA through the years and I consider them as disrespectful and puerile. No class whatsoever!

Marcelo Rios was dogged big time for doing this when he was on top yet not a mention of the "t" word when it comes to Agassi.

Peoples
11-16-2005, 04:52 PM
The organizers should not bitch about this. Agassi is 35. These people are lucky he showed up, lucky that he's still around. But these Chinese can't appreciate it :rolleyes:

*Ljubica*
11-16-2005, 05:06 PM
The organizers should not bitch about this. Agassi is 35. These people are lucky he showed up, lucky that he's still around. But these Chinese can't appreciate it :rolleyes:

Then he should be old enough to know that manners cost nothing and show others a little more respect. And you don't have to be Chinese to think his behaviour was poor :rolleyes:

revolution
11-16-2005, 05:09 PM
Then he should be old enough to know that manners cost nothing and show others a little more respect. And you don't have to be Chinese to think his behaviour was poor :rolleyes:

Yeah... if he wasn't in a fit state to play then he should not have played, as it complicated Fernando also, who probably would have won against Davydenko, although seriously Andre did look in a bad state on court against Kolya.

I keep wondering though, why you don't like David any more? :confused:

mandoura
11-16-2005, 05:21 PM
The organizers should not bitch about this. Agassi is 35. These people are lucky he showed up, lucky that he's still around. But these Chinese can't appreciate it :rolleyes:

I like AA a lot. I think what he is doing at 35 is pretty commendable.

However, if he starts thinking that he is doing the world a favor by playing still and that everybody is at his service, he should think again. Tennis and the big bucks it entails does not mean only playing. The package comes with commitments and duties. He should meet them. How would he react if at the end of the tournament the organisers didn't pay him his money? I bet he wouldn't like it one bit.

Yes AA is a great player but this does not give him the right to step on people's toes.

And yes Rosie, I agree with you. It's all about manners. Some players see it as worthless, I see it as priceless.

mandoura
11-16-2005, 05:36 PM
Yeah... if he wasn't in a fit state to play then he should not have played, as it complicated Fernando also, who probably would have won against Davydenko, although seriously Andre did look in a bad state on court against Kolya.

I keep wondering though, why you don't like David any more? :confused:

:eek: Is that true Rosie? Why?

I've always blamed myself for not being as good a Rogelio fan as you are to Nalby !!! What happened??

Margy
11-16-2005, 06:06 PM
It's all about manners. Some players see it as worthless, I see it as priceless.
Exactly :yeah:

Tournament paid roundtrip airfare First Class from Las Vegas to Shanghai - $8,759
tournament paid stay at First Class Hotel in Shanghai - $5,250
Appearance Fee check for First Class year-end championship tournament - $100,000

Manners to show First Class behavior to organisors and fans - Priceless! :)

amierin
11-16-2005, 06:11 PM
Exactly :yeah:

Tournament paid roundtrip airfare First Class from Las Vegas to Shanghai - $8,759
tournament paid stay at First Class Hotel in Shanghai - $5,250
Appearance Fee check for First Class year-end championship tournament - $100,000

Manners to show First Class behavior to organisors and fans - Priceless! :)

According to the US tennis press AA flies his personal jet everywhere. :confused:

Margy
11-16-2005, 06:17 PM
According to the US tennis press AA flies his personal jet everywhere. :confused:
:lol: I was just going by the fact that their transportation to/from/and during tournies is covered. I didn't realize that he rejected that also, like he rejected the official hotel.

So change that to:
First Class Mecedes-Benz transportation at the tourney - $1500

Or does he bring his own personal limo with him also? :lol:

nobama
11-16-2005, 06:17 PM
Did anyone watch the Davydenko on ESPN this morning? I heard that the commentators (I'm assuming that's PMac and Drysdale) were ripping some of the players for pullouts and stuff and not taking this event seriously. I didn't see it so I don't know what exactly was said. But I can't imagine PMac taking a shot at Agassi and Roddick. :shrug:

amierin
11-16-2005, 06:21 PM
:lol: I was just going by the fact that their transportation to/from/and during tournies is covered. I didn't realize that he rejected that also, like he rejected the official hotel.

So change that to:
First Class Mecedes-Benz transportation at the tourney - $1500

Or does he bring his own personal limo with him also? :lol:

Don't get me wrong. I think he took the freebie flight. Does the quoted price include the airfare for Steffi and the kids?

Margy
11-16-2005, 06:26 PM
Don't get me wrong. I think he took the freebie flight. Does the quoted price include the airfare for Steffi and the kids?
Nah, they didn't go. I'm sure that's one of the reasons he wanted to get out quickly..to go home to the wife and kids. :D

amierin
11-16-2005, 06:29 PM
Nah, they didn't go. I'm sure that's one of the reasons he wanted to get out quickly..to go home to the wife and kids. :D

Uh, okay.

