'I think he's the best player on any surface' [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

'I think he's the best player on any surface'

federer express
04-12-2005, 01:30 PM
...thats what cowan said about federer when watching him destroy rusedski. is he right? can federer really be called the best on clay when he hasn't been past the qf stage of roland garros yet??

makro120
04-12-2005, 01:35 PM
Yes, he will do the same thing on clay this year as he did on other surfaces last year. He will take us by storm and surprise us.

federer express
04-12-2005, 01:36 PM
Yes, he will do the same thing on clay this year as he did on other surfaces last year. He will take us by storm and surprise us.

maybe...who knows. what i do know is that your signature isn't entirely correct though :p and i disagree...dont think he can dominate on clay for a whole season

bad gambler
04-12-2005, 01:37 PM
makro why on earth do you still have that signature?

Fumus
04-12-2005, 01:41 PM
I think he can be the best player on any surface, depends on the day, really. As far as clay goes if he shows up and plays his best he could give anyone a bad day. Nadal, Gaudio, and Coria are the best players on this surface until proven otherwise.

WyveN
04-12-2005, 01:55 PM
whoever wins the FO is the best clay court player of the past 12 months so if Roger does that then he can be called that fairly.

federer express
04-12-2005, 01:59 PM
whoever wins the FO is the best clay court player of the past 12 months so if Roger does that then he can be called that fairly.

whoever wins the french is the best player on clay for the last 2 weeks...maybe!! :)

joeb_uk
04-12-2005, 02:08 PM
cowan is federers and tims cheerleader, he is up their arse all day long.

joeb_uk
04-12-2005, 02:08 PM
whoever wins the FO is the best clay court player of the past 12 months so if Roger does that then he can be called that fairly.
:yeah:

Skyward
04-12-2005, 02:13 PM
Nadal, Gaudio, and Coria are the best players on this surface until proven otherwise.

Shall we wait till Nadal wins the FO or at least TMS on clay?

WyveN
04-12-2005, 02:19 PM
whoever wins the french is the best player on clay for the last 2 weeks...maybe!! :)

french is the biggest clay event by far, i cant think of a better criteria for determining best clay courter of the year.

JeNn
04-12-2005, 02:24 PM
french is the biggest clay event by far, i cant think of a better criteria for determining best clay courter of the year.

True. That holds up better for Wimbledon and grass though. There are enough big tournaments on clay in a year that an RG result can be overriden IMO. For example I still considered JCF the best clay court player in the world even though Costa beat him in '02. You even get aberrations at GS's.

mickymouse
04-12-2005, 02:27 PM
french is the biggest clay event by far, i cant think of a better criteria for determining best clay courter of the year.

So I guess you really feel that Gaudio was the best player on clay last year?

Puschkin
04-12-2005, 02:50 PM
So I guess you really feel that Gaudio was the best player on clay last year?

I'd be in great trouble to name the best clay-courter last year, my feeling is that quite a few players shared the booty ;)

WyveN
04-12-2005, 03:31 PM
So I guess you really feel that Gaudio was the best player on clay last year?

why not? although the final was so close that a case can be made for coria

federer express
04-12-2005, 04:35 PM
True. That holds up better for Wimbledon and grass though. There are enough big tournaments on clay in a year that an RG result can be overriden IMO. For example I still considered JCF the best clay court player in the world even though Costa beat him in '02. You even get aberrations at GS's.

exactly! :yeah: well said...i agree completely. the winner of wimbledon is the best grass court player for that year. but the winner of any of the other 3 slams is not necessarily the best on that surface. if verkerk had beaten ferrero (huge if i know), would he have been the best clay courter that year? hell no! (in my humble opinion)

Chloe le Bopper
04-12-2005, 04:42 PM
makro why on earth do you still have that signature?
Because s/he is a moron.

WyveN
04-12-2005, 05:52 PM
For example I still considered JCF the best clay court player in the world even though Costa beat him in '02.

I dont really care who the best clay courter was in 02 but given that Costa won RG by actually beating Ferrero comfortably in the final deciding match I think a decent case can be made for him. Its easy to write of results such as Gaudios/Costas as flukes but all the other players were in the draw and everyone had a equal opportunity to win so excuses (such as choked in slam final) are really not relevant.

alfonsojose
04-12-2005, 06:34 PM
Roger, f*ck me :bounce: :bounce: :p

makro120
04-12-2005, 07:08 PM
Because s/he is a moron.

thank you, you are nice too. :rolleyes:

uNIVERSE mAN
04-12-2005, 07:22 PM
I think he can be the best player on any surface, depends on the day, really. As far as clay goes if he shows up and plays his best he could give anyone a bad day. Nadal, Gaudio, and Coria are the best players on this surface until proven otherwise.

Why the hell is Nadal's name coming up so much? What exactly has he proven on clay? And since when do we treat probable future abilities as proven ability? he's never won a Master's Series on clay, and hasn't even played FO.

