FIT approves "acrilic" surface in Slovak Rep [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

FIT approves "acrilic" surface in Slovak Rep

fco253
08-10-2005, 11:02 PM
...they claim "is not a carpet, it's a legitimate hard court made of acrilic"

I have never heard before of an acrilic floor, have any of you?

Obviously, Argentine Federation has inquired back, asking in which tourneys this surface is used on, since the rule says it has to be used in at least 3 ATP events...

I think in the end, the FIT will again bend the rules as they like...

DanEd
08-10-2005, 11:11 PM
pretty unfair

George_Hanson
08-10-2005, 11:13 PM
AFAIC this is rather fast surface. There were one or two tournaments in the past on acrylic surface, but I cannot remember when. You have an acrylic paint, so this has to do something with it....

Scotso
08-10-2005, 11:24 PM
go Slovakia!

jazz_girl
08-10-2005, 11:57 PM
I wonder which tournaments they are...

ys
08-11-2005, 12:05 AM
...they claim "is not a carpet, it's a legitimate hard court made of acrilic"

I have never heard before of an acrilic floor, have any of you?

Apparently you haven't heard much about tennis then. A big share of indoors tennis tournaments ( and even some outdoors tournaments, such as Houston Masters) are played on the surface called Greenset, which is exactly that - acrylic-based hardcourts.

lau
08-11-2005, 12:14 AM
I know it`s the same surface that Slovak Republic used in the tie against Spain. I know there have been complaints about it...
I donīt know much about it, but the information about the surface of that tie, from the DC site says this Surface: Hard (Premier) - Indoors Does anyone know which tournaments in the tour are played in this surface?! :)

EDIT:

Ops!, I didnīt read this before posting...(I was writting while you were posting...)
Apparently you haven't heard much about tennis then. A big share of indoors tennis tournaments ( and even some outdoors tournaments, such as Houston Masters) are played on the surface called Greenset, which is exactly that - acrylic-based hardcourts.

I may sound naive, but as far as I know (I might be wrong) the Argentine Tennis Association claim they donīt know which surface is exactly... That`s why they inquired back.

ys
08-11-2005, 12:26 AM
I know it`s the same surface that Slovak used in the tie against Spain. I know there have been complaints about it...
I donīt know much about it, but the information about the surface of that tie, from the DC site says this Surface: Hard (Premier) - Indoors Does anyone know which tournaments in the tour are played in this surface?! :)

Greenset is a standard indoors hardcourt surface. Any indoors tournament that is said to be played on hardcourts is, in all probability, played on Greenset or what they also call Opticourt in some places, but that's similar stuff... Madrid, Marseille, Rottterdam, Stockholm, Vienna.

fco253
08-11-2005, 12:28 AM
Apparently you haven't heard much about tennis then. A big share of indoors tennis tournaments ( and even some outdoors tournaments, such as Houston Masters) are played on the surface called Greenset, which is exactly that - acrylic-based hardcourts.

Are you sure that the commonly used Greenset is equal to this "Premier"?

Spain players said ti wasn't, and there wouldn't be so much complaints if that is the case...

lau
08-11-2005, 12:33 AM
Greenset is a standard indoors hardcourt surface. Any indoors tournament that is said to be played on hardcourts is, in all probability, played on Greenset or what they also call Opticourt in some places, but that's similar stuff... Madrid, Marseille, Rottterdam, Stockholm, Vienna.
Greenset and Premier are different brands...(and surfaces I supose)

lau
08-11-2005, 12:43 AM
I found this site www.premiercourt.com , that I supose is the official site of the company... Usually, the companies that produce the different surfaces (at least the carpet companies...) promote themselves naming the tournaments (in their websites) where the surface is used ;) In this site it doesnīt appear any tournament...
I might be wrong, as I said I donīt know much about this, but.....

Edit: In the Greenset site http://www.greenset.net you can read in References >> Tournaments all the tournaments where this surface is/was used ;) If your surface is used in a pro tournament, of course you`ll name it in your site!!!! :p

ys
08-11-2005, 01:11 AM
Greenset and Premier are different brands...(and surfaces I supose)

Same thing.. It is like people calling a copy machine a xerox machine.. using the name of original manufacturer as a generic term. Greenset, Premier, Opticourt is different brands of the same product - acrylic-based hardcourts.

lau
08-11-2005, 01:22 AM
Same thing.. It is like people calling a copy machine a xerox machine.. using the name of original manufacturer as a generic term. Greenset, Premier, Opticourt is different brands of the same product - acrylic-based hardcourts.
I`m not so sure about it... You can build different courts with the same clay, too.... I`m not an specialist, but the method used in the construction and the different "ingredients" of the surface can make the difference... :scratch: "Acrylic-based" can include lots of different hardcourts...
But if you tell me you`re 100% sure about it....

lau
08-11-2005, 01:34 AM
BTW, when a tournament is played on carpet, the brand is named, because they are different. That`s why I think that the "Premier" brand is named. If not, what`s the reason for giving the brand names if all acrylic-based-hardcourts are the same?? I would be just "hardcourt" or "acrylic-based hardcourts" as it is "clay" or "red clay"...

ys
08-11-2005, 02:22 AM
BTW, when a tournament is played on carpet, the brand is named, because they are different. That`s why I think that the "Premier" brand is named. If not, what`s the reason for giving the brand names if all acrylic-based-hardcourts are the same?? I would be just "hardcourt" or "acrylic-based hardcourts" as it is "clay" or "red clay"...