DhammaTiger
11-16-2005, 09:03 PM
Then he should be old enough to know that manners cost nothing and show others a little more respect. And you don't have to be Chinese to think his behaviour was poor :rolleyes:
Well said, Rosie. Spot on. Respect and manners is universal. It's not fame or fortune that makes a person, it's manners and good behaviour. Doing charity or whatever is meaningless if someone is disrespectful to others.

Peoples
11-16-2005, 09:11 PM
It's more important to be respectful to your family than those "others". Agassi always has a great relationship with audiences, so that basically the only people pissed off are the organisers who probably sell less tickets and that's it. It won't make a difference if Agassi informs the media or the organisers first, the information will get across quickly enough.

Blaze
11-16-2005, 09:44 PM
It's more important to be respectful to your family than those "others". Agassi always has a great relationship with audiences, so that basically the only people pissed off are the organisers who probably sell less tickets and that's it. It won't make a difference if Agassi informs the media or the organisers first, the information will get across quickly enough.

Would you consider it nothing if your boyfriend/girlfriend was breaking up with you and told the press first and you had to hear it from them?

AgassiDomination
11-16-2005, 10:37 PM
Would you consider it nothing if your boyfriend/girlfriend was breaking up with you and told the press first and you had to hear it from them?

What a dumb metaphor :rolleyes:

soraya
11-17-2005, 05:54 AM
Exactly :yeah:

Tournament paid roundtrip airfare First Class from Las Vegas to Shanghai - $8,759
tournament paid stay at First Class Hotel in Shanghai - $5,250
Appearance Fee check for First Class year-end championship tournament - $100,000

Manners to show First Class behavior to organisors and fans - Priceless! :)

LOL, Margy you sound like the master card commercial...

DrJules
11-17-2005, 09:38 AM
We have heard numerous stories of what happened. However, have we heard the full story. Are there any details of discussions between Agassi and the organisers before and during the event which have remained confidential?

From their perspective him coming and playing was better for ticket sales than for him not to come at all. The losers have been spectators who bought tickets in advance and will now not see him.

jmp
11-17-2005, 10:27 AM
Did anyone watch the Davydenko on ESPN this morning? I heard that the commentators (I'm assuming that's PMac and Drysdale) were ripping some of the players for pullouts and stuff and not taking this event seriously. I didn't see it so I don't know what exactly was said. But I can't imagine PMac taking a shot at Agassi and Roddick. :shrug:

Yes, I watched it live. In general, I don't expect to hear U.S. commentators making negative remarks about the two top U.S. male players because we have so few elite U.S. players right now and few prospects for the immediate future. That was the case again yesterday morning. Here's what came across to me:

PMac tried to be blunt and forthright about the situation on the ground. He started off that small exchange with Cliff by stating that the organizers were upset with all of the withdrawals. Then he went on to praise Roger for Roger's comments that he does everything possible to be ready to compete like coming to the tournament early, etc. Patrick said he thought that Roger was sending a subtle message to other top players to make more of an effort. That's when Cliff chimed in with extreme kid gloves and started going through each player's name and their injury. Andre's name passed quickly. But, Cliff made it clear that the last time he saw Andy compete he was in great discomfort from his injury.

So, while Patrick tried to point out the overall impact of so many players dropping out, Cliff made sure we didn't get the impression that they were 'ripping' on our two top male U.S. players.

Castafiore
11-17-2005, 10:32 AM
Patrick said he thought that Roger was sending a subtle message to other top players to make more of an effort. That's when Cliff chimed in with extreme kid gloves and started going through each player's name and their injury. Andre's name passed quickly. But, Cliff made it clear that the last time he saw Andy compete he was in great discomfort from his injury.
Every player does what he has to do but can only work within the limits of his own body and the injury he has to deal with at that particular moment.
Roger had to miss the Madrid Masters, Basel and the Paris Masters.
Other have to miss this particular event in Shanghai.
:shrug:

I don't think it was a subtle message to other top players to make more of an effort.

G O
11-17-2005, 10:36 AM
A quick request from a Korean-American:

If people want to defend Agassi's actions, fine, but can they try doing it without all the xenophobic comments about "the Chinese"? :banghead: I realize that not all the Agassi-defenders were guilty of it, but several people have been mentioning "Chinese" this, "Chinese" that - does being Chinese somehow has anything to do with the fact that the tournament directors are pissed? As if you have to be a *Chinese* tournament director in order to be pissed by the fact that Agassi refused the hotel room prepared for him, left his sponsors hanging, threw away the last half of his match against Davydenko, and then announced his withdrawal to the press before announcing it to his hosts. :rolleyes: If anything, "the Chinese" aren't as willing as others to let Agassi get away with this kind of behavior, and heck, they should be applauded for that.