And Gaudio? Before last year's fluke FO win he hadn't done anything either, sure he's good on clay, but not the type of player that causes opponents to faint before they meet him. Coria hasn't done much on any surface in over 6 months, granted he was injured, but the fact remains.

All the supposed specialists are out of form, there're no favourites this year. Nadal has a lot to learn, JCF, Coria, Kuerten are all playing terrible.

Never underestimate the fear factor. Coria had it last year on clay, this year nope. Some matches get won when you break your opponents confidence before they even face you, as though they have no chance of winning. No clay courter this year has that.

NYCtennisfan
04-12-2005, 07:42 PM
When he is on, he will beat anybody on clay. The problem is that he will not be able to get away with being sloppy on clay because it is harder to hit winners and hitting a few winners is what gets Federer in his groove. Down 4-1 in the 3rd against Nadal, Fed hit some winners to hold and then some winners to break. He found his rhythm.

NATAS81
04-12-2005, 07:58 PM
what i do know is that your signature isn't entirely correct though
Yeah, he should leave a space before adding the second :worship: to even it out :yeah:

Jenrios
04-12-2005, 08:52 PM
cowan is federers and tims cheerleader, he is up their arse all day long.

:worship:

so true! Sky's commentary teams are the biggest bandwagoners going! I sometimes turn the sound down cos I can't stand it. Yesterday they come up with some gems - Gaudio will have a lot of points coming off at RG - because Chris Bailey has no faith in him doing well there. Safin is not a worthy rival for Fed was another. They are so biased towards some players, it's sickening.

Sjengster
04-12-2005, 09:02 PM
Bazza can be an idiot at times, but when Bails made the same sniggering suggestion in Miami that Gaudio was starting to get worried at the prospect of having 1000 points to defend in May, Cowan shut up him instantly by replying bluntly, "No, I don't think he's worried at all. He's won the French Open, he's had a brilliant career, what's to be worried about?" And the point about Safin not being a rival with Federer was that he isn't consistent enough in every tournament to form an ongoing rivalry with Federer, whereas Hewitt will be meeting him in a lot of finals. I don't think anyone's disputing that in tennistic terms Safin can be Federer's main threat on tour.

Jenrios
04-12-2005, 09:11 PM
In that case, Kudos to Bazza for defending Gaudio. Re Safin - they usually brag him up as well - how quick they change.

Scotso
04-12-2005, 09:18 PM
:yawn:

Sjengster
04-12-2005, 09:30 PM
In that case, Kudos to Bazza for defending Gaudio. Re Safin - they usually brag him up as well - how quick they change.

True, but it's more a case of how quickly Safin changes. ;)

federer express
04-12-2005, 09:36 PM
True, but it's more a case of how quickly Safin changes. ;)

i have to agree with the sky team on most of what they say:
Q: is federer that good? A: yes
Q: will safin be a consistent rival? A: probably not
Q: will gaudio lose points at the french? A: probably

but importantly they are not the only ppl who use superlatives when describing federer's game. i think john mcenroe has been more complimentary than anyone else i have ever heard. it is just more annoying coming from idiots like bailey! (personally i dont actually mind cowan...think most of what he says is quite sensible)

Jenrios
04-12-2005, 09:39 PM
True, but it's more a case of how quickly Safin changes. ;)

:)

Sjengster
04-12-2005, 09:40 PM
Well, at least Bailey never did something as daft as pick Federer to win RG and Wimbledon back to back at the age of 20 with a grand total of 3 titles under his belt; I recall with amusement now the sledging that Bails gave Federer after some of his dismal Masters Series exits in 2002 (deservedly so in some cases, he was right on the money about Federer's first-round tank in Rome that year). He clearly liked Roddick so much more and thought he was the one who would go on to achieve greatness, and now you see him falling over himself to deliver the praise for Federer.

Jenrios
04-12-2005, 09:44 PM
Johnny Mac is the biggest bandwagoner/publicity junkie of all time. He's 'all over' every 'rising' player. I'm so glad Rios put him in his place when he tried to board his bandwagon.

As for Bails and Petch, in particular, they rile me when I have to hear their comments on any top 10 players shot or make disparaging remarks about a player's style of play or looks, when, basically, what did they achieve? Bails is still dinning out on having had a match point against Ivanisevic all those years back. They are smug and self-satisfied, when they have nothing to be smug and self-satisfied about. It's a bit rich Petch mocking Massu as 'racoon man' when he has a face liked a boiled ham.

federer express
04-12-2005, 09:47 PM
It's a bit rich Petch mocking Massu as 'racoon man' when he has a face liked a boiled ham.