The reason is simple. No indoors Slam. No one cares.

lau
08-11-2005, 02:40 AM
The reason is simple. No indoors Slam. No one cares.
If you say so.... :)

:secret: Sorry, but even like that I donīt think all acrylic-based hardcourts are the same... It doesnīt make much sense... but I might be wrong... :lol:

fco253
08-11-2005, 02:44 AM
YS, your arguments are getting weaker on each post... the GS issue makes no sense..

ys
08-11-2005, 02:48 AM
Sorry, but even like that I donīt think all acrylic-based hardcourts are the same... It doesnīt make much sense... but I might be wrong...

Do you seriously think that all hardcourts named "Decoturf" are the same? Regardless of contruction company and its technological differences? Regardless of the fact that they make DIFFERENT way - faster or slower - nearly every year.

Acryclic based hardcourts is the same basic technology. But the brands may differ, like my HP laptop differs from your Sony Vaio.

lau
08-11-2005, 02:55 AM
As I said, I`m not an specialist, so I would wait to know which tournaments the ITF say are played in the "premier" harcourt surface... I may be irracional, but it just doesnīt make sense to me why Spain complained ;)


Acryclic based hardcourts is the same basic technology. But the brands may differ, like my HP laptop differs from your Sony Vaio.
That could be the necessary difference to consider, according to DC rules, that the tie canīt be played in that surface :)

EDIT: It could be useful to know whatīs "different surface" according to the ITF

Nimomunz
08-11-2005, 11:57 AM
Spain complained coz the surface was too fast but thats the whole point of Davis Cup to do everything in your power to win Spai did the exact same thing when they played US with that unbelievably slow court!!

lau
08-11-2005, 12:14 PM
Spain suggested that the surface was not a "legal" surface,
( :scratch: I need to find that article... If I find it I`ll post it ;) )

Nimomunz
08-11-2005, 12:16 PM
so what happens when they complain.....does all of slovakias wins become null and void?

lau
08-11-2005, 12:23 PM
so what happens when they complain.....does all of slovakias wins become null and void?
:lol: I donīt think so...
I donīt know exactly what happends... I donīt even know if they did the official complaint...
Anyway, I never heard about this surface and that`s why I was asking. I might be wrong, but IMO, the brand is named because the surface is different. If this is what the ITF considers a "type" of surface (as they refer to it in their rules & regulations), then this surface might not be allowed.
If anyone knows which tournaments are played on this surface or knows for sure why the brand is named in hardcourts and carpet courts it would be awesome if you could tell me :)

Nimomunz
08-11-2005, 12:52 PM
Ocean city Tennis Center that has 5 USTA tournaments uses it.

lau
08-11-2005, 12:59 PM
Yeah, I knew USTA used this surface. But those are not considered the "minimum of three tournaments in the Men’s Professional Tour" the DC rules asks for, right?
I mean, they must be ATP tournaments (or 1 GS)... I guess
But thanks Nimomunz :) I think I watched some USTA tournaments on ESPN, but I donīt know where they were played..., didnīt pay much attention in that moment.

Neely
08-11-2005, 01:06 PM
Apparently you haven't heard much about tennis then. A big share of indoors tennis tournaments ( and even some outdoors tournaments, such as Houston Masters) are played on the surface called Greenset, which is exactly that - acrylic-based hardcourts.
If this acrylic court is such a Greenset court, why does using such a court now all of a sudden need special approval?

Or is this acrylic surface not equal to these Greenset courts? Or do I misunderstand something in generel here?

ys
08-11-2005, 02:16 PM
If this acrylic court is such a Greenset court, why does using such a court now all of a sudden need special approval?

Or is this acrylic surface not equal to these Greenset courts? Or do I misunderstand something in generel here?

Simple. Different manufacturer. Has to get certified and approved. As people said, there are several modification of acrylic hardcourts such as original Greenset and its later version ( Madrid, Houston, etc ), Opticourt ( Vienna ).. Premier is another brand.. Of course, they play in between of how Decoturf plays and carpets play.

fco253
08-11-2005, 04:11 PM
Ocean city Tennis Center that has 5 USTA tournaments uses it.

Rule 9.a Surface

"For all Ties in the World Group and Group I the court surface must be of a type used in a Grand Slam Tournament or in a minimum of three tournaments in the Men’s Professional Tour held in the year previous to the Tie."

For me, it's clear it refers to 3 ATP events, so Ocean City doesn't count...

Besides, the Spanish Team claimed the suface wasn't in between, but even faster than a carpet and on top of that, with a different bounce...

It's not about diminishing the power of choice of speed for home teams, but about fair opportunity, because how is gonna be a visitor properly trained if they can't play in the whole year on the specific surface?

They installed the "3 events rule", to avoid this issues ... because in the 80's, for instance, countries like Paraguay used to play in a wooden court...

Nimomunz
08-11-2005, 04:18 PM
wooden :lol: thats fucking squash not tennis :lol:

when they say a surface used on three tournies maybe they mean the 4 surfaces there are that is carpet, hard, clay, grass and probably dont ask about the type of clay used or the species of grass used. :shrug:

lau
08-11-2005, 04:56 PM
As far as I know Artificial Clay and Clay are clasified by the ITF as different surfaces in their pace rating.
And if I`m not wrong there are 8 different surfaces in that rating.
But I donīt know if this "Premier" acrylic surface must have the pace that appears in this rating as the pace of the acrylic surfaces. And this is what Spain complained about.
BTW, they classify hardcourts as acrylic, asfalt and concrete.

lau
08-11-2005, 05:07 PM
I found this :) http://www.itftennis.com/technical/equipment/courts/class.asp

But it says this Note: This scheme is not a mandatory requirement of the court surface selection process for any ITF tournaments and classification does not consitiute any form of ITF Approval.
So, it will be interesting to know what the ITF finally says about the surface... :lol:
I donīt think the tie will be played in other surface unless they prove in this period of time, before the tie, that Premier hardcourts are faster and the bounce is different... And even like that... Whatever, :lol:
You better start playing well David!! :(