15-15, Nadal calls for trainer [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

15-15, Nadal calls for trainer

Haute
08-09-2005, 08:26 PM
It's 15-15, 2-2 in the third set of his match against Moya, and he called for the trainer and just stopped playing in the middle of his service game. I thought players couldn't do that, that they had to wait until the end of the game before they could sit down. :confused:

Saumon
08-09-2005, 08:29 PM
noooooooo
what's wrong??? rafaaaa :bigcry:

Haute
08-09-2005, 08:33 PM
Cramping in his wrist, I think that's what the commentators said. I'm still confused though why the ump allowed him to stop play in the middle of the game.

Saumon
08-09-2005, 08:37 PM
didnt puerta call the trainer at 15-40 on his serve during the rg final?

freesbee
08-09-2005, 08:41 PM
he did and he won that game

1sun
08-09-2005, 08:56 PM
nadal taking tips from puerta.not cool mate.

nermo
08-09-2005, 09:03 PM
Really??, hope it's nothing Serious inshALLAh.. :eek:

don't really know, but i guess may be it's allowed when there's something very interrupting or very disturbing that it hinders the player's performance ..may be it's a relative thing, but i think, its the umpire's decision..to take it.. :confused:

oneandonlyhsn
08-09-2005, 09:14 PM
Really??, hope it's nothing Serious inshALLAh.. :eek:

don't really know, but i guess may be it's allowed when there's something very interrupting or very disturbing that it hinders the player's performance ..may be it's a relative thing, but i think, its the umpire's decision..to take it.. :confused:

:wavey: Inshallah nothing is serious, and Inshallah Roger comes back well and ready to kick ass :devil:

MariaV
08-09-2005, 09:49 PM
Rafa couldn't hold the racket so it was justified I guess. Not very nice for Carlos of course to lose the momentum.

Scotso
08-10-2005, 01:00 AM
There's nothing wrong with it. It's not as if it was 5-6 30-40. It was 2-2 15-15... not a big deal.

smucav
08-10-2005, 02:54 AM
It's 15-15, 2-2 in the third set of his match against Moya, and he called for the trainer and just stopped playing in the middle of his service game. I thought players couldn't do that, that they had to wait until the end of the game before they could sit down. :confused:2005 ATP Official Rulebook:
5) Time-out Procedures. The following time procedures shall be followed:
a) During the Match. A player can make the request and receive a medical time-out either: immediately, on the next change-over/set-break (in such case, the time-out is in addition to the time allowed for that change-over/set-break), or when the ATP Sports Medicine Trainer arrives, evaluates and is prepared to give treatment. If play is stopped until the Sports Medicine Trainer arrives, then when treatment or consultation is completed (prior to the completion of the medical time-out), play shall resume immediately except in the case of a re-warm-up. In addition, the Chair Umpire can stop play and call for the Sports Medicine Trainer, who may advise that continued play is detrimental to the player’s health. In that case, the Supervisor may retire the player from the match.

Experimentee
08-10-2005, 03:15 AM
I think they should only be allowed to call during the game if it is very serious, and cant wait till the end. Like if they fall over and severely twist their ankle. They shouldnt be allowed to do it for cramp because thats just lack of conditioning.

NYCtennisfan
08-10-2005, 03:40 AM
I believe thtey have changed the rules. You were not able to get treatment in the middle of a game before. I can't remember when they changed the rule. In any case, it was kind of weird. Cramping in the arm?

Clara Bow
08-10-2005, 03:46 AM
In any case, it was kind of weird. Cramping in the arm?

Supposidly that can be a result of lack of recent match play since it was in the arms and not a lack of fitness since it was not in the legs (per P McEnroe).

Anyway, I have to say that I agree with one of the British fellows who often comments on the Masters Tournaments that are shown on the Tennis Channel. You have to blame the rules and not the players. If the rules allow it, the players will use it. I saw that at Monte Carlo where Gasquet took an incredibly long injury time out that was well over allotment and got a full body massage for cramps. I was half expecting for them to dim the lights and play Enya. I saw that during the Puerta mid-point massage during the French Open. Do I blame the players? No. Because if there is a rule that allows things people will do it. That happens in sport and in life.

To alter the "If you build it they will come" line from Field of Dreams - if you allow it they will use it. (I know I do in situations in my life.)

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 06:11 AM
I think they should only be allowed to call during the game if it is very serious, and cant wait till the end. Like if they fall over and severely twist their ankle. They shouldnt be allowed to do it for cramp because thats just lack of conditioning.