:worship: :bigclap: :haha: :yeah: :hatoff:
u might have guessed i agree :p

Sjengster
04-12-2005, 09:49 PM
Personally, I'm never convinced by the "Well what did you do to entitle you to talk about other people's careers?" argument. Sure, Bails and Petch were journeymen, but they were still pros - they know the match routines that players go through, they can see what challenges they have to deal with and the patterns of play that are needed to alter the course of a match, etc. The greatest players don't always make the best analysts of the game, and it's not as though the Sky team don't realise their playing limitations. Hell, they make fun of their hopelessness as former players all the time, it's practically become a cliche to see them take the piss out of each other.

federer express
04-12-2005, 10:02 PM
Personally, I'm never convinced by the "Well what did you do to entitle you to talk about other people's careers?"

not sure anyone who posts here can really subscribe to that point of view...

Sjengster
04-12-2005, 10:07 PM
True, ha ha, but I mean the sort of people who say "I'm sick of commentator X and analyst Y saying nasty things about players, what they did ever achieve in their career to give them the right to look down on today's pros?" As if players should be immune to criticism if they've reached a certain level of the game. Sure, you can disagree with the opinions of people like Petch and Bailey, but that's a feeble argument to rest your case on.

federer express
04-12-2005, 10:12 PM
True, ha ha, but I mean the sort of people who say "I'm sick of commentator X and analyst Y saying nasty things about players, what they did ever achieve in their career to give them the right to look down on today's pros?" As if players should be immune to criticism if they've reached a certain level of the game. Sure, you can disagree with the opinions of people like Petch and Bailey, but that's a feeble argument to rest your case on.

if that was to me, i was agreeing with your point. everyone here comments on players and as far as i know anyone in the top 100 or maybe even 500 would kick the arse of everybody who posts here....and kick it very hard. does that mean we cant comment on their games? of course not. anyone who has read my views on gonzalez and nalbandian (2 extremely talented players) will know by now that i am perfectly happy to moan about the standard of ppl who could beat me without dropping a point. it is the job of a commentator to be critical at times (regardless of their own standard of play) and i think most of us accept that

Sjengster
04-12-2005, 10:17 PM
Yep. Of course, the Sky team had their 15 minutes of fame as players and can be proud of it; Shiras and Petch both took Agassi to three sets once (Petch in Miami, which is pretty impressive), and we all know that once British wildcards take a big name player to five sets at Wimbledon, they're set for life as broadcasters. I have to admit, when I was watching that Sampras-Cowan match I would never have thought old Bazza could carve a TV career out of that performance, but he undoubtably has done.

Petch beat Kucera, Corretja, Muster and Chang in his playing career (the first two when they were still teenagers, Muster on grass... but every win counts, eh?).

federer express
04-12-2005, 10:20 PM
Petch beat Kucera, Corretja, Muster and Chang in his playing career (the first two when they were still teenagers, Muster on grass... but every win counts, eh?).

petchey actually had pretty decent ability. was just a bit fucked up in the head apparently!

Dirk
04-13-2005, 04:46 AM
Johnny Mac is the biggest bandwagoner/publicity junkie of all time. He's 'all over' every 'rising' player. I'm so glad Rios put him in his place when he tried to board his bandwagon.

As for Bails and Petch, in particular, they rile me when I have to hear their comments on any top 10 players shot or make disparaging remarks about a player's style of play or looks, when, basically, what did they achieve? Bails is still dinning out on having had a match point against Ivanisevic all those years back. They are smug and self-satisfied, when they have nothing to be smug and self-satisfied about. It's a bit rich Petch mocking Massu as 'racoon man' when he has a face liked a boiled ham.

What did Rios say to Mac? Rios refused to shake Drysdale's hand. :lol: The officials told him that he was the first ATP president and Rios just blew him off. :rolls:

federer express
04-13-2005, 01:56 PM
montanes may be the latest to adopt cowan's view

Jenrios
04-13-2005, 04:23 PM
Sjengster - Bails and Petch cannot even be really called journeymen:) I just find their antics juvenile at times and sychaphantic. I take your point about ex-players, but really, they don't so much analyse, they mock. Cowan, most of the time, is ok. Best commentators IMO are David Mercer and Frew MacMillan. Worst, Simon Reed.

Jenrios
04-13-2005, 04:30 PM
What did Rios say to Mac? Rios refused to shake Drysdale's hand. :lol: The officials told him that he was the first ATP president and Rios just blew him off. :rolls:

From 97 and 98, when alot of pundits had already predicted great things for Rios, Johnny Mac made a big deal out of the fact that Rios was coached by Stefanki, who had coached him and therefore knew how to nurture talent. He kept making comparisons between him and Rios, and name-dropping - like 'Stefanki says this, Stefanki says that', speaking like he had insider knowledge - ie, making himself important to the current 'hot player' - and when Rios was asked aboutt he influence Johnny Mac had on him, Rios said he didn't have any and anyway, he didn't know him personally:) Naturally, when Rios split from Stefanki, Mac put the boot in with Rios - not that Rios cared anyway:)

Henman dissed him really well to - come Wimbledon time, Mac is always in the press - usually the Sunday Telegraph - rattling on about how good or bad Henman is, and Tim slammed him as '2-faced' because he hung around the locker room being buddy buddy with the players and then slated them in the press.