A quick response from a French-American:

I don't know if your aware of this but the "Chinese" have a history or complaining about Americans. Is this another case of the Chinese politicizing nothing....probably.

You don't need to turn this into a race issue by stating your nationality as if Korean people need to be offended by comments made towards the Chinese. I'll say it with pride I don't like China and their culture. I feel sorry for the chinese people. So anything I say about China is a most likely a reslut of this.

"Xenaphobic comments"... :rolleyes: more like Chinaphobic. :) But you don't care, your Korean.

jmp
11-17-2005, 10:47 AM
Every player does what he has to do but can only work within the limits of his own body and the injury he has to deal with at that particular moment.
Roger had to miss the Madrid Masters, Basel and the Paris Masters.
Other have to miss this particular event in Shanghai.
:shrug:

I don't think it was a subtle message to other top players to make more of an effort.

You're probably right. Patrick could be trying to interpret Roger's comments that way because he is attributing leadership/role model qualities to Roger as the #1 player. There is another thread here about Roger sympathizing with the organizers' frustration.

nobama
11-17-2005, 11:08 AM
Yes, I watched it live. In general, I don't expect to hear U.S. commentators making negative remarks about the two top U.S. male players because we have so few elite U.S. players right now and few prospects for the immediate future. That was the case again yesterday morning. Here's what came across to me:

PMac tried to be blunt and forthright about the situation on the ground. He started off that small exchange with Cliff by stating that the organizers were upset with all of the withdrawals. Then he went on to praise Roger for Roger's comments that he does everything possible to be ready to compete like coming to the tournament early, etc. Patrick said he thought that Roger was sending a subtle message to other top players to make more of an effort. That's when Cliff chimed in with extreme kid gloves and started going through each player's name and their injury. Andre's name passed quickly. But, Cliff made it clear that the last time he saw Andy compete he was in great discomfort from his injury.

So, while Patrick tried to point out the overall impact of so many players dropping out, Cliff made sure we didn't get the impression that they were 'ripping' on our two top male U.S. players.Well to be fair, Andre did show up early, as did Nadal. So Roger wasn't the only one to get there early. But I rewatched the Agassi match and for the first set, and part of the second set I didn't get the impression he was hurting out there. He just looked very rusty, movement wasn't great. Not surprising since he hadn't played since the US Open. Then at 2-2 in the second set he went down hill very fast. After watching it again it does make me wonder if he wanted to get the hell out of there because he knew he wasn't going anywhere. I think during his press conference he said it's no good for people to see him like that. But in Fed's first two matches we didin't see the best tennis from him either. Yet he's still there competing. Of course he won his matches, but I don't think he would've bailed if he lost to Nalbandian.

G O
11-17-2005, 11:09 AM
And other countries, including France, DON'T have a history of complaining about Americans? :haha: Regardless of what you'd like to believe/imply, there's nothing about being Chinese that makes complaining more likely.

And it's the xenophobes who initially made it a point to bring up the tournament officials' nationality that turned this thing into a race issue. You're the one who just admitted to being completely anti-Chinese/bigoted; just because I called you out on it doesn't mean *I* made it an issue.

And "feel sorry for the chinese [sic] people" all you want - as much as I feel pity for you and your blatant, unapologetic racism, they certainly deserve it more. :wavey:


IT'S ON!!! no. I really don't care actually. I just one to make one thing clear to anyone else who sees this.

I know most of us out side of America know what a racist is. American people love to call people racists when they don't have shit to say. Acutally I don't like America either...what does that mean?

I wanna clearify here, your saying I'm racist? Biggot...sure. But wether I am or not is irrelevant here. I simply stated "I DONT LIKE CHINA AND IT'S CULTURE". If that makes me a racist guilty I am...there are worse things in life afterall. Btw, I wasn't aware Chinese became a race...I need to get out more.

For the recore I have no probs with the rest of Asia only CHINA!!!!! :devil:

DhammaTiger
11-17-2005, 11:27 AM
J'torian, Bravo for bboth of your posts. :yeah: :hatoff: :worship: IMO There is no excuse for bigotry and racism. People are entitled to have their opinion, but must be mindful of other people's feelings. Respect for others and good manners are sublime virtues.

G O
11-17-2005, 11:34 AM
J'torian, Bravo for bboth of your posts. :yeah: :hatoff: :worship: IMO There is no excuse for bigotry and racism. People are entitled to have their opinion, but must be mindful of other people's feelings. Respect for others and good manners are sublime virtues.


Translation

Speak your mind, but don't hurt peoples feelings. How old are we now? :rolleyes:


There is no excuse to accuse posters of being bigots and racists.