Nadal didn't learn that trick from his mentor did he? It's a joke of a rule, but there are plenty of jokes going around at the moment.

~EMiLiTA~
08-10-2005, 09:58 AM
robredo also did it in the 2004 godo final 15-40 down when serving for the match because of "cramp" :rolleyes:

but don't get me started on that...

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 10:05 AM
robredo also did it in the 2004 godo final 15-40 down when serving for the match because of "cramp" :rolleyes:

but don't get me started on that...

Well, that makes two of us. I mean Rafa could have got treatment if he was close to having gangrene, but even that should be at the change of ends.

Bibir
08-10-2005, 11:12 AM
Marat did it against Nalbandian during RG 2004 because of his PAINFUL blisters.

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 11:49 AM
Marat did it against Nalbandian during RG 2004 because of his PAINFUL blisters.

It was still shit form, just like what Nadal did. Good to see the clowns at the ATP can't see how this rule has been manipulated, lucky I am not in charge, it wouldn't be happening.

Castafiore
08-10-2005, 12:49 PM
Good to see the clowns at the ATP can't see how this rule has been manipulated, lucky I am not in charge, it wouldn't be happening.
How are you going to decide which 'cramps' are 'fake' and just part of bad gamesmanship and which cramps are very real? Can a doctor tell if it's a real cramp or a fake one more than 2 hours into a match? Even if he can tell (because a tennis umpire isn't qualified to tell the difference), you still need a time-out for the examination.

The rule is a good one, IMO. Sure, maybe some players take advantage of maybe it's inevitable.

Call me naive, but I don't really think that Nadal would pull a trick like that to his good friend and mentor.
I haven't seen the match but others have said that it looked very real.
What was he supposed to do, by the way?
One set each, two games in the third set each in a match with a maximum of three sets? At this crucial point, he has cramps in his serving hand in his own game.
Option 1: play with the cramps to avoid getting the label of being a 'faker' and risk losing that game + the match
Option 2: get a time-out and resolve the problem. The opponent in this case is an experienced player who should know how to handle a time-out. Sure, it's not really fair on Moya perhaps but I'm sure that Nadal did not ask for a jammed finger either.
(speaking from experience: getting cramps in one finger is hell...and it does affect your entire hand and it does affect your arm. I tend to have them in my little finger and you can not believe how much of an impact such a little finger can have...so if Rafael did have those cramps, he needed a time-out right then and there).

~EMiLiTA~
08-10-2005, 12:53 PM
i also don't think rafa's was intentional

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 12:57 PM
How are you going to decide which 'cramps' are 'fake' and just part of bad gamesmanship and which cramps are very real? Can a doctor tell if it's a real cramp or a fake one more than 2 hours into a match? Even if he can tell (because a tennis umpire isn't qualified to tell the difference), you still need a time-out for the examination.

The rule is a good one, IMO. Sure, maybe some players take advantage of maybe it's inevitable.

Here it is, a player should only get treatment at the change of ends and not during the game. It's a shit rule and penalises people who do the work off the court. Cramps are preventable and are a loss of conditioning and not an injury per se.

Ok, if a player wants to take a timeout during a game, no problem, then forfeit the game.

Bibir
08-10-2005, 01:31 PM
It was still shit form, just like what Nadal did.
Worse, If I remember well Marat did it against Starace too...He saved a MP and took a time-out at 40/40. :o

I think he said in itw that it was part of the game now.

Good to see the clowns at the ATP can't see how this rule has been manipulated, lucky I am not in charge, it wouldn't be happening.
What's that ATP??...Another growth Hormone?

~EMiLiTA~
08-10-2005, 01:34 PM
Ok, if a player wants to take a timeout during a game, no problem, then forfeit the game.

:yeah:

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 01:37 PM
Worse, If I remember well Marat did it against Starace too...He saved a MP and took a time-out at 40/40. :o

I think he said in itw that it was part of the game now.

It was crap then and a shitty rule, but hey it's not illegal.

What's that ATP??...Another growth Hormone?

A parasitical worm.

Castafiore
08-10-2005, 01:40 PM
a player should only get treatment at the change of ends and not during the game
I can understand that viewpoint.
In cycling, when one cyclists gets injured...the others don't stop. The race continues and the cyclist either quits or he gets on his bike, gets treatment on the bike and gets on with it. I have seen cyclists ride with severe cramps, cracked ribs, a dislocated shoulder (no kidding!),...You need to be very tough for that sport.