Thanks for the Drysdale story - didn't know that one - but my friends in the US say Drysdale was always on his back. Now I know why:) Personally, I'm glad Rios tells it how it is, even if some call it obnoxious behaviour - I love his honesty and his refusal to be phased by anybody.

WyveN
04-13-2005, 05:11 PM
I remember Mac talking up Federer quite some time before he beat Sampras at Wimbledon so maybe thats why he goes over the top about him, because he spotted him early.

federer express
04-13-2005, 05:24 PM
I remember Mac talking up Federer quite some time before he beat Sampras at Wimbledon so maybe thats why he goes over the top about him, because he spotted him early.

hardly a great spot that. a blind man could see federer's talent even before the sampras win.

Jenrios
04-15-2005, 04:24 PM
hardly a great spot that. a blind man could see federer's talent even before the sampras win.

Exactly! Fed was already touted as a future Wimbledon champ before he beat Sampras at Wimbledon.

Geniey2g
04-15-2005, 05:42 PM
lol @ Petchey all up Gasquet's arse now :rolleyes: Before this, he was saying what an unimpressive 2004 he had.

I saw it coming! Can you say "bandwagon jumper"??

federer express
04-15-2005, 05:43 PM
lol @ Petchey all up Gasquet's arse now :rolleyes: Before this, he was saying what an unimpressive 2004 he had.

I saw it coming! Can you say "bandwagon jumper"??

french for bandwagon jumper? :confused: nope, i dont know it :p

brazuca5copas
04-15-2005, 07:22 PM
I don't think Roger is the best on clay, about the anothers surfaces no doubts : he's the best. I think everybody here don't remember what happened last year in French Open. Federer lost Guga 0-3... btw Guga had a tough injury. And also Federer lost to Costa in Roma. So, of course he's great even on the clay, but not the best. It's just my opinion.

federer express
04-16-2005, 06:37 PM
for me.....

hard = federer
grass= federer
carpet= federer
clay= coria (but most will say he needs to win the french first)

World Beater
04-16-2005, 08:24 PM
for me.....


carpet= federer


:confused: :haha:

What has he done on carpet? There are better players. Safin, Henman are two. I would like to see rusedski indoors on carpet against federer. He has won paris and beaten the indoor master sampras.

Enqvist and Rios were also great indoors

federer express
04-16-2005, 08:31 PM
:confused: :haha:

What has he done on carpet? There are better players. Safin, Henman are two. I would like to see rusedski indoors on carpet against federer. He has won paris and beaten the indoor master sampras.

Enqvist and Rios were also great indoors

what has he done on carpet? knew someone would ask that. so you are saying you think safin is the best carpet player? safin is not consistently the best on any sutface. and if you are not joking about henman and rusedski then i'm concerned!
am talking about who is the best on these surfaces now. for me federer would be dominant on it. as highlighted by your inability to name a serious challenger to him on the surface. since establishing himself as the clear number 1 in mens tennis how many people have beaten him on carpet? answer is none! to my knowledge he didn't play any tennis on carpet last year. but i still think he would be better than anyone else on it now!(and what do enqvist and rios have to do with the topic at hand?)

World Beater
04-16-2005, 09:05 PM
All i can say is that henman is better indoors. Just look at their matches. Federer lost to henman in rotterdam, where the surface is quick. He lost to him in basel a few years ago. Federer has lost to hewitt indoors twice. Once in the TMC way back and then at Bercy.

Federer has also lost indoors to ferrero. I mean ferrero is good, but indoors in not his favorite surface.

If winning two masters back to back indoors is not consistent, then clearly you are too demanding. Safin has consistently been the best. Look at his record over his whole career. Has federer won a single masters indoors? How can you justify he is the best when his record would say otherwise. He is good but not the best. Henman has beater federer in paris as well, might i add.

Federer needs more time to set up his shots and wont be able to use his repertoire as much. This is why henman has had success against him. Safin's other victory came against federer in moscow, on guess what?

Enqvist and rios are two guys who better records than federer, and though now they are both clearly not at their prime (rios is retired) are examples of players who have had much more success than federer indoors. Currently they might not be better, but over the careers they have been better. I expect federer to change that though.

World Beater
04-16-2005, 09:10 PM
Dont laugh at rusedski. You are skating on thin ice, if you think beating sampras in Bercy is an easy feat. For me sampras was the best indoors along with becker.

