Question about group standings for the alternates [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Question about group standings for the alternates

AlexNYR
11-14-2005, 04:19 PM
does gonzalez take agassi's record or does he start at 0-0 and only plays 2 matches....the rule book states more matches played is one of the tiebreakers for group ties, so am i correct in assuming they start with a clean slate?

Horatio Caine
11-14-2005, 04:20 PM
He takes Agassi's record.

kali_puerta_fan
11-14-2005, 04:20 PM
my guess 2!

kali_puerta_fan
11-14-2005, 04:21 PM
in this case...0 points :lol: so...it doesn't matter

TheBoiledEgg
11-14-2005, 04:24 PM
the Alternate starts with a clean slate
but even if he goes 2-0
the person who goes 2-1 is ahead of him by virtue of more matches played.

naiwen
11-14-2005, 04:25 PM
does gonzalez take agassi's record or does he start at 0-0 and only plays 2 matches....the rule book states more matches played is one of the tiebreakers for group ties, so am i correct in assuming they start with a clean slate?

I don't think Gonzalez can enter semi since Andre has played the first match.

NYCtennisfan
11-14-2005, 04:30 PM
Yeah, it's tough for the alternates. They're trying to get some cash and some ranking points but making the SF's is going to be almost impossible due to the format and also because they have had little time for preparation and are coming out cold.

BlackSilver
11-14-2005, 04:37 PM
Stupid Agassi, and mainly........... stupid rules and organizers, the chances of Gonzales to reach the SF are much smaller.
Bunch of imbeciles......

Horatio Caine
11-14-2005, 04:39 PM
Stupid Agassi, and mainly........... stupid rules and organizers, the chances of Gonzales to reach the SF are much smaller.
Bunch of imbeciles......

But he has a greater chance of beating Gaudio and Puerta than Ljubicic and Federer though ;)

I think he is favourite for SF, along with Davydenko

kundalini
11-14-2005, 04:57 PM
I rather suspect that Davydenko will beat Puerta and that Gaudio might just beat Davydenko, leaving poor Fernando in 3rd place regardless of whether he wins both his matches or not.

Should Davydenko beat Puerta he will be through regardless of the result of his final match, and I would be surprised if he put that much effort into his match with Gaudio.

jtipson
11-14-2005, 05:27 PM
the Alternate starts with a clean slate
but even if he goes 2-0
the person who goes 2-1 is ahead of him by virtue of more matches played.

The first tie-break is who won the match between the two players, then it's set win-loss percentage and game win-loss percentage iirc. So if Fena wins his two matches and is tied with either Gaudio or Puerta, then he'll get through. If he's tied with Davydenko, then it'll be down to the percentages.

Margy
11-14-2005, 05:30 PM
I rather suspect that Davydenko will beat Puerta and that Gaudio might just beat Davydenko, leaving poor Fernando in 3rd place regardless of whether he wins both his matches or not.
OR... Davydenko or Gaudio will withdraw because of injury and the next alternate will play even fewer matches than Fernando! :lol:

kundalini
11-14-2005, 05:35 PM
The first tie-break is who won the match between the two players, then it's set win-loss percentage and game win-loss percentage iirc. So if Fena wins his two matches and is tied with either Gaudio or Puerta, then he'll get through. If he's tied with Davydenko, then it'll be down to the percentages.

I'm glad someone understands the rules.

(does anyone know if Gonzalez is actually in China, or is he having to fly out?)

GonzoFan
11-14-2005, 05:38 PM
I'm glad someone understands the rules.

(does anyone know if Gonzalez is actually in China, or is he having to fly out?)

He is already in China he arrived on saturday

buddyholly
11-14-2005, 05:50 PM
OR... Davydenko or Gaudio will withdraw because of injury and the next alternate will play even fewer matches than Fernando! :lol:

Taken to a logical end, the winner of the tournament could be an alternate who did not play even one match. :lol: Maybe Andy Murray.

jtipson
11-14-2005, 05:52 PM
http://www.atptennis.com/en/common/TrackIt.asp?file=/en/players/ATP_Rulebook_2004.pdf

THE ATP RULE BOOK SAYS

3. The final standings of each group shall be determined by the first of the followingmethods that apply:
a. Greatest number of wins;
b. Greatest number of matches played;
c. Head-to-head results if only two (2) players are tied, or if three (3) players
are tied, then:
(i) If three (3) players each have one win, a player having played less
than all three (3) matches is automatically eliminated and the player
advancing to the Single Elimination competition is the winner of the
match-up of the two (2) players tied with 1-2 records; or
(ii) Highest percentage of sets won; or
(iii) Highest percentage of games won.
(iv) If (i), (ii) or (iii) produce one superior player (first place), or one inferior
player (third place), and the two remaining players are tied, the tie
between those two players shall be broken by head-to-head record.
d. If ties still exist after the above procedures, the Steering Committee shall
make the final determination.

Fair enough, must have forgotten b); you and Eggy are correct then.