I agree that it's not fair on the other player to get a time-out in the middle of a game. In this case, Nadal did not do this intentionally, I believe he did have a jammed finger in his left hand and he's using the rule to his advantage.
Blame the rule, not the player.
On the other hand, cramps is - like you said - not an injury and most cramps can be easily solved (although sometimes, the time-out is too short).
So, in my opinion...it's more fair to deal with those cramps right then and there and to get on with the match with full strength.
Most top players have had to deal with interruptions and time-outs during unlucky moments in the match. It's usually interesting to see how the other player deals with it and sometimes, I do feel sorry for them when I see that they have lost momentum after that.

I don't have a problem with mind games actually. Sure, I can get very annoyed when it's used against one of my favourites but I accept it as part of the game.
But, I also don't have a problem (in general) with the antics of players like Hewitt and Coria either whereas lots of people here love to hate them.

Chloe le Bopper
08-10-2005, 01:50 PM
:rolleyes:

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 01:56 PM
I agree that it's not fair on the other player to get a time-out in the middle of a game. In this case, Nadal did not do this intentionally, I believe he did have a jammed finger in his left hand and he's using the rule to his advantage.
Blame the rule, not the player.

Already found a way to stop the problem of abuse, tough shit he got a jammed finger.

On the other hand, cramps is - like you said - not an injury and most cramps can be easily solved (although sometimes, the time-out is too short).
So, in my opinion...it's more fair to deal with those cramps right then and there and to get on with the match with full strength.
Most top players have had to deal with interruptions and time-outs during unlucky moments in the match. It's usually interesting to see how the other player deals with it and sometimes, I do feel sorry for them when I see that they have lost momentum after that.

You might as well have on court coaching and have official timeouts and hold up the play even more than Massu does. How is it fairer, to deal with the cramps then? It isn't and since cramp isn't an injury it should have the status of an injury time out, got to do the work off the court, take the electrolytes, salt and water to make sure it doesn't happen.


I don't have a problem with mind games actually. Sure, I can get very annoyed when it's used against one of my favourites but I accept it as part of the game.
But, I also don't have a problem (in general) with the antics of players like Hewitt and Coria either whereas lots of people here love to hate them.

Yes, so you like the fact that a chicken shit Robredo decided to take a time out at 15-40 when serving for the match, then doesn't lose a point after that. I don't like it when a favourite player of mine does it, why would I like it otherwise.

Actually hitting the ball to the person at the net, is part of the game. Why? It's the easiest way to win the point and accepted, but faking injury is just crap.

Castafiore
08-10-2005, 02:00 PM
Man, don't get so upset over this.

It's a jammed finger.
He played within the rules.
You dislike that rule, used for cramps
I don't have a problem with that rule being used for cramps. Mind games or not.

Chloe le Bopper
08-10-2005, 02:01 PM
Not that this was the case with Nadal, but I have tendonitis in my left wrist, so to hear that the only reason that wrist might "cramp up" is due to a "lack of conditioning" is more than just a little bit amusing.

As far as I know Nadal does not have tendonitis... but I'm just calling pure bullshit where I see it :)

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 02:02 PM
Man, don't get so upset over this.

It's a jammed finger.
He played within the rules.
You dislike that rule.
I don't have a problem with that rule. Mind games or not.

I am not upset about it, it's a shit rule and said why it's crap.

Castafiore
08-10-2005, 02:04 PM
Not that this was the case with Nadal, but I have tendonitis in my left wrist, so to hear that the only reason that wrist might "cramp up" is due to a "lack of conditioning" is more than just a little bit amusing.

As far as I know Nadal does not have tendonitis... but I'm just calling pure bullshit where I see it :)

Exactly, it is bullshit. I have cramps as well and it doesn't have anything to do with 'tendonitis' or with a 'lack of conditioning'.
There are several reasons to get cramps. So, it is too simple to say that he should be able to prevent the cramps without knowing exactly why he had the cramps.

What exactly the reason Nadal had...I don't know. I'm not in his tennis shoes and I'm not a doctor either.

Chloe le Bopper
08-10-2005, 02:06 PM
What exactly the reason Nadal had...I don't know. I'm not in his tennis shoes and I'm not a doctor either.

Indeed. Nor am I :) Nor did he call it at such an important point in the match that I would have to consider his actions extremely fishy. Yes, it was mid game, but it was nothing remotely like what Robredo did against Gaudio.

But what do I know, I'm not the expert here apparently.

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 02:09 PM
Not that this was the case with Nadal, but I have tendonitis in my left wrist, so to hear that the only reason that wrist might "cramp up" is due to a "lack of conditioning" is more than just a little bit amusing.