You have no evidence to suggest federer is better than the players i mentioned indoors. Use some stats to back up your post, before you make conclusions.

federer express
04-17-2005, 01:51 AM
All i can say is that henman is better indoors. Just look at their matches. Federer lost to henman in rotterdam, where the surface is quick. He lost to him in basel a few years ago. Federer has lost to hewitt indoors twice. Once in the TMC way back and then at Bercy.

Federer has also lost indoors to ferrero. I mean ferrero is good, but indoors in not his favorite surface.

If winning two masters back to back indoors is not consistent, then clearly you are too demanding. Safin has consistently been the best. Look at his record over his whole career. Has federer won a single masters indoors? How can you justify he is the best when his record would say otherwise. He is good but not the best. Henman has beater federer in paris as well, might i add.

Federer needs more time to set up his shots and wont be able to use his repertoire as much. This is why henman has had success against him. Safin's other victory came against federer in moscow, on guess what?

Enqvist and rios are two guys who better records than federer, and though now they are both clearly not at their prime (rios is retired) are examples of players who have had much more success than federer indoors. Currently they might not be better, but over the careers they have been better. I expect federer to change that though.

the wins against federer that u speak of are not that recent. i am saying who is best on carpet now in my opinion. at this moment it has to be federer for me. ferrero has more pedigree on clay than anyone else playing right now, but coria, nadal and gaudio are all above him at present! results years ago aren't that relevant. if henman didn't get his butt kicked every time he played federer now i might see your point. but if they played on carpet tomorrow and then the next day and the next, the results would be the same every time in my opinion. easy wins for federer!

federer express
04-17-2005, 01:54 AM
Dont laugh at rusedski. You are skating on thin ice, if you think beating sampras in Bercy is an easy feat. For me sampras was the best indoors along with becker.

You have no evidence to suggest federer is better than the players i mentioned indoors. Use some stats to back up your post, before you make conclusions.

again what are you talking about? the question is who is best on the surface now. now..... not seven years ago. if you are trying to put rusedski anywhere near federer's standard on any surface, then you haven't been watching the same federer the rest of us have!

Federerhingis
04-17-2005, 02:34 AM
again what are you talking about? the question is who is best on the surface now. now..... not seven years ago. if you are trying to put rusedski anywhere near federer's standard on any surface, then you haven't been watching the same federer the rest of us have!

Exactly! I mean World Beater may have brought in a few good points, however his arguments seem a bit outdated. Federer was yet to become the dominant force he became post Rotterdam and he didnt get a chance to prove himself on carpet last year, so making an argument at this point is rather pointless. Besides those losses to Hewitt were when he was the clear favorite in 02, and hes made qfs and semis at both Paris indoors and Madrid indoors when he was still a head case. Tell me what a confindent top player could do now with his game abilities and on a mission, if being a head case got him to quarterfinals, what can determination and confidence do to him. One other small point those losses at Basel are rather mute because he simply has never played his best infront of his home crowd, too too much pressure and he was still a head case anyways then.

federer express
04-17-2005, 02:36 AM
Exactly! I mean World Beater may have brought in a few good points, however his arguments seem a bit outdated. Federer was yet to become the dominant force he became post Rotterdam and he didnt get a chance to prove himself on carpet last year, so making an argument at this point is rather pointless. Besides those losses to Hewitt were when he was the clear favorite in 02, and hes made qfs and semis at both Paris indoors and Madrid indoors when he was still a head case. Tell me what a confindent top player could do now with his game abilities and on a mission, if being a head case got him to quarterfinals, what can determination and confidence do to him. One other small point those losses at Basel are rather mute because he simply has never played his best infront of his home crowd, too too much pressure and he was still a head case anyways then.

not sure common sense will work on someone mentioning rusedski as the best player on carpet today! but good effort ;)

Fedex
04-17-2005, 04:01 AM
can federer really be called the best on clay when he hasn't been past the qf stage of roland garros yet??
After yesterdays loss, anyone who thinks this is clearly delusional. He was exposed; He has many weaknesses on clay that he will need to work on.

tennischick
04-17-2005, 04:14 AM
After yesterdays loss, anyone who thinks this is clearly delusional. He was exposed; He has many weaknesses on clay that he will need to work on.
i disagree. i think he's just tired and needs to rest. winning most (minus 2) of your matches since the year started does that to a guy. all Fed needs is some rest, consultation with his physiotherapst, a good massage, some sweet loving from his woman, and time with his coach Tony Roche. and he's be good to go. ;)

Fedex
04-17-2005, 04:50 AM
This loss should only make him more hungary. I actually wouldent mind if he lost at one of the other clay masters as well.

World Beater
04-17-2005, 05:05 AM
Yes, Henman has played federer outdoors, and it is your opinion that the results will transfer indoors. You have no evidence though. At least i am backing my points with results that have happened within the last year. Federer's game indoors i dont think can improve a great deal, unless he improves his serve-volley game.

Its a known fact that henman plays everyone tough indoors, save for hewitt. You can have as many opinions as you want, but if you dont have some stats, then clearly you have no grounds. Results dont necessarily transfer from surface to surface. Henman is a much different player indoors. If Federer beats henman, the next time they play indoors, then you may have some evidence. But right now you dont.

Safin would give federer a good match indoors. He beat him outdoors, and Safin has more of an advantage indoors. Dont talk abt consistency, there are only two tournaments that matter and Safin owns both of them.

In case your forgot, Rusedski still has one of the best serves on the game. He may not beat federer now, but his game would give federer a lot of trouble.

Please dont talk abt common sense. I never mentioned rusedski as the best carpet player, you should learn to read before you make presumptuous posts. I said i would like to see rusedski against federer indoors, because i would like to see federer deal with the attacking game on a quick surface. That has caused him much trouble in the past.

Federerhingis
04-17-2005, 06:12 AM
Yes, Henman has played federer outdoors, and it is your opinion that the results will transfer indoors. You have no evidence though. At least i am backing my points with results that have happened within the last year. Federer's game indoors i dont think can improve a great deal, unless he improves his serve-volley game.

Its a known fact that henman plays everyone tough indoors, save for hewitt. You can have as many opinions as you want, but if you dont have some stats, then clearly you have no grounds. Results dont necessarily transfer from surface to surface. Henman is a much different player indoors. If Federer beats henman, the next time they play indoors, then you may have some evidence. But right now you dont.

Safin would give federer a good match indoors. He beat him outdoors, and Safin has more of an advantage indoors. Dont talk abt consistency, there are only two tournaments that matter and Safin owns both of them.

In case your forgot, Rusedski still has one of the best serves on the game. He may not beat federer now, but his game would give federer a lot of trouble.

Please dont talk abt common sense. I never mentioned rusedski as the best carpet player, you should learn to read before you make presumptuous posts. I said i would like to see rusedski against federer indoors, because i would like to see federer deal with the attacking game on a quick surface. That has caused him much trouble in the past.

I guess you might be right, and I hope they do meet on carpet quite a few times to assess where they stand this season. However unfortunately for Henman theres no grandslam held on indoor carpet courts.

federer express
04-17-2005, 11:30 AM
I guess you might be right, and I hope they do meet on carpet quite a few times to assess where they stand this season. However unfortunately for Henman theres no grandslam held on indoor carpet courts.

henman would gete his ass kicked by federer indoors now. as would rusedski. and yes even the great enqvist!
to worldbeater:henamn beat federer on carpet once in 2003 before federer was nearly the force he is now. but yes...that clearly makes henman the better player on the surface. and out of interest what are the only two tournaments that matter? are you referring to carpet events from last year? and if so maybe you could remind me how many of those tournaments federer bothered to enter! and yes, of course federer is going to be rubbish on carpet because being the most talented and having probably the best hands in the game, like you say he wont be able to cope with the speed of the surface!! :rolleyes: will remind you of all this at the end of the year!

federer express
04-17-2005, 11:39 AM
and as you are so keen on your results to back things up lets actually look at the great henman recently on carpet shall we? straight set losses to the great novak and youzhny! wow please henman forgive me for doubting you as the best on the surface! :bowdown: very impressive results! or maybe world beater you think those from 2003 and 98 (in the case of rusedski) are more relevant. good point you have there! :bs:

federer express
04-17-2005, 11:55 AM
and safin on carpet last year?

lost to llodra :)

but then he beat everyone in sight....
lopez
koubek
horna

:bowdown: for those wins

agassi (yes....a good hard match)
nalbandian (the master of playing finals!)

and then...
ljubicic (barely)
melzer
hewitt (just back after a decent break from tennis and kim!)the carpet great
canas
stepanek

mmmm....again, you're right. how could federer match those results?? :rolleyes:

Action Jackson
04-17-2005, 12:03 PM
not sure common sense will work on someone mentioning rusedski as the best player on carpet today! but good effort ;)

:yeah:

JeNn
04-17-2005, 12:25 PM
Personally I think Federer is crap on all surfaces.

World Beater
04-17-2005, 03:36 PM
henman would gete his ass kicked by federer indoors now. as would rusedski. and yes even the great enqvist!
to worldbeater:henamn beat federer on carpet once in 2003 before federer was nearly the force he is now. but yes...that clearly makes henman the better player on the surface. and out of interest what are the only two tournaments that matter? are you referring to carpet events from last year? and if so maybe you could remind me how many of those tournaments federer bothered to enter! and yes, of course federer is going to be rubbish on carpet because being the most talented and having probably the best hands in the game, like you say he wont be able to cope with the speed of the surface!! :rolleyes: will remind you of all this at the end of the year!

I never said federer was rubbish. I clearly stated as per facts that henman right now has performed better than federer on carpet. You can speculate all you want, and you may be right. As i said in my post, until federer wins , you have no evidence.