Is it racist to say I don't like Germany and German culture? Hmmmmm

Peoples
11-17-2005, 11:39 AM
Would you consider it nothing if your boyfriend/girlfriend was breaking up with you and told the press first and you had to hear it from them?
Pulling out of a tournament due to injury = breaking up with your girlfriend ?

:haha: People come up with funny stuff sometimes...

If someone don't like the organisers called Chinese then it's his problem. They are Chinese and that's a fact :D It's another fact that they're bitching and putting these together we get bitching Chinese organisers, it's that simple ;)

Peoples
11-17-2005, 11:47 AM
*L* :rolleyes: You can argue semantics all you like, but the plain fact is that you specifically stated that you specifically disliked an entire country and its culture. Defend Agassi all you want; leave discussions of race (or nationality or culture - whatever you want to call it to make yourself sound better!) out of it. And by the way, since the majority of China is ethnically Han Chinese and mainstream Chinese culture is based on Han Chinese culture, for you to state that you dislike both the country and culture is indeed racist, however much you try to backpedal.

Anyway, I'm done with you - no need to hijack this thread any further when you've made my point for me way better than I could have done. :wavey:
Whether someone likes their culture or not is their own matter and saying your opinion which you're entitled to, does not discriminate anyone which is what racism is about.

amierin
11-17-2005, 11:49 AM
It seems this thread is bringing out the worst in people. Too bad.
I saw the Davydenko/Gaudio match last night and have to say the conversation between PMac and Cliff was stilted and awkward at best. As Americans I don't expect them to rip our top two players but the fact that they brought it up means to me that TPTB in the ATP/USTA are aware of the controversy surrounding Agassi's withdrawal and need to do some damage control.

My personal take on Andre changed after he won a tournament this year, in the States, and was presented with a Raymond Weil watch as part of his winnings. Live, on television, he said oh, "...this is an EBAY watch." The man presenting the watch stared at Andre in disbelief, his mouth open to match mine. Andre simply laughed and tried to play it off as a joke but no one was smiling except him. Up until then he was one of my idols.

Peoples
11-17-2005, 11:52 AM
My personal take on Andre changed after he won a tournament this year, in the States, and was presented with a Raymond Weil watch as part of his winnings. Live, on television, he said oh, "...this is an EBAY watch." The man presenting the watch stared at Andre in disbelief, his mouth open to match mine. Andre simply laughed and tried to play it off as a joke but no one was smiling except him. Up until then he was one of my idols.
What a horrible crime by Andre! :o :eek:

G O
11-17-2005, 11:54 AM
*L* :rolleyes: You can argue semantics all you like, but the plain fact is that you specifically stated that you specifically disliked an entire country and its culture. Defend Agassi all you want; leave discussions of race (or nationality or culture - whatever you want to call it to make yourself sound better!) out of it. And by the way, since the majority of China is ethnically Han Chinese and mainstream Chinese culture is based on Han Chinese culture, for you to state that you dislike both the country and culture is indeed racist, however much you try to backpedal.

Anyway, I'm done with you - no need to hijack this thread any further when you've made my point for me way better than I could have done. :wavey:


Why type *L* if you to afaid to say it don't say.


So I think I may have learned something today. A majority of China is something called "Han" which Chinese culture..no, "mainstream" Chinese culture is based on (whatever that means) sooooo....that means I'm racist :lol: Ok. If it makes you happy then I am a racist. :lol:

Your korean right? You gotta love asian pride. The ignorance or asian americans if they only know how much China hates Korea.

Btw welcome to MTF and nice contributions calling me a racist and all...thanks for that. You gonna win lots of friends here. :wavey:

lau
11-17-2005, 11:56 AM
What a horrible crime by Andre! :o :eek:
Yeah, not a crime, but classless, exactly the same thing he showed in Shanghai. But, not a big deal..., he is suposed to run after and hit a yellow ball, not to have class.

G O
11-17-2005, 11:56 AM
It seems this thread is bringing out the worst in people. Too bad.
I saw the Davydenko/Gaudio match last night and have to say the conversation between PMac and Cliff was stilted and awkward at best. As Americans I don't expect them to rip our top two players but the fact that they brought it up means to me that TPTB in the ATP/USTA are aware of the controversy surrounding Agassi's withdrawal and need to do some damage control.

My personal take on Andre changed after he won a tournament this year, in the States, and was presented with a Raymond Weil watch as part of his winnings. Live, on television, he said oh, "...this is an EBAY watch." The man presenting the watch stared at Andre in disbelief, his mouth open to match mine. Andre simply laughed and tried to play it off as a joke but no one was smiling except him. Up until then he was one of my idols.

That was soooo funny when he did that. Vintage Andre. Usually he hides that side of him.