As far as I know Nadal does not have tendonitis... but I'm just calling pure bullshit where I see it :)

It's as amusing as having it in both wrists.

He has had some time off and that contributed to this, but it wasn't so serious, that it couldn't have waited till the end of the game.

As for pure bullshit that would be me saying it's alright for players I like to do it and ones that I don't, that it's wrong.

Nimomunz
08-10-2005, 02:10 PM
if your body is well conditioned you dont get cramps so i'm here busting my ass to get in shape so i dont cramp up and there you are taking a timeout for cramps when i'm about to break. thats not fair!!

Chloe le Bopper
08-10-2005, 02:13 PM
It's as amusing as having it in both wrists.

He has had some time off and that contributed to this, but it wasn't so serious, that it couldn't have waited till the end of the game.

Perhaps it was serious enough that he wouldn't have won another point in that particular game without treatment? The fact is that you don't know. You assume and generalize based on your own biases on the topic.

It must be nice to know so much about what is going on in other people's bodies :)

As for pure bullshit that would be me saying it's alright for players I like to do it and ones that I don't, that it's wrong.

It is bullshit to assume that one can only feel a cramping sensation in a particular part of their body because of a lack of conditioning. I don't give a crap if you apply the same misconception to every player - the misconception is just that... a misconception.

Frankly, I don't care if Rafa was actually that hurt or not, that isn't even the point here. I took issue with your insistence that one only cramps in a particular area of their body due to poor conditioning. Sorry, you're wrong. Try again.

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 02:20 PM
Perhaps it was serious enough that he wouldn't have won another point in that particular game without treatment? The fact is that you don't know. You assume and generalize based on your own biases on the topic.

It must be nice to know so much about what is going on in other people's bodies :)

It's speculation and have never said it was fact.

It is bullshit to assume that one can only feel a cramping sensation in a particular part of their body because of a lack of conditioning. I don't give a crap if you apply the same misconception to every player - the misconception is just that... a misconception.

Well it's not like Rafa hasn't done the physical work, but why would he cramp there at that point, if either he didn't have enough water, salt and he is always taking some form of electrolytes in his system, so it's hard to believe that one of the fittest guys on tour has that problem.

Frankly, I don't care if Rafa was actually that hurt or not, that isn't even the point here. I took issue with your insistence that one only cramps in a particular area of their body due to poor conditioning. Sorry, you're wrong. Try again.

He needed a break and took advantage of the rules in his favour.

Chloe le Bopper
08-10-2005, 02:22 PM
Holy shit.

You totally missed the point.

ExpectedWinner
08-10-2005, 02:24 PM
The rule should go. I can't think of any other sport where you are allowed to get medical help in the middle of the action w/o any consequences.

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 02:27 PM
Holy shit.

You totally missed the point.

Ok, what's the point that I am missing?

Nadal needed a break and took advantage of the rules to do so, it's a shit rule, but legally fine.

Choupi
08-10-2005, 02:48 PM
Sorry to interrupt the flow of convo between specialists here but I've seen part of the match and I've been surprised by the moment Rafa called for the trainer. Does somebody think like me that the cramp resulted maybe from Rafa getting tense, and not because of a lack of physical conditioning? We all know how fit Rafa is and I seriously doubt he was cramping of tiredness. Moya was really giving him a hard time and it had been a long time since a player hadn't "bothered" him that way...I might be totally wrong. I'm absolutely no specialist, or so-called.

Agreeing or not with the rule Rafa has stuck to, that's another issue. :)

Chloe le Bopper
08-10-2005, 02:49 PM
Sorry Choupie, but one can ONLY cramp because of lack of conditioning. There is no other medical reason for this to occur. The expert has spoken on the matter!

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 03:02 PM
Nervous tension is another reason that players and people can cramp up, and there was a rather famous situation in that RG final, where it was nervous tension of the particular situation that led to the involuntary cramping of Coria in that match and not the physical.

Overexertion in the heat is another reason that cramping could happen and force the muscles to contract and there is no set time that they can last for, as it's an involuntary action.

Choupi
08-10-2005, 03:06 PM
Sorry Choupie, but one can ONLY cramp because of lack of conditioning. There is no other medical reason for this to occur. The expert has spoken on the matter!
Well, my turn to be sorry...I will speak for myself only, and mostly about sthg I'm living with for many years. I can attest that you can have cramp for other reasons than lack of conditioning. I'm suffering spasmophilia and it is really amazing to see what the mind can provoke on the body without you being able to do anything to keep control. And when I do have a stroke, which is less and less frequent, luckily, thanks to a big work on mental dealing with it, I suffer huge cramps before fainting. Everybody thinks about ppl shaking from all their body when they think of ppl suffer spasmophilia, but there are different types. I can assure you I don't lack physical conditioning. :) That explains why I've brought the hypothesis of Rafa cramping because getting tense. I repeat it, maybe I'm wrong. I've never said it was what actually happened. But I know far too well how the mind can affect the body.

Nimomunz
08-10-2005, 03:12 PM
i doubt rafa has spasmophilia

Choupi
08-10-2005, 03:18 PM
i doubt rafa has spasmophilia
Who said he had?

Castafiore
08-10-2005, 03:23 PM
Nimonutz :rolleyes: Choupi was just using it as an example to explain that there is more than one explanation behind cramps.
Of course he does not have spasmophilia.

Nervous tension is another reason that players and people can cramp up, and there was a rather famous situation in that RG final, where it was nervous tension of the particular situation that led to the involuntary cramping of Coria in that match and not the physical.

Overexertion in the heat is another reason that cramping could happen and force the muscles to contract and there is no set time that they can last for, as it's an involuntary action.
Sure! There are other reasons for cramps beside that list as well.

Somebody mentionned that Nadal did this when Moya was about to break.
Moya didn't have a break point when Nadal called in a time-out. It wasn't 0-40 or 15-40 or 30-40. I don't remember the exact score but it was something like 0-15 or 0-30 (does anybody remember the score).
Maybe Moya would have broken through if Nadal had continued but maybe not. It's a moot point because there was no break point.

Maybe Nadal sensed the danger of a break and he used the rule to get a bit of rest before continuing the fight but that's beside the point IMO.

He played within the rules and I'm OK with that. Moya is a big boy, experienced so he should be able to handle a time-out. I'm not just saying this because Nadal is one of my favourites. I stand by my opinion even if other players I like less use that rule.
Mind games are part of this sport. It's not just a matter of beautiful shots and good timing. I like the mind games. I was a huge fan of John McEnroe (even if he was a bit childish at times) because he used every trick in the book to win and to dominate his opponent in every possible way.
Hell, I'm still sorry that I had to miss that DC match between Hewitt and Coria.

Choupi
08-10-2005, 03:28 PM
Nimonutz :rolleyes: Choupi was just using it as an example to explain that there is more than one explanation behind cramps.
Of course he does not have spasmophilia.
What's sure is that I absolutely don't wish him to have it! Given that crowded places tend to increase the risk of strokes for me, you can imagine if he fainted in the middle of a match! See how it goes when he cramps during a match.... :D

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 03:30 PM
Maybe Nadal sensed the danger of a break and he used the rule to get a bit of rest before continuing the fight but that's beside the point IMO.

He used the rules to his advantage and it was at 15 all when he did it, well it wasn't a Robredo, maybe he learnt it from him.

If you want mind games, go watch chess,

Nimomunz
08-10-2005, 03:32 PM
of course i know that am not a complete idiot.
of course thare are many reasons for cramps:Inadequate stretching and overexertion can build up of lactic acid in your muscles. Muscle fatigue and dehydration may also contribute. Cramps are more likely to happen in hot weather since you lose more fluids. Pregnant women and women on their menstrual cycle cramp easily but i'm not gonna mention it becoz hey odds are a player on the ATP isnt included here. Epileptics also cramp but i'm not gonna mention that either.

Castafiore
08-10-2005, 03:33 PM
What's sure is that I absolutely don't wish him to have it! Given that crowded places tend to increase the risk of strokes for me, you can imagine if he fainted in the middle of a match! See how it goes when he cramps during a match.... :D
I can imagine how bad that must be for you, Choupi.

My cramps sure aren't as bad as yours but you tend to lose a bit of control over parts of your body and it's painful on top of that. It's not exactly my idea of fun either.
I hate those cramps and I just can't agree with people who think it's a poor excuse for a time-out.

If you want mind games, go watch chess
:rolleyes:
Come on, George. You can do better than that.
Can't we agree that we think differently on this matter without the silly one-liners?

He used the rules to his advantage and it was at 15 all when he did it
It was 15 all?
Oh right! (just noticed the thread title :o ) So, Moya did not even have a lead in that game?
Recap: it was one set each, two games each, 15 each.
Man, I really don't understand the fuss over this.
IMO, you guys are just nitpicking.

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 03:40 PM
My cramps sure aren't as bad as yours but you tend to lose a bit of control over parts of your body and it's painful on top of that. It's not exactly my idea of fun either.
I hate those cramps and I just can't agree with people who think it's a poor excuse for a time-out.

:rolleyes:
Come on, George. You can do better than that.
Can't we agree that we think differently on this matter without the silly one-liners?

So you think it's alright for someone in a physically demanding sport, not to be rewarded for good preparation then? As Nimo and myself have mentioned how and why it has happened and why it's shit and you have said why it's a good option.

As for the chess comment, well don't expect people to be happy when someone tries the antics, there isn't a need for the cheap timeout, but as long as you don't complain about it when it happens to someone you like, then that's fine.

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 03:43 PM
It was 15 all? So, Moya did not even have a lead in that game?
Recap: it was one set each, two games each, 15 each.
Man, I really don't understand the fuss over this.
IMO, you guys are just nitpicking.

The thread title says it was 15 all. I never said it was when he had the lead, when did I say that? I am fully aware of the circumstances and as for nitpicking, he could have waited to the end of the game. Then again, what's alright and what's not. Taking a toilet break just before a match point is good then?

Castafiore
08-10-2005, 03:43 PM
So you think it's alright for someone in a physically demanding sport, not to be rewarded for good preparation then? As Nimo and myself have mentioned how and why it has happened and why it's shit and you have said why it's a good option.

I know that you like to have the upper hand in every discussion, George but we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

"So you think it's alright for someone in a physically demanding sport, not to be rewarded for good preparation then"
I find this comment over the top, just like your cheap "chess' one-liner.
You don't agree with my viewpoint on the matter. Fine. I disagree with your viewpoint because it's an overreaction from where I'm sitting. I'm sure that we both won't lose any sleep over this! It's not that important.

Castafiore
08-10-2005, 03:47 PM
The thread title says it was 15 all. I never said it was when he had the lead, when did I say that? I am fully aware of the circumstances and as for nitpicking, he could have waited to the end of the game. Then again, what's alright and what's not.
:o
I noticed the thread title too...bit late, I know ;)

Calm down, George. I did not say that you claimed that he had the lead but somebody else used the argument that it was not fair because Moya was about to break. He wasn't.

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 03:47 PM
I know that you like to have the upper hand in every discussion, George but we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

"So you think it's alright for someone in a physically demanding sport, not to be rewarded for good preparation then"
I find this comment over the top, just like your cheap "chess' one-liner.
You don't agree with my viewpoint on the matter.
I'm sure that we both won't lose any sleep over this! It's not that important.

It's not a question of getting an upper hand. As for the comment being over the top, the chess one was not exactly serious, but if I'm playing sport or training a team, then they have to be physically prepared to last and handle the conditions and not take a soft option, like many players do, it doesn't make it better, just different.

As for losing sleep, nah! I don't think so.

Choupi
08-10-2005, 03:50 PM
I can imagine how bad that must be for you, Choupi.
My cramps sure aren't as bad as yours but you tend to lose a bit of control over parts of your body and it's painful on top of that. It's not exactly my idea of fun either.
I hate those cramps and I just can't agree with people who think it's a poor excuse for a time-out.
I know what cramping means...and yes, it is painfull...but when I have strokes, I don't cramp. I faint and when I wake up, I feel the pain in all my muscles as if I had had huge cramps...even worse! I'd rather be cramping...at least I'd know why it hurts. What I do hate the most is that you have absolutely no control over what's happening. Anyway, thanks for your concern... :)

Nimomunz
08-10-2005, 03:50 PM
if GWH lost sleep over every or any argument he got into then he would be an insomniac. :lol:

Action Jackson
08-10-2005, 03:53 PM
if GWH lost sleep over every or any argument he got into then he would be an insomniac. :lol:

Or balding and having a massive heart attack due to stress.

MariaV
08-10-2005, 05:39 PM
if GWH lost sleep over every or any argument he got into then he would be an insomniac. :lol:
Maybe he IS an insomniac? ;)

Btw, I don´t understand the fuss either. :shrug:

NYCtennisfan
08-10-2005, 06:14 PM
I think someone like GWH is a purist and doesn't like to see many of the rules changed i.e. no coaching, timeouts in the middle of a game, etc. Injury timeouts used to have to wait for changeovers.

Frankly, I do see how someone can take advantage of this rule but I also like to see someone get attention when he needs it to minimize injury and player withdrawals from tournaments.