There are two tournaments that matter on carpet! Must i spell everything out to you? Just because federer didnt enter doesnt deprive Safin the respect he deserves on the surface. Go read some of his interviews, he has trouble coping with surfaces, where the ball flies too much. He hits the ball with spin and is not as effective on carpet. Federer is one of the best on carpet, just because he has great skills. But is he the best? I disagree.Keep spewing your garbage on federer, when he is yet to do anything on the surface.

If you want to rub it in my face at the end of the year, go ahead. But maybe if you knew your abc's, you would realize i said i would give federer's his due if he did manage to win on carpet, which i fully expect him to.

federer express
04-17-2005, 03:37 PM
and safin on carpet last year?

lost to llodra :)

but then he beat everyone in sight....
lopez
koubek
horna

:bowdown: for those wins

agassi (yes....a good hard match)
nalbandian (the master of playing finals!)

and then...
ljubicic (barely)
melzer
hewitt (just back after a decent break from tennis and kim!)the carpet great
canas
stepanek

mmmm....again, you're right. how could federer match those results?? :rolleyes:

am happy to give safin the respect due for the above wins. just in my opinion those wins dont warrant that much! (with the exception of the ljubicic and agassi matches)

World Beater
04-17-2005, 03:46 PM
and safin on carpet last year?

lost to llodra :)

but then he beat everyone in sight....
lopez
koubek
horna

:bowdown: for those wins

agassi (yes....a good hard match)
nalbandian (the master of playing finals!)

and then...
ljubicic (barely)
melzer
hewitt (just back after a decent break from tennis and kim!)the carpet great
canas
stepanek

mmmm....again, you're right. how could federer match those results?? :rolleyes:

You cant read your own question can you? You said current, not who will be the best, or who is probably the best carpet player.

Federer will match those results, if he gets a draw like that. But i answered the question who is the best currently. Until Federer wins, its not current, is it? When federer wins at the end of the year, then you will be able to say he is the best. But speculation isnt the answer to who is the best.

Learn to be calm down the tone of your post, if you cant have a discussion without making snide insults, the clearly you have a problem

Once again, I mentioned Enqvist as someone who had a good record, is he done? Yes! but currently he has accomplished more on the surface. If we put them both on carpet, right now, federer would win. But that is speculation. Federer doesnt win every single match he is supposed to. He could lose, but maybe you dont realize that.

Would federer probably win, yes. But the question is current, therefore, I take into account accomplishments on the surface and dont throw around some opinions.

I like roger's game, but im not as obesessed and infatuated as you seem to be.

YoursTruly
04-17-2005, 03:50 PM
I think Roger will win the French Open. Hopefully this year, but a guy like him with his natural talent and ability, he will win at least one French Open.

World Beater
04-17-2005, 03:51 PM
am happy to give safin the respect due for the above wins. just in my opinion those wins dont warrant that much! (with the exception of the ljubicic and agassi matches)

If this thread is about speculation about who is the best, then i apologize. As I clearly misunderstood.

Agassi won RG with a powder-puff draw. But everyone still gives him his due as the best all courter the last decade or so, why?

federer express
04-17-2005, 04:05 PM
You cant read your own question can you? You said current, not who will be the best, or who is probably the best carpet player.

Federer will match those results, if he gets a draw like that. But i answered the question who is the best currently. Until Federer wins, its not current, is it? When federer wins at the end of the year, then you will be able to say he is the best. But speculation isnt the answer to who is the best.

Learn to be calm down the tone of your post, if you cant have a discussion without making snide insults, the clearly you have a problem

Once again, I mentioned Enqvist as someone who had a good record, is he done? Yes! but currently he has accomplished more on the surface. If we put them both on carpet, right now, federer would win. But that is speculation. Federer doesnt win every single match he is supposed to. He could lose, but maybe you dont realize that.

Would federer probably win, yes. But the question is current, therefore, I take into account accomplishments on the surface and dont throw around some opinions.

I like roger's game, but im not as obesessed and infatuated as you seem to be.

you keep missing the point unsurprisingly! if you go back to the relevant post i was stating who i felt is presently the best on each surface. so for that reason i am not overly concerned with what federer did 2 years ago on carpet when he was only 80% the player he is today. has he dominated yet on carpet? no! will he...i think so, which is why i say he would be the best on it right now. and i never said federer wins every match. and again...agassi has achieved more on clay than nadal. but is it speculation to say that nadal is the better claycourter at present. NO! anyway, am done discussing this with you as your inability to recognise a simple point is tiring! (and boring now)

World Beater
04-17-2005, 04:52 PM
when he was only 80% the player he is today. has he dominated yet on carpet? no! will he...i think so, which is why i say he would be the best on it right now.

This i agree with. It took you several posts to say what you needed to in three sentences.

You said you "think" he would dominate. But I would suggest that Safin might be possibly better, and I would think henman would give him a good challenge. Until then, I am not convinced he is the best. He is one of the best, no doubt. But for me until he proves otherwise, i wont be ready to crown him king of carpet.

federer express
04-17-2005, 04:56 PM
This i agree with. It took you several posts to say what you needed to in three sentences.

You said you "think" he would dominate. But I would suggest that Safin might be possibly better, and I would think henman would give him a good challenge. Until then, I am not convinced he is the best. He is one of the best, no doubt. But for me until he proves otherwise, i wont be ready to crown him king of carpet.

fair enough ;)

Federerhingis
04-18-2005, 02:02 AM
henman would gete his ass kicked by federer indoors now. as would rusedski. and yes even the great enqvist!
to worldbeater:henamn beat federer on carpet once in 2003 before federer was nearly the force he is now. but yes...that clearly makes henman the better player on the surface. and out of interest what are the only two tournaments that matter? are you referring to carpet events from last year? and if so maybe you could remind me how many of those tournaments federer bothered to enter! and yes, of course federer is going to be rubbish on carpet because being the most talented and having probably the best hands in the game, like you say he wont be able to cope with the speed of the surface!! :rolleyes: will remind you of all this at the end of the year!


Is this in response to my post? Firstly I never said that Henman would woop Federers ass even on carpet, thats why I actually want them to meet on Carpet so Federer can show this mr World Beater he aint losing to Henman unless his game is way off his usual level. Federer is no longer afraid of Henmans attacking style, he can very well counteract it with his amazing forehand and all court style, besides Henmans serve can be easy picking for Federer when his game is on full gear. Its very silly of World Beater to suggest that Henman is going to beat Federer on carpet just because he did it once last year in Rotterdam, where Federer was obviously not playing at his best and he had yet to develop his awesome form. Federers losses from 02 are almost useless when trying to predict his H2H versus a player, if that were the case he should be losing to Hewitt all the time and look at their H2H, its 7-0 or is it 8-0? for their past seven or eight meetings including that double bagel at last years open.

federer express
04-18-2005, 02:22 AM
Is this in response to my post?

nope...
was talking to world beater there :p

DanEd
04-18-2005, 03:31 AM
on grass: he is the best
on hard: he is the best
on carpet: not sure (the two last years I think he´d not played very much on this surface so he need to be tested)
on clay: he is not the best.

Federerhingis
04-18-2005, 04:03 AM
nope...
was talking to world beater there :p

COOL! :wavey:

World Beater
04-18-2005, 05:58 AM
LOL...you guys are hilarous

Personally, I would like to see Federer kick's henman's ass too, and Safin and prove to everyone once and for all he is the best on carpet. I dont doubt that federer will beat henman at some pt, and i hope he will.

I am a federer fan and surely, you cannot fault me for being trying to be objective about federer. I am not going to go "gaga" on his superiority on carpet just yet. I would like to see him do it.

I dont even like henman that much, or rusedski or safin, lol

Federerhingis: Federer did beat hewitt at the AUS open before he played henman.That for me was the harbinger of hewitts many losses to federer. He overcame his demons at the same place where they initially came to haunt him. Its not correct to use excuses like federer did not play his best against henman. Surely, henman had something to do with it. Federer is a better player, nobody disputes it, but on that day henman was better. Give henman some respect, as he rarely gets it these days.

World Beater
04-18-2005, 06:01 AM
on carpet: not sure (the two last years I think he´d not played very much on this surface so he need to be tested)
.

Thank you.

This is the essence of my point. :)

federer express
04-18-2005, 12:59 PM
Thank you.

This is the essence of my point. :)

yes. i think ultimately we have pretty similar views on this. just expressed them quite differently.

Federerhingis
04-18-2005, 06:47 PM
LOL...you guys are hilarous

Personally, I would like to see Federer kick's henman's ass too, and Safin and prove to everyone once and for all he is the best on carpet. I dont doubt that federer will beat henman at some pt, and i hope he will.

I am a federer fan and surely, you cannot fault me for being trying to be objective about federer. I am not going to go "gaga" on his superiority on carpet just yet. I would like to see him do it.

I dont even like henman that much, or rusedski or safin, lol

Federerhingis: Federer did beat hewitt at the AUS open before he played henman.That for me was the harbinger of hewitts many losses to federer. He overcame his demons at the same place where they initially came to haunt him. Its not correct to use excuses like federer did not play his best against henman. Surely, henman had something to do with it. Federer is a better player, nobody disputes it, but on that day henman was better. Give henman some respect, as he rarely gets it these days.

I never meant or gave any indications of disrespecting Henman, all I said was that I doubt that even on Carpet Henman would find difficulties in beating an in form Federer. I certainly appreciate Henmans game, hes the only consistent decent volleyer left on the ATP, Federer is decent on his good days but Henman was built to play serve and volley and is so natural